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PacerLJ35
Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 456
Location: Millbrook, AL, USA |
 Wed Aug 14, 2002 1:51 am
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Ah, Columbus Alive...that very non-partisan, unbiased source of reporting. Of course I meant that as a moment of sarcasm. It appears, by the content on their site, that they very much have a political axe to grind.
First, they cut-and-paste the articles they were using as source material, but provided no way for you to read either article in their entirety, thus losing the context of those articles.
I did a search for them and couldn't come up with either. However, it does appear that the Columbus Alive writer did take the first article way out of context. This is essentially what the article said, sans the Columbus Alive wording. Words in parantheses are mine:
“Fifteen service members from military installations in Germany and England were at Ramstein Air Base, Germany, 8-12 May, learning how to use chemicals to destroy the enemy (NOTICE THEY LEFT OUT WHAT THE ARTICLE MEANS BY "ENEMY")… The seven airmen and eight soldiers learned how to plan, execute and oversee the entire process of applying pesticides by air"
Then they include the snippet “insects with their deadly diseases.”
No where in the quotations does it refer to the enemy as being human. The article could very well (and most likely) have been referring to the "insects with their deadly diseases" as the enemy.
Yet the writer very carefully insinuated that the goal of the training was sinister by adding the pretext "Skeptics who continue to insist the government would never be involved in secret aerial spraying, particularly in Ohio, may want to address their questions to the C-130 aircrews from the 910th Airlift Wing stationed at Youngstown’s Air Reserve Station". Then the writer adds his own words "The press release said the Youngstown air unit will only be used against 'insects with their deadly diseases'". The article very likely never said anything like "we're only going to spray insects, we promise". That quotation was designed to make to government look like it was hiding something.
Next, doing a long search through CNN's archives, and reading every article on the WTO Seattle protests, I could not find the report of an air unit that can deliver pathogens to infect humans. There was ONE article that mentioned the involvement of a few military personnel, but curiously it did not mention this aerial spray unit. It only mentioned the involvement of 27 Air Force special operations personnel, among other branches. The 910th is not a special operations unit, and 27 personnel is hardly enough to support and operate even one C-130 2,000 miles from its home base. The Air Force does have special operations personnel involved in ground combat operations, including special tactics teams that work with SEALs, Rangers and Delta Force.
Typical of the propagandists are the tactics of using small snippets of information, no real link to the source document so people can read it in proper context and its entirety, and the insertion of phrases designed to spin the story into a particular direction.
Sorry Chem, but you need to do better. PS, you should take up the advice in the article and talk to the 910th pilots...I'm sure they'd be more than happy to invite you over to take a look. But of course that would be real investigation, and would require you to get out of your chair and leave your shady internet articles behind. |
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Chem11
Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
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Wed Aug 14, 2002 2:49 am
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This 'shady internet article' was written by a Doctor and printed in a legitimate news magazine in Ohio.
But of course, you knew that.
Pacer.. I'm not here to dialogue with you. I did not address you nor do I make a point of reading your posts.
It's like walking down the street, talking to a pretty girl, when some deranged crackehead jumps in your face and starts spraying you with diseased mucous and demands for hard currency because his car ran out of gas... only he parked it a mile away... which is why he can't show it to you.
A debate between who has more credibility, Dr. Robert Fitrakis or lying-ass Pacer, is no debate at all. So kindly step back into the gutter and out of the way, son.
People that actually give a damn about the health and welfare of themselves and their community are attempting to have a meaningful discussion. So take a fiver, go get some 'gas' and drive back to the wrong side of the tracks.
If and when I ever feel the need to dialogue with the Flat Earth Society, I'll march myself over to the hoaxers' board and befuddle Uncle Jay until he's reduced to making idle threats of physical violence again.
After that, mincing words with third-string debunkers just isn't all that intellectually satisfying. Sorry. |
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PacerLJ35
Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 456
Location: Millbrook, AL, USA |
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Wed Aug 14, 2002 4:37 am
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Chem, your tactics are stale. You rarely ever debate points, instead you tend to rely on the "sling mud and run" method.
You seem to have no problem discrediting people who are doctors, yet disagree with your opinions. So don't sit there and tell me that because Fitrakis has the term "Doctor" in front of his name that somehow magically makes him the expert on what the 910th does.
And again, you revert to making me out to be a liar (even though I admitted to using a sketchy source with no documentation, and I apologized for it). It's getting boring, Chem. Everyone knows by now.
I have yet to sum you up as someone spraying "diseased mucous", and it's not because you're a stellar person. It's because slinging mud doesn't get anyone anywhere, except into an internet flaming contest, which I refuse to engage in with you.
The point of my post is that the author of the article took certain snips of info, and pasted them into his own words. He didn't provide any details where we could read these source documents. It's essentially a propaganda piece aimed at causing mistrust towards the military. It's obvious Fitrakis believes chemtrails are a reality. He may even have a deep hatred of the military, I don't know. But the article was hardly fair, and hardly a true representation of the truth.
Just because it's a major news media in a certain city doesn't mean it isn't biased or wrong. Why do you go to "alternative media"? Presumably because you feel the mainstream media is biased. And I've found that most "alternative" news sources were founded by people with strong opinions, and those opinions find their way into the paper, usually to support the political, idealogical or other stance the staff or writer has.
The 910th is not part of a "secret" spray program. It is used to control bugs, primarily in areas hit by disaster, or during emergencies like the West Nile outbreak. There is no evidence to suggest that they spray people, and one unit of C-130s could hardly produce the amount of "chemtrails" being sighted by chemtrail believers...that, and there hasn't been a single photo of a C-130 in the photo archives.
And if the 910th was involved in a secret operation, they certainly don't try to be very secret about it. I bet you could get a tour of their facility if you asked them about it! |
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Chem11
Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
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Wed Aug 14, 2002 7:10 am
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No one is 'running' anywhere, Pacer. And as far as slinging mud is concerened, you will find yourself scraping off a portion equal or slightly greater to the amount that leaves your hot little hands.
There's nothing 'shady' about Dr. Fitrakis or Columbus Alive. It's your tactics that are getting stale, Cyrano.
Case in point; I never said a damned thing about the 910th being part of a 'secret' spray program. At this point, the idea of aerosol operations being somehow 'secret' is ludicrous. And there is a wealth of documentation supporting the fact that the chemicals the 901st is going to be dispensing over civilian population centers are a health hazard and ultimately ineffective at mosquito control.
This is called precedent. How many times have we heard that the USAF would NEVER spray harmful susbtances on US citizens from the debunkers-of-the-week that have been rotating through this forum since day one? Lay a moutain of evidence on their doorstep to the contrary and they will tell you; "oh, that was during the cold war, things are dIfFeRrEnT now!"
Well, I doubt that the people who may or may not wind up flying these C-130's over Louisiana are espescially interested (one-way or another) in the long-term health effects asscoiated with what is coming out of their nozzles anymore than they are of the aerosol operations (you're proof enough of that, Pacer).
This is simpy what happens when a few stupid politicians decide to have a meeting of the minds with a few ignorant military commanders: cancer-causing chemicals being dumped on american citizens.
I'll be very surprised if this doesn't happen. It's going to provide the Air Force with a very accurate estimate of public reaction to an officialy acknowledged and controversial aerial spray program.
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PacerLJ35
Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 456
Location: Millbrook, AL, USA |
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Wed Aug 14, 2002 3:21 pm
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Chem, I haven't compared you to a mucuos-laden nutball, and I haven't stated that you are a plethora of other things that you infer that I am. Moving on.
Again, you make it seem I'm just too stupid to realize that pesticides are harmful. Of course they are. Anything that can kill insects probably isn't the best thing to be breathing. But it's a risk evaluation...do we put up with West Nile? Or do we take a chance with small amounts of pesticides? And I say small because the people of Louisiana (my home state) won't be drenched in pesticides. In any event, effective or not, many people support the spraying. Perception is everything out there. I've seen some of the worst environmental blunders made because of public perception.
In any case, the military isn't the worlds only aerial bug sprayer....many communities across the country, especially in places like Florida, hire or own their own pesticide spray aircraft. I know for a fact that New Orleans has an aircraft dedicated to spraying for bugs...it was parked in a hangar a short distance from our Army National Guard hangar.
So, it's ok for our civic leadership to spray the communities with pesticides either by airplane, helicopter or by a truck, but as soon as the USAF gets involved, it's a grand conspiracy! |
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Scanner
Joined: 06 Sep 2001
Posts: 207
Location: Shreveport, LA |
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Wed Aug 14, 2002 5:23 pm
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Haven't posted in a while, but this is too close to home. While I never liked being sprayed, it's a fact of life here in N. Louisiana and we would be carried off by the little buggers if we didn't do something. I know the guy that sprays our area and he pretty well keeps us informed, so I haven't been too concerned. However....not thrilled with the AF aerial thing since it will not be controlled by the locals. In defense of the politicians, (never thought I would be guilty of that) they are kind of damned if they do and damned if they don't. Half the people are demanding the guv'ment do something and the other half think they are trying to poison us. Me...I just don't spend a lot of time outside because I'm not thrilled about using a lot of "Off" either. Not a good situation to say the least.
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PacerLJ35
Joined: 18 Apr 2002
Posts: 456
Location: Millbrook, AL, USA |
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Thu Aug 15, 2002 12:53 am
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I went to college in Ruston, and I used to live in Lafayette and Mandeville. My wife is from a small town near Alexandria.
Another point I wanted to address with Chem11...the pilots certainly do care about the effects of the pesticides...they go through a bunch of certification training on how to handle it and apply it in a consistent manner with minimal impact on the people below and their own health. In fact, the 910th is the only unit that provides federal certification of aerial pesticide spraying. Any federal, state or local agencies that wish to receive federally-approved pesticide application and storage training would have to go to the 910th to receive such training.
Anyhow, I hope their operation in central America was effective...they have gone down there several times to curb diseases such as malaria and Dengue fever....I just found out I'm headed to Honduras, Costa Rica, Cuba and Ecuador in a couple weeks...should be fun. |
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