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Sore Throat
Joined: 01 Sep 2000
Posts: 1802
Location: x |
Winter Observations -Contradictions Abound
 Sat Feb 15, 2003 5:47 am
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Those who frequent this board are familiar with the work of "The Esteemed" NASA researcher, Dr. Patrick Minnis.
One landmark publication by this publicly funded researcher was a year long survey of contrails across the continent, "Surface-Based Observations of Contrail Occurrence Frequency Over the U.S., April 1993--April 1994 ".
This busy government employee managed to actually publish these data three years later,
http://techreports.larc.nasa.gov/ltrs/refer/1997/NASA-97-rp1404.refer.html
What we learned from this seminal paper was that there was a much higher occurance of persistent contrails in the winter months than in the summer months.
This, of course, stands to reason...colder temperatures aloft coupled with high relative humidity. It is these conditions that promote contrail persistence.
The contradiction that I've observed is this... in the San Francisco Bay Area there has been a greatly reduced occurance of the dramatic horizon-to-horizon contrails compared to the warmer, drier months of last summer.
Now we've been lectured to, by those who claim to know, that it's ALWAYS very cold up there...and that conventional atmospheric soundings consistently UNDER ESTIMATE humidity at low temperatures...and they state that it is for this reason that such persistent trails are perfectly normal during the high pressure, dry summer months.
So OK, lets say that's true.
I'm waiting for these same pundits to provide such a scholarly rationale as to why such persistent trails have virtually disappeared from our skies recently.
It couldn't be that our military is preoccupied in other parts of the world.
Nevertheless, there must be an perfectly sound explanation, grounded in rational, scientific, irrefutable, fact.
I, for one, am waiting.
[Edited 5 times, lastly by Sore Throat on 02-18-2003] |
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the professor
Joined: 10 Jan 2003
Posts: 1164
Location: heartland USA |
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Sat Feb 15, 2003 6:22 am
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Hey sore, depends where your at, they started heavy again yesterday and today.
BTW I just got hold of the 2 hour chemtrail
documentry, amazing!! |
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Lulu
Joined: 22 Dec 2000
Posts: 2501
Location: right here |
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Sat Feb 15, 2003 6:24 am
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Interesting post Sore Throat. I have noticed in my area a dramatic decrease in chemtrails over the winter months. When they were abundant from 2000-2002 it was mostly during the summer... drier season.
I have noticed a difference in jet stream pattern..perhaps this may be a contributing reason? |
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PHXPilot
Joined: 05 Jan 2003
Posts: 800
Location: Phoenix, AZ, USA |
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Sat Feb 15, 2003 6:33 am
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I'm waiting for these same pundits to provide such a scholary rationale as to why such persistent trails have virtually disappeared from our skies recently.
Ummmm, they havent. Ive seen these persistant contrails frequently over the past few days.
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theseeker
Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim |
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Sat Feb 15, 2003 7:28 am
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PHX,the world revolves around throat...get it ?
let's play dramatic change in sea water temps shall we !
JUNE 27 2002
DECEMBER 02 2002
anyone in there mcfly ? |
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Lulu
Joined: 22 Dec 2000
Posts: 2501
Location: right here |
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Sat Feb 15, 2003 7:58 am
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Seeker are you saying that El Nino is responsible for abundant lingering trails over Kelowna from 2000 to 2002 mostly during the summer but none now? |
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David
Joined: 20 Oct 2000
Posts: 1381
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Sat Feb 15, 2003 11:19 pm
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There is no shortage of chemtrails in N. Calif. They keep spraying away. Above the clouds now are chemlines. |
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Lulu
Joined: 22 Dec 2000
Posts: 2501
Location: right here |
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Sun Feb 16, 2003 4:10 am
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Bumped for T/S  |
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theseeker
Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim |
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Sun Feb 16, 2003 6:00 am
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thanks.....really I don't know how long your trails are...or were lulu
the radical change may be why you say you don't see chemtrails anymore...dunno...I don't see them any more because they don't exist...and I really don't study your area for weather much lately as the last 5 or 6 "honker" systems that have rolled through here came straight through cali on a rope damn near...either way you gotta say that is one helluva change in the worlds ocean temp in 5 months and a few days...
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Anne
Joined: 04 Feb 2001
Posts: 123
Location: Napa, CA USA |
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Fri Feb 21, 2003 4:24 am
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This morning in No. CA the sky was clear and as I drove my grandson to school, I viewed line after line until the east was filled with white lines. They were pretty precise in spraying near the previous trails and then the turn off trick. |
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Sore Throat
Joined: 01 Sep 2000
Posts: 1802
Location: x |
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Fri Feb 21, 2003 9:05 pm
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Today, February 21, 2003, after weeks of absence during the dead of winter, horizon-to-horizon persistent contrails have returned to the skies of the San Francisco Bay Area.
Unusually cold? Nope, actually unusually warm.
Unusually humid? Nope, we're experiencing high pressure right now.
Expanation from the debunkers?
Nope, they are all under their rocks.
Just as well. |
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Feelin Kocky
Joined: 07 Jan 2003
Posts: 537
Location: Underground Weather Control Bunker |
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Fri Feb 21, 2003 10:46 pm
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>>Expanation from the debunkers?
Nope, they are all under their rocks.
Just as well.<<
According to the 12 Zulu upper air charts, there is considerable amount of cold air moving into the west coast. The dewpoint depressions have fallen to less than 8 deg C over your area. Hmmm, cooler and relatively more moist? Sounds like ingredients for persistent contrails to me.
F.K. ~~~~ out from under the rock just for you |
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Sore Throat
Joined: 01 Sep 2000
Posts: 1802
Location: x |
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Sat Feb 22, 2003 4:46 am
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Kocky,
What an interesting explanation.
I am so curious as to why we haven't experienced such weather conditions during the past month or more.
Please provide a link for your source of information.
Given that air traffic is relatively constant, it is reasonable to expect that under comparable conditions we should expect the same horizon-to-horizon displays.
So lets see. Atmospheric physics and chemistry should be a constant.
I'll be happy to report as to whether there is any consistency in such observations.
You can't have it both ways. |
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Sore Throat
Joined: 01 Sep 2000
Posts: 1802
Location: x |
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Sat Feb 22, 2003 6:57 am
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Well Kocky, it's clear to me now just how desperate your type is in a willingness to...
s t r e t c h ... the facts to fit your story.
For the record, today's soundings from Oakland:
Pressure_Alt DD Dir Spd ---Temp--- DewPt
(ft) (mb) (kts) (F) (C) (C)
518 1001.0 A 155 1 54.1 12.3 9.0
587 998.0 A 309 9 57.4 14.1 9.0
554 1000.0 A 318 9 57.6 14.2 8.6
728 993.0 A 282 10 56.5 13.6 10.6
938 986.0 A 283 10 57.7 14.3 9.5
1220 976.0 A 298 11 56.7 13.7 10.5
1650 961.0 A 286 10 54.9 12.7 7.7
2083 946.0 A 280 7 52.7 11.5 6.3
2519 931.0 A 329 3 50.9 10.5 4.2
2703 925.0 A 346 4 50.9 10.5 2.9
2965 916.0 A 22 5 50.7 10.4 1.1
3418 901.0 A 29 12 51.4 10.8 -1.6
3874 886.0 A 39 20 50.5 10.3 -6.9
4340 871.0 A 39 20 49.3 9.6 -13.2
4816 856.0 A 36 13 51.4 10.8 -13.1
5006 850.0 A 33 15 50.4 10.2 -11.0
5298 841.0 A 40 18 48.9 9.4 -7.9
5787 826.0 A 27 16 46.2 7.9 -5.2
6282 811.0 A 19 16 45.9 7.7 -5.5
6788 796.0 A 8 17 44.4 6.9 -7.3
7299 781.0 A 5 20 41.7 5.4 -9.4
7818 765.0 A 3 23 40.3 4.6 -11.1
8523 745.0 A 359 25 36.5 2.5 -12.5
10190 700.0 A 342 28 30.6 -0.8 -18.4
10518 691.0 A 351 29 29.3 -1.5 -19.6
12043 652.0 A 349 32 24.4 -4.2 -24.1
14294 597.0 A 345 36 15.6 -9.1 -26.1
16617 544.0 A 345 34 6.3 -14.3 -28.6
18097 512.0 A 340 36 1.4 -17.0 -30.6
18710 500.0 A 334 38 -0.8 -18.2 -30.6
19648 481.0 A 337 40 -4.0 -20.0 -30.6
21584 444.0 A 340 48 -11.4 -24.1 -32.8
23963 401.0 A 344 52 -21.3 -29.6 -39.1
24051 400.0 A 343 52 -21.6 -29.8 -39.4
25508 375.0 A 335 54 -26.9 -32.7 -43.9
27919 338.0 A 324 62 -36.9 -38.3 -51.7
30561 300.0 A 312 66 -49.2 -45.1 -62.0
31282 290.0 A 321 67 -52.4 -46.9 -64.8
33713 259.0 A 317 74 -61.6 -52.0 -69.5
34475 250.0 A 312 75 -64.7 -53.7 -70.5
36443 227.0 A 312 77 -72.8 -58.2 -72.9
37788 213.0 A 309 79 -76.4 -60.2 -74.8
38851 202.0 A 309 83 -78.7 -61.5 -76.7
39944 191.0 A 310 87 -81.0 -62.8 -78.5
41076 181.0 A 316 86 -83.7 -64.3 -79.4
41814 174.0 A 316 87 -84.5 -64.7 -79.4
42322 170.0 A 316 84 -83.9 -64.4 -79.1
42828 166.0 A 316 84 -83.4 -64.1 -78.9
43313 162.0 A 315 84 -82.8 -63.8 -78.6
43766 158.0 A 316 83 -81.9 -63.3 -78.2
44324 154.0 A 316 79 -80.7 -62.6 -77.7
44881 150.0 A 306 75 -79.2 -61.8 -76.9
45114 148.0 A 313 74 -78.7 -61.5 -76.6
46082 141.0 A 312 70 -76.5 -60.3 -76.2
48326 126.0 A 313 67 -75.5 -59.7 -76.0
51879 106.0 A 315 58 -80.0 -62.2 -81.5
53136 100.0 A 316 54 -80.7 -62.6 -81.8
56115 86.0 A 329 45 -82.3 -63.5 -82.6
60269 70.0 A 333 41 -80.1 -62.3 -81.7
66722 51.0 A 321 28 -74.4 -59.1 -79.2
[Edited 3 times, lastly by Sore Throat on 02-22-2003] |
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