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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
 Thu Jan 29, 2004 8:02 am
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One of the strong points of the party in question is its impeccable record against anti-Semitism, from before the Nazi period to the present day. |
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Boomer Chick
Joined: 01 Sep 2003
Posts: 407
Location: Colorado |
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Thu Jan 29, 2004 9:29 pm
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After reading the article and your prediction, I agree with you that this party seems to be the hope for peace and social causes in Europe. It would also be the party that seeks to preserve environmental purity and through that channel of activism might indeed be the first party to address chemical aerosol spraying.
Nice to know that in principle and platform many here in America believe in the same tenets as the party you reference.
Thanks for this, halva!
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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
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Fri Jan 30, 2004 5:30 am
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One of the Greeks who participated in the meeting that founded this would-be pan-European party in Berlin in early January this year is listed to speak at a public meeting next month on Climatic Change and Chemtrails/Geoengineering. He is concerned about the prospects for success of the Treaty of Kyoto.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by halva on 01-29-2004] |
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shatoga
Joined: 23 Nov 2002
Posts: 1291
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Sat Jan 31, 2004 1:33 pm
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I disagree with them.
Capitalism itself is not evil.
1 Timothy 6:10
"For THE LOVE OF MONEY is the root of all evil"
It is the unrestrained robber baron brand of capitalism that is evil.
With sufficient government oversight, free market capitalism is among the best systems possible (IMHO)
Unions representing workers can be the necessary check and balance to the power of the wealthy.
Union pensions can agument Social Security,
union's Health Care can negate the need for medicaid and medicare.
Government regulators keeping down corruption on all sides...
keeping union officials from dipping into the till
and keeping corrupt (ken lay) executives from plundering employees contributions.
of course that begs the question:
"who's watching the watchers?"
As the Bush Administration so blatently proves;
Regulators, who have sold their souls to the highest bidder, do not regulate, they facilitate.
As America's FDA, USDA, DOE, FTC, FBI, and EPA function today like the 1930's Chicago cop who ignored murders but made sure Al Capone always had a parking space.
Some pray that mad cow steaks be served at every Bush fund raising dinner.
(while that might eliminate a significant portion of the truely evil people from our world, I do not wish ill on those cows)
[Edited 1 times, lastly by shatoga on 01-31-2004] |
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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
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Sat Jan 31, 2004 2:11 pm
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Well, we're talking about parties that are going to take up the chemtrails/geoengineering issue. I judge that the party I mentioned is the most likely to start the ball rolling in Europe. Is there any similar candidate in the U.S.. pro-capitalist, anti-capitalist or whatever?
The German PDS, which is the core of this new would-be European party, has gone through many transformations. When the Communists took over in post-war East Germany, they absorbed the Social Democrats to become the Socialist Unity party. When East Germany began to collapse they Gorbachevised themselves and became the PDS. They are pragmatists and realpolitiker. They try to sense which way the wind is blowing and adapt. They talk about socialism the way American Republicans talk about the United States constitution and U.S. national sovereignty, i.e. a subject for ceremonial speeches.
They are a survivors' party. But they are firm on one thing, and that is opposition to racism in general and anti-Semitism in particular.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by halva on 01-31-2004] |
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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
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Sun Feb 01, 2004 7:35 am
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My article 'Strategies against Climate Change' has been published in 'Spectre', the European-Parliament-based webmagazine involved in establishing the new pan-European political party that is the subject of this thread. The magazine invites comments and more information.
http://www.spectrezine.org/global/Hall.htm
[Edited 1 times, lastly by halva on 02-01-2004] |
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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
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Wed Feb 04, 2004 2:49 pm
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Anyone who has checked out Spectre http://www.spectrezine.org
will notice that there is an article on the Czech Communist Party's opposition to the establishment of an all-European party 'of the Left' (to use this traditional terminology).
http://www.spectrezine.org/europe/CPBM.htm
The Greek Communists (but not the reformed 'ex-Communist' Synaspismos) have similar objections to an all-European party.
This debate is not at all irrelevant to Americans, because it is the exact counterpart of arguments in the United States over the powers of the Federal Government versus 'states rights'.
The established political parties in the United States, Democrats and Republicans, are federally organized. One cannot (as far as I know) stand as a Democrat in one's own state and a Republican in Washington, or vice versa, or at least not as a permanently exercisable right involving no stigmatising as a 'turncoat', 'traitor' or whatever.
The European Union pays lip service to something it calls 'subsidiarity', defined as "the principle whereby the Union does not take action (except in the areas which fall within its exclusive competence) unless it is more effective than action taken at national, regional or local level."...."The subsidiarity principle is intended to ensure that decisions are taken as closely as possible to the citizen and that constant checks are made as to whether action at Community level is justified in the light of the possibilities available at national, regional or local level."
Presumably, under the subsidiarity principle, a national party wishing to affiliate to a pan-European party should not be obliged to be affiliated with the same party at the national and local level as well.
If this subsidiarity principle were respected, it is conceivable that that Greek Communist Party could become a member of the all-European Party of the Left, along with Greece's Synaspismos. However it is absolutely inconceivable that Greece's two Communist and/or ex-Communist parties could ever become one party in Greek national politics.
Without real respect for the subsidiarity principle in political party formation the European Union will never be able to become a nation in the way that the United States has. A stable two-party system, like the American Republican-Democrat system, will not be able to develop.
Yet some such system is necessary if the
European Union is to acquire popular legitimacy and thus power.
The model which Europe's present-day rulers are trying to impose on Europe's populations, despite lip service to subsidiarity, is far closer to the Western European centralizing and bureaucratic traditions of the Catholic Church than it is to the decentralizing traditions of local autonomy favoured by Eastern Orthodox Christianity.
But the Eastern model is more feasible and viable for a new self-determining Europe than the Western model is. It is also (by the way) a model closer to popular American conceptions of local autonomy and opposition to 'big government'.
Much may well depend on whether the would-be pan-European party so bravely sketched out in Berlin a few weeks will opt for the Eastern Orthodox (and Protestant American?) model of local autonomy or for the centralized and bureaucratic model of the Catholic West.
[Edited 3 times, lastly by halva on 02-04-2004] |
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Wolf_Larson
Joined: 08 Aug 2003
Posts: 442
Location: The Sea |
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Wed Feb 04, 2004 10:57 pm
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SPECTRE - the Special Executive for Counterintelligence, Terrorism, Revenge and Extortion
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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
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Fri Feb 06, 2004 5:11 pm
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Wolf_Larson
Joined: 08 Aug 2003
Posts: 442
Location: The Sea |
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Sat Feb 07, 2004 3:38 am
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quote:
Originally posted by halva:
That's where the socialists will wind up, for sure. |
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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
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Wed Feb 11, 2004 2:50 pm
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The best candidate so far for the British component of this would-be pan-European party is called the Respect Coalition:
http://www.respectcoalition.org/
It is given a somewhat ironical treatment in this account:
http://www.indycymru.org.uk/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=474
The lack of seriousness of the Respect Coalition has led to one of its potential leaders, George Monbiot, distancing himself from it. The British Greens are also cool about having to compete for votes with the Respect Coalition.
The Respect Coalition should be urged to take up the climate change/geoengineering/chemtrails issue.
If they do this, they will pull the rug from under any possible criticism from the Greens.
I have e-mailed the Respect Coalition urging them to pay attention to chemtrails. For background I have cited my article in the Europarliament-based webmagazine Spectre:
http://www.spectrezine.org/global/Hall.htm
Rense has also run it:
http://rense.com/general49/change.htm
I urge them to adopt the theses of ATTAC-Hellas on geoengineering:
http://www.attac-hellas.org/seminars/geoengineering/programmeenglish.htm
Perhaps some Americans can start telling the Respect Coalition to wake up to chemtrails if they want to become a force to be reckoned with in Britain and Europe and to disarm the self-righteous Greens.
Of course, all this is "Left" politics and may not be to the taste of some Conservative Americans.
Patience. We are working on getting a "right-wing" equivalent on the road.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by halva on 02-11-2004] |
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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
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Sun Feb 15, 2004 2:11 pm
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At the press conference in Athens today to announce the proposed creation of the new European Party of the Left, participants were notified of the ATTAC-Hellas seminar of 11th February on the subject of Climate Change and specifically on the spraying of toxic metals on a very large scale, purportedly to mitigate the effects of global warming. It was pointed out that in Greece apart from ATTAC-Hellas only extreme-right groups were trying to bring this issue to public attention, which is undesirable because they should not have a monopoly on something that is a real problem.
Lothar Bisky, head of the German Party of Democratic Socialism, was given a copy of the ATTAC-Hellas resolution in English:
http://www.attac-hellas.org/seminars/geoengineering/programmeenglish.htm
Nikos Constantopoulos, president of the Greek Synaspismos party,
http://www.synaspismos.gr
said publicly that consideration would be given to the ATTAC-Hellas resolution if it were submitted to the founding conference of the new party of the European Left.
The head of Synaspismos' international relations department, Panos Trigazis, took part in the ATTAC-Hellas seminar.
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halva
Joined: 04 Apr 2003
Posts: 511
Location: Greece |
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Sun Feb 15, 2004 4:02 pm
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They will probably start paying attention if the Synaspismos gets involved in a big way. The Synaspismos and they would be more or less already communicating with each other, since they have the same icons (Chomsky, etc. etc.)
If we have some really big news, we'll check them out.
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