|
|
canex
Joined: 26 Oct 2000
Posts: 164
Location: USA |
To sorethroat
 Tue Feb 26, 2002 5:32 am
|
 |
|
Having been booted from Carnicom's anything-but-the-truth board, your reply has to be on a more open board. Oaklnad had some longlasting contrails because the atmosphere between 200 and 250 mb (35,000ft - 40,000ft) was moist enough. Check out the RUC-2 sounding at 16 or 17 UTC, Feb 25th over Oakland (that's 8 or 9AM in California). The dewpoint depression is ~7.5C. Because of the dry bias in all upper atmospheric soundings (the moisture sensors do not measure the true amount of water vapor for temperaures below -35C resulting in an underestimate of relative humidity), this reading indicates enough moisture for contrails at -55C. Your soundings from MAPS are drier, further evidence of how bad the humidity readings are for the upper atmosphere. Additionally, the RUCS and the MAPS are actually model results that interpolate the measurements taken at 00 UTC and 12 UTC to the hour of interest. Furthermore, the twice-per-day ballon measurements for Oakland start at the surface and end way up in the atmosphere. On the way up, the balloon typically rides the winds so that it may be as much as 60 miles from Oakland by the time it measures the humidity at 35,000 ft. That's about as elementary as it gets.
Your humble servant |
| |
|
|
Duncan Kunz
Joined: 19 Oct 2000
Posts: 582
|
|
Fri Mar 01, 2002 3:46 pm
|
|
|
Deb, you shouldn't be surprised. Those questions are not for Pat; they are rhetorical questions and nothing more. Take a look at some snatches of posts culled from that same thread:
"i waze just trying my hardest to be as obsqure as himler minnus ... I guess it's just too painful for a scientist to actually utter the words 'the data's wrong'....They can land a man on the moon, but they can't create an accurate model of basic atmospheric conditions? The hell with that....Of course were [sic] being told not to trust actual emperical [sic] data. Interesting who's saying that. The same same [sic] people who are demanding that we produce data to prove our point. It seems they can't swallow, or explain, what they have asked for. Not surprising...just disgusting! "
'Pat Minnis is a Nazi' is a typical response; that pretty much sums the level of discourse over there. But look at some of the others: 'The data's wrong' shows a complete misunderstanding of science. Data is never wrong. Data is never right. Data is data. It is the interpretation or conclusions that are right or wrong. Trying to defend against a comment like that is like trying to reason with a person who's angry because you, as a scientist, can't say whether the statement "2 plus X equals 4" if the guy won't tell you what "X" is!
And look at the next statement: "They can land a man on the moon, but they can't create an accurate model of basic atmospheric conditions?" DUH! There's a ever-so-slight difference between the complexities of Newtonian mechanics and a chaos-theory modeling. There is no such thing as "basic atmospheric conditions"! One single forty-acre plowed field out on the county road can maybe cause a localized thermal delta which can maybe cause a localized wind-shear nine thousand meters up - or maybe it won't.
And that is one of the major differences between this board and the carney-board. At least you can discuss science here! Have you ever considered why carney has systematically banned everyone with a science, engineering, or aviation background from his fiefdom?
------------------
Duncan Kunz / duncankunz@cox.net
Mesa AZ / 480-891-2525
[Edited 2 times, lastly by Duncan Kunz on 03-01-2002] |
| |
|
|
Deb
Joined: 04 Oct 2001
Posts: 163
Location: Plainfield, Indiana USA |
|
Fri Mar 01, 2002 6:10 pm
|
|
|
>>>"Have you ever considered why carney has systematically banned everyone with a science, engineering, or aviation background from his fiefdom?<<<
Let me comtemplate that one. I'll get back to you.
|
| |
|
|
Chem11
Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
|
|
Sat Mar 02, 2002 5:22 am
|
|
|
To the Esteemed 'Mr.' Kunz,
Are you a professional liar or just a mere hobbyist?
quote:
'Pat Minnis is a Nazi' is a typical response.
That's odd. I've read that thread repeatedly, yet I don't see this statement anywhere. You've even enclosed it in quotes.
quote:
Data is never wrong.
This is the most absurd thing I've yet seen posted by someone who makes it their business to dwell in absurdity. Said absurdity is self-evident enough so that I'm going to stay focused on your, erm, 'misrepresentations' for the moment.I also stated that I had no reason to believe that the data was wrong (assuming that such a thing is possible in your peculiar version of reality). A rather convenient omission on your part.
Equally convenient is your splicing together of three separate posters' comments under one set of quotes. I've never seen that done before. You must be some kind of pioneer, huh?
quote:
Have you ever considered why carney has systematically banned everyone with a science, engineering, or aviation background from his fiefdom?
This is complete nonsense and you know it. There are several people on that board with backgrounds in science, engineering and aviation. I am quite sure you are aware of this. You simply made the choice to intentionally spread disinformation.
I didn't link to this thread so that people on that forum would be subjected to this level of transparent $#@#!. I don't link to the hoaxers board for the same reason.
Be assured, I won't make the same mistake twice.
I was quite sincere when I said that I hoped NASA contrail research would be better funded (another curious omission on your part, and the thrust of my argument regarding moon landings vs. atmospheric modeling).
I suspect that your removal from various forums has more to do with your 'contributions' than any expertise in aeronautical engineering. But I guess if I need to find any more pearls of wisdom like "data is never wrong", then I'll know where to look.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by Chem11 on 03-01-2002] |
| |
|
|
mark sky
Joined: 14 Oct 2000
Posts: 3616
Location: SW coast of Oregon |
|
Sat Mar 02, 2002 5:44 am
|
|
|
hey thanks Chem11
i have not been so up to speed
chester the molester remembrance daze and all
duncan, REALLY, !
you don't need to be so "NiCe"
why don't you relax and be you real self |
| |
|
|
defender
Joined: 27 Oct 2000
Posts: 1113
Location: Level 64 |
|
Sat Mar 02, 2002 5:50 am
|
|
|
 .... I mean, LOL! I wish I could use the 'thumbs up' icon and the 'Chemtrail X' icon at the same time!
[Edited 1 times, lastly by defender on 03-04-2002] |
| |
|
|
theseeker
Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim |
|
Sat Mar 02, 2002 5:58 am
|
|
|
That's odd. I've read that thread repeatedly, yet I don't see this statement anywhere. You've even enclosed it in quotes.
try mark sky's post you dolt..."i waze just trying my hardest to be as obsqure as himler minnus"
another example of chemm11 ignoring the obvious....
and is sore throat still alive ??? I would have figured he passed considering the large amounts pathogens he claims are being sprayed on him...(daily for 3+ years)...
btw, Dr. Minnis is a damn nice guy !
------------------
T/S
[Edited 1 times, lastly by theseeker on 03-01-2002] |
| |
|
|
Chem11
Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
|
|
Sat Mar 02, 2002 7:07 am
|
|
|
I ignore obvious people, chief. It's one of my faults, admittedly. Nothing personal, Greg.
If you're going to enclose something in quotes, it shouldn't be radicaly paraphrased. That you would defend this practice is unsurprising. You've done it in the not-so-distant past yourself.
I raised hell and, equally unsurprisingly, it hasn't happened since.
Which brings us to Mr. Kunz.
If the special interest group on this board is going to get in habit of routinely quoting my posts, they better be my words. And mine alone. Not paraphrased or thrown into some late-night infomercial word blender.
That copy & paste function you super-genius avianoics, atmospheric science and military applications experts seem to have somehow overlooked is a real-time saver.
Three debunkers here and not a one has addressed the skew-t plots that are currently displayed on the thread in question. Funny that.
Nothing new there, I saw it happen a dozen times in the Zone. Just post that jpeg of the cat giving me the finger and lets be done with it.
|
| |
|
|
theseeker
Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim |
|
Sat Mar 02, 2002 8:12 am
|
|
|
If you're going to enclose something in quotes, it shouldn't be radicaly paraphrased. That you would defend this practice is unsurprising. You've done it in the not-so-distant past yourself.
I raised hell and, equally unsurprisingly, it hasn't happened since.
that too cryptic for me...(raising hands to the air)
Three debunkers here and not a one has addressed the skew-t plots that are currently displayed on the thread in question. Funny that.
no...the most qualified person (canex) answered it....
Throat does not want an answer from the good doctor....and as jay said he would be 3/4 the way through a BA in meteorology by now...hell...so would I !!!...chem, he wants to fan the fire, draw attention...if he really wanted an answer regarding the skew-t all he had to do was e-mail Dr. Minnis, and I'm sure after all these years he would have replied...
Just post that jpeg of the cat giving me the finger and lets be done with it.
That is a good one...and don't tempt me...I'm going through a character change right now due to the full moon...it's very stressful....
------------------
T/S |
| |
|
|
Deb
Joined: 04 Oct 2001
Posts: 163
Location: Plainfield, Indiana USA |
|
Sat Mar 02, 2002 11:53 am
|
|
|
"Three debunkers here and not a one has addressed the skew-t plots that are currently displayed on the thread in question. Funny that."
I've addressed it; I guess you missed it.
http://cdebsjournal.topcities.com/RHaltitude.htm
Ditto: Dr. Minnis IS a darn nice guy. I never dreamed someone like him would take the time for a housewife from Indiana. He gave me my "sea legs" to ask questions of real scientists.
>>>"There are several people on that board with backgrounds in science, engineering and aviation. I am quite sure you are aware of this. You simply made the choice to intentionally spread disinformation."<<<
The only people on that board who have not been banned yet who are professionals in any of the above are the pilots/military. "A background in" or a degree does not mean they have spent their life's career on their choice of previous study. I don't think they would want me to publish dates, degrees or professional/career experience, something Duncan Kunz has been very upfront about. It seems to me people who hide behind monikers make the loudest and most ludicrous accusations.
|
| |
|
|
hitech_46253
Joined: 16 May 2001
Posts: 499
Location: Indianapolis, IN U.S. |
|
Mon Mar 04, 2002 8:06 pm
|
|
|
Standard Deb Disclaimer:
Deb Phalen is a frustrated housewife in Plainfield IN. She changed her views on 'CHEMTRAILS' just after reporting a car in her driveway with blacked out windows. She herself felt this was a FED trying to disuade her from reporting on Carnicom's website. Since this incident, she has consistently denied anything or any EVIDENCE that would verify government spraying programs. Even though the government has ADMITTED several programs involving Weather Modification, Chem/Bio experimentation, Barium for 3D radar imaging etc. Her views are consistently pro FED, anti-militia in nature suporting our current CORRUPT PROPAGANDA. CIA has many on their payroll supporting DIS-INFORMATION. She operates more than one site spewing her B.S. My wife and I personally met with this fruit loop here in Indiana. For more info on her, you are welcome to email us at: hitech@smithville.net |
| |
|
|
defender
Joined: 27 Oct 2000
Posts: 1113
Location: Level 64 |
|
Mon Mar 04, 2002 9:09 pm
|
|
|
quote:
It seems to me people who hide behind monikers make the loudest and most ludicrous accusations.
How many monikers have you used CD/Deb, 7? 8?... when most of us are happy with one. The use of multiple handles/monikers as you've used is more comparable to a criminal like a forger, IDentity thief, who uses AKA's to mislead and misdirect the victims and authorities trying to stop them. In fact, that is exactly why some crooks try to get people to divulge their names publicly, that's how 'identity thieves' operate, but maybe you already know that!?
Ironically, the statement you've made above in quotes does describe yourself.
As we all know, revealing one's name on a public forum like on the 'net, may open you to threats and attacks from whackos and 'debunkers' who deny the existence of any conspiracy, like assassinations, chemtrails, cover-ups, govt. corruption, etc., often from the very people involved in such activites, con-artists, mis-direction specialists and various other psychotic shut-ins.
Deb aka nodebunker has used this 'hiding behind monikers' ploy more times than I can remember as an attempt to intimidate threaten, coerce anyone who uses a moniker/handle that she disagrees with. Gee, I really thought she had cleaned up her act? Just another in the bag of tricks, like her/his/it's/their incendiary remarks used to divide activists through gender, religious and political issues. The entitity known as Deb, whatever that is, has often used these tricks in the past as her method of operation. She seems to be somewhat more limited here at CC as of late?
BTW, hitech... does that mean we can use your standard reply for 'Deb' responses, like, is it part of the popular domain? I guess we can come up with our own. It sure would save time having to respond to her patented attacks/statements over and over and over again.
Also, BTW... a word of caution, the use of common first/last names does not necessarily mean that's their true name. In other words, it's not any more an indication of sincerity, honesty or anything else... it's just a name, two names that may or may not identify the person/persons making statements on forums like this.
Likewise, some of these people who like to nurse the idea they are government operatives... this is not necessarily an indication that they really are. It's just as likely that they are lonely, disturbed and possibly obsessive individuals who get a sense of gratification and importance from being the center of attention, by trying to identify themselves with an org. like CIA to inflate a fantasy image of themselves in which they actually have some control over themselves and others.
[Edited 3 times, lastly by defender on 03-04-2002] |
| |
|
|
Chem11
Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
|
|
Mon Mar 04, 2002 9:42 pm
|
|
|
Well said, Defender.
quote:
does that mean we can use your standard reply for 'Deb' responses, like, is it part of the popular domain? I guess we can come up with our own. It sure would save time having to respond to her patented attacks/statements over and over and over again.
You may be on to something here. This 'attack & distract' routine got old years ago and it seems there are very few other sensible options available. |
| |
|
|
canex
Joined: 26 Oct 2000
Posts: 164
Location: USA |
|
Tue Mar 05, 2002 3:32 am
|
|
|
It sure is nice to know one has friends even without ever meeting them. Lots of abuse has been heaped on refreshing people who seek a rational explanation for phenomena rather than assuming the worst about either the government or its employees, who BTW are citizens of the same country and abide by the same laws as everyone else on this board. If Sorethroat or any of the characters on these boards really want an explanation of contrails (chemtrails are a figment of someone's paranoia), then they should email the scientists involved in studying contrails and not seek out TV weathermen, Air Traffic Controllers, carnies, or any number of people who haven't really studied the problem. Getting a rational explanation will probably not change many minds, but it is whole lot more civilized than name calling and personal abuse.
Das ist alles meinen freunden. |
| |
|
|
 
|
|
 Goto page
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12 Next
All times are GMT. The time now is Fri May 25, 2012 12:50 am
|
|
|
|
|
Login
