|
|
theseeker
Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim |
Blue Skies International
 Fri Oct 13, 2000 10:04 am
|
 |
|
Interesting of note is the recent development of Blue skies International....
Of which to my knowledge was originally promoted on the cttusa messageboard...
Which led to banning of persons that had questions that were genuine....
Since the first posting of BSI @ carnicom, varied and mixed reviews have came....
"Is this a legitimate citizen group or a CIA front to get information on chemtrail savy citizens?"
"When I first brought this up on the computer it told me I had preformed something'illegal.
Wondering what is happening."
Speaking of illegal :
More interesting is the addition of "Dave Petersen" to the list originator of the "chemtrail flight test" which sought after and achieved the goal of 10,000 to be raised for rental of a plane to test contrails for various substances....results or even proof of such a test remains a mystery, no official declaration of the monies spent for such a test have even been actually proven to exist...
Webber speaks :
"I am pleased to announce the addition of David Peterson to the Board of Directors of BSI. David is a Colorado activist who has worked closely with Clifford Carnicom and is a member of CACTUS."
Kim Weber ohwarriorgoddess@earthlink.net
BSI speaks :
OT--BSI Packet Mailings Going Out
"To everyone and anyone who has requested a packet and has not received it yet, they all go out tomorrow!! And since they're screwing with the mail, please do email or call me if you haven't received it by next Friday, Oct 20th (provided we're all still here and we still have mail service to anywhere in the country!) Hehehehe . . . isn't this fun?? A friend accused me of getting involved in CTs just 'cause I wanted an adventure--an adventure is an understatement, never in my wildest dreams would I have imagined this. "
How much of contribution would it take to be on the board of this non-profit organization ?
Will there be genuine study and research or the same old accuse and deny routine of clifford carnicom ?
"that's not water vapor"
This looks like a few more nights on the town for a few at the expense of a group of gullible people...
The Seeker
|
| |
|
|
blueskiesintl
Joined: 31 Aug 2000
Posts: 12
Location: Blanding UT USA |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 12:24 am
|
|
|
Dear Seeker --
Thank you for this opportunity to speak about a topic which is near and dear to my heart--Blue Skies International and its related focus of Chemtrails which affect the Earth, its climate and our children's heritage. I'll address your issues as you have listed them.
No members of the Chem Trail Tracking USA Club were banned as a result of questions presented on the message board. In fact, I have recently corresponded directly with Christy who originally posted the questions further clarifying BSI's public services.
BSI is most definitely a legitimate citizen group founded originally by myself (you may verify who I am through the Arizona Daily Sun, www.arizonadailysun.com, archived 2000 articles regarding my recent campaign for City Council there--please note that the Police Logs listed there are another Thayer and are not about me) and by Will Thomas (I think we all know who he is). The current Board of Directors who are all working on a volunteer basis (no salaries or payments of any kind have been made for their work) include: Clifford Carnicom, Lorie Kramer, Vicky Ludlum, David Peterson, Kim Weber and me. The CIA has powers to get information on anyone posting on the web and would not need to go through the formality of establishing a group to bring individuals together. Starting a new group is not an easy process, and this would only stall their tactics.
I cannot address your computer error message that "something's illegal". As a business consultant and computer instructor, I have never encountered such a message and find it difficult to believe that you did.
David Peterson did begin a Chemtrail Research Fund which, to my knowledge, has a little over $6,000 and is still sitting in that bank account, untouched. You may not be aware of the fact that the airplane rental to test the Chemtrails is approximately $22,000 per day. This accumulated $6,000 obviously is not enough to yet perform these tests. No monies have come to BSI from this research fund.
None of the Board Members have made any contributions to BSI, except for myself. What it takes to be on the BSI Board is commitment to the Chemtrail Movement which all of these individuals have already demonstrated by their past actions through the last several years.
I can say that we are all genuinely studying and researching this phenomenon. I personally became involved in the environmental movement over 11 years ago due to my 4-year-old son and our house's proximity to a plant that proposed burning hazardous waste as a fuel source. I became involved because I was concerned for my son's health and his future. My commitment began with a prayer that I would do whatever it took to beat this offensive proposal. My call to action came from that group the following week. I took a big gulp, remembered my prayer and assumed my duties. My environmental education, awareness, and commitment began at that time. I discovered that whenever I was stymied all that I needed to do was to pray for help. It always came and at just the right time. Since then, I have continued a daily prayer that I will do the work that God wants me to do with all of my heart and all of my soul. Spirit has continued to use my organizational and business experience throughout these 11 years, dropping my next project in my lap as one was completed. As God as my witness, I am proud to say that I have served humanity well and continue to do so. I know that I will be judged according to these acts and feel confident with my promises kept.
At this point, I am personally footing the bill for the BSI expenses. Memberships are beginning to straggle in, but have certainly not been enough to meet the demand for our services. To-date I have filled numerous requests for our educational packet which was professionally produced and printed by me. I'm happy with the responses that I'm getting back from this recipients of BSI's public charity as they take them to the streets, to their elected officials, to their neighbors, families and friends.
Have you joined Blue Skies International yet??
I truly wish I could afford a night on the town. It has been many months since I could.
Toni T. Thayer
Executive Director
Blue Skies International
[Edited 1 times, lastly by blueskiesintl on 10-13-2000] |
| |
|
|
goldrush
Joined: 04 Sep 2000
Posts: 109
Location: No, Calif. USA |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 12:40 am
|
|
|
$22,000 for airplane expense??????!! Please explain this or break that down. I know many ways to beat that. Please tell, who on earth gave you that figure?
I think Timothy Leary had his ashes sent to space for less than that! |
| |
|
|
blueskiesintl
Joined: 31 Aug 2000
Posts: 12
Location: Blanding UT USA |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 2:39 am
|
|
|
It takes special equipment to test the CTs and there are only a few planes in the world with this equipment. Will Thomas told me this.
Our government often uses balloons as was recently sighted outside of Monticello, UT and reported in their local paper, "NASA officials say the balloon measures 660 feet by 460 feet and carries 6,000 pounds of equipment used to collect air samples."
Toni |
| |
|
|
goldrush
Joined: 04 Sep 2000
Posts: 109
Location: No, Calif. USA |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 3:22 am
|
|
|
Thank you for a reply. Does it mean that only the use of a dirigable is to be used? Where do you rent one of those, and who gave you that price? It seems that avoiding simpler tests, gives you an excuse to maintain that you are unable to prove that contrails are not chemtrails. Private companies certainly do have planes that are licensed "experimental" which can carry or have the potential to attach, testing equipment without any fuss. Aerial photography aircraft which can be rented cheaply, by comparison, could clearly identify what types of planes are up there, combined with Flight Explorer to negate regular passenger flights. Why not? |
| |
|
|
Swedishoo
Joined: 09 Aug 2000
Posts: 429
Location: NC |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 4:52 am
|
|
|
No members of the Chem Trail Tracking USA Club were banned as a result of questions presented on the message board.
Toni, I don't know what they told you, but not only can I not defend the things that were said about me (because of this issue), but I'm also not allowed to post there. I had to remove my name out of the membership file because I was told I was no longer was allowed to be at the board, that my questions to you were none of my business, and that I was going to be deleted. I only have one Yahoo screen name and I don't play games. So, if they're going to call me a dis-informant, and treat me like a dis-informant, I guess I'll have to delete my name before they do...like a dis-informant.
In fact, I have recently corresponded directly with Christy who originally posted the questions further clarifying BSI's public services.
You clarified your experience with forming BSI, but yet have not answered any questions.
______________
Toni,
Right from the beginning I would like to state that this letter is not to cause any further trouble...being that I have already been labeled as a dis-informist and a board disrupter. I surely don't need any other titles.
When you decided to end BSI a few weeks ago, Lorie and Dona took it upon themselves to totally blame me, for you leaving. Because I asked questions about BSI and you publicly freaked out, they blamed me. My question to you is, why did you do that? Why did you take my questions so personally and get so upset? They were sincere down-to-earth questions.
I'm glad to see you have decided to reopen BSI, however Toni, there will always be questions and people wanting to know the details...like me. Just because Kim, Lorie and Dona have given you encouragement to jump back in, doesn't mean that the posters at CTTUSA aren't still wondering what BSI has planned, regardless of the funding you receive.
Christy
reply:
I was upset 'cause it is all listed on our webpage, every service we hope to be able to afford one day. Your post stated that you had read, reread, and reread and still didn't see where the money was going. But it is all there, I have to tell IRS what we're gonna do, our webpage words are straight from our Bylaws. The services are quite extensive and would be totally awesome if we could just get some funding from somewhere. (Besides the fact that Kim's posting our services almost daily on the Club.)
I was also upset 'cause I've counted on many people in this endeavor--people who I thought were totally committed and have totally backed out on me, leaving me with the whole ball of wax and expenses. I gave up my job and income and have been footing the bills for the many, many requests which are coming in all on my own and I'm dead broke now and cannot continue to carry it by myself (I never intended to do that and have never portrayed myself as having all of the answers. I'm an organizer, that means I pull people together, I offer an avenue of "oneness towards a common goal".)
I was confused by your unawareness of "giving" and "donating" to nonprofits and your question of what you got for your money. When you give to public charities, you support them, that's all. You don't get anything. I turn around and "give" the educational packets to people for free--no charge at all. I donate to sooooooo many nonprofits in all different shapes and forms I was flaberghasted (sp??) that you didn't know what "giving" was all about. I guess you haven't donated to many nonprofits, huh??
Any member has the right to ask for financial statements at any time which show month-to-month exactly where the money goes. Outsiders can request our yearend tax return from IRS which is an open public document.
I'm frustrated 'cause I've got the ability and knowledge, but no tools to do the job. This is a job I've thought was so vastly important that I'm basically "donating" my whole life to it. I feel that if I don't go after this one very big issue, all of the other issues in my life and the rest of the world's life aren't gonna mean much anymore. I felt that $25 was not too much to ask of each and every person who is committed to CTs to fork over. I've got several thousand dollars into it and have wrecked my whole life (my choice) over it, I didn't see that "giving" $25 was that big of a deal. I guess it was.
Does this help at all??
Toni
________________
Yes, is does.
Specific questions cannot be answered.
Non-members can see annual IRS reports.
If you don't have an answer, Detract.
...and 'giving' $25 is not a big deal.
It seems we may share one thing in common:
I am cynical of BSI's organizational plans, and you are cynical when discussing them.
Has anyone asked Dave Peterson for his IRS annual report?
Christy ~ Swedishoo |
| |
|
|
blueskiesintl
Joined: 31 Aug 2000
Posts: 12
Location: Blanding UT USA |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 5:28 am
|
|
|
To Goldrush:
No, it doesn't mean that only balloons can be used. My post states that it is the form our government uses. I wouldn't know where to rent either a balloon or one of the planes as this expensive test is not one of BSI's initial goals. The figure of $22,000 comes from Will Thomas whom I trust inside and out due to his credibility which must be maintained as an investigative reporter/author.
As previously stated here, these expensive tests are not one of BSI's goals right now. Should you desire to donate the funds needed for these tests to BSI you may designate the monies as a "grant" to be used solely for that purpose. We would then conduct the tests, provide you, as "grantor" the results of the tests, as well as an itemized listing showing all costs and expenses. This is how grants work.
The cheaper planes that you reference may be smaller craft but these airplanes cannot fly at the altitudes of the CTs, 20,000' plus. Again, the reason "why not" is due to lack of funding. You may want to pursue this topic with David Peterson, or feel free to send me a check and designate that the funds are to be used for this purpose.
Toni
[Edited 1 times, lastly by blueskiesintl on 10-14-2000] |
| |
|
|
blueskiesintl
Joined: 31 Aug 2000
Posts: 12
Location: Blanding UT USA |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:24 am
|
|
|
To Christy, Swedishoo:
I was unaware that you were no longer allowed in the CTTUSA, and the club founders did not tell me anything about it. I am only a member there just as the others are.
In my email to you I did not specifically state BSI's purpose indepth because, as I did reference in the email, it is on our web page. I thought that you might go there to read about our services if you were truly interested.
I will list them here, straight from our web page, with an indepth explanation for you:
1. "Establish a center to promote and support healthy lifestyles through toxic-free living environments and alternative technologies." Currently, we cannot afford to rent an office, so the center is located in my living room. In fact, it takes all of my living room--no couches, no chairs, no TV, nothing but office equipment. All office equipment is mine and is currently being used solely to perform BSI functions, and its use is donated by me for this purpose, as well as all perishable supplies and overhead expense--copier toners, laser toners, copy paper, fax machine, files and file cabinets, equipment repairs, long distance telephone charges, postage, and envelopes.
2. "Research, publish and distribute worldwide, historical and current, risks and effects from identified hazardous activities and practices, case studies and alternative technologies and actions." This activity is well underway with the distribution of the educational packet, which you have not as yet requested. These are provided free of charge to the general public around the world. More is added to this packet as new developments arise and as we have the time, energy and money to produce more handouts.
3. "Sponsor a worldwide outreach program, including educational speaking and video tours, special forums and panels where residents, community leaders, governmental representatives, experts and other concerned members of the public may meet to exchange ideas, suggest solutions, and implement strategies to enhance the world's quality of life through toxic-free environments and alternative technologies." We haven't had any requests yet for this service and will not be able to provide this service until more funding is received. When establishing a new nonprofit, future goals must be listed so that IRS can see where you're going. They don't expect you to be currently supplying all services listed. As I advise nonprofits on their initial setups, I tell them to dream big--it's what you hope to achieve. Establishment of goals is the first step of a plan, you then build to get the plan fulfilled.
4. "Network and coordinate with other nonprofits, governmental entities, professionals, and individuals involved in toxic-free living environments, healthy lifestyles and alternative technologies through worldwide conferences, seminars and workshops." We are currently networking and coordinating with all of these entities, but not yet through seminars, conferences and workshops. Again, this will require funding for travel expenses, and/or funding for us to sponsor these types of events.
5. "Publish a newsletter and sponsor a web site, focusing on information related to toxic-free living environments, healthy lifestyles and alternative technologies." This activity has just begun and is coming together even as we speak. The web site is a top priority, but once again, this requires funding which is sorely missing in our initial startup phase. The newsletter will follow the web site and will model the information contained there, as well as continuing updates.
I thought that I had previously answered your questions specifically and hope that this post does finally spell it all out for you, along with my email which you have posted above. I specifically stated why I "freaked out", why I "took the questions personally", and why I got "so upset". I began one paragraph with "I was upset 'cause it is all listed . . ." I began another paragraph with, "I was also upset 'cause I've counted on many people . . ." And, another paragraph began, "I was confused by your unawareness . . ." And finally, "I'm frustrated 'cause . . ." (See my email above which you have posted here for the remainder of these sentences.) I truly believe that my original email to you clearly answered your questions.
I didn't detract by stating that BSI "outsiders can request our yearend tax return from IRS which is an open public document". Again, my very first paragraph in this email addressed where the money goes which is what I think you're referencing here. The money goes to numbers 1 through 5 above. Nonprofits are corporations run just like any business. I don't know of any business who provides financial statements to outsiders. As a member and part of that corporation, you have the right to request these at any point in time.
You can label yourself as a cynic, but please don't put me in that category. I have been begging people to get involved, both monetarily and through their own activism. Many people do not have the time to be active, thus they give money so that others may be active for them. I sincerely believe that my original email to you, Christy, did fully answer all of your questions. However, I cannot make you read the answers.
I don't believe that David Peterson's group is a corporation. The Seeker's belief that this is illegal is entirely incorrect. Any group can act as an "unincorporated association" for as long as they desire. The benefit of becoming a "public charity" is that yearend records are available for public inspection and, of course, for the benefit of the tax deduction which is often required by major donors. Please note, however, that even IRS nonprofits are not required to file these yearend tax reports unless they have grossed more than $25,000 in one year.
I have worked professionally as a nonprofit specialist for 6 years. My work has been reviewed and endorsed by some of Flagstaff's best tax attorneys with their ultimate decision that I did a better job than they and with their referrals to me for nonprofit establishments. Whenever we specialize we have a tendency to do that job quite well. Should you have further need of clarification regarding nonprofits and how they function, I invite you to seek your own counsel.
Toni
|
| |
|
|
theseeker
Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 6:54 am
|
|
|
Dear Toni,
No problem,I enjoy this subject and there is never a dull moment.
Christy's comments should be addressed,I think it was 16 or 18 posts were removed that were in reference to this subject @ cttUSA .I know posts were removed my number may be off.....
I appreciate you being open of who you are, and in reading your posts you certainly posses 'skills' to be effective in political office. The cia and the other posts were not mine but as I said posts from carnicom....
As far as the number (22,000) that came from Thomas...is that what he paid the last time he went up and "attempted" a test....I don't think so... and goldrushes' comments are right on.....
As I have told a friend , the chemtrail promoters basically may have stumbled ass backwards in a small research program that may exist....of course this is speculation on my part....it falls considerably short of what has been purported so far, contrails making people sick, and so on....
Contrails may affect weather but that's about it....
You must remember that the air we breath is about 6 years old....
There are real issues that may exist in this topic , what they are is yet to be discovered and verified, what they are not is sickness and disease sprayed from aircraft....
A poster named 'signa' said that the goal (10,000) had been achieved....
I will not comment on mr. Thomas further than this, he and clifford have avoided and obfuscated many facts, and interaction that may have yeilded details that would be beneficial to this cause....
I am interested in facts ,debate and research, not censorship and avoidance of interaction between peoples of differing views.....
Once again thanks for responding, that shows character, no I have not joined BSI and I would study this more before-so...
A sidenote if your compadres' are not helping financially maybe you should seek people who put there money where there mouth is.....
The Seeker
|
| |
|
|
Swedishoo
Joined: 09 Aug 2000
Posts: 429
Location: NC |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 7:30 am
|
|
|
I don't need further clarification, you said quite clearly. Non profit organizations are ran like any other business.
1. "Establish a center to promote and support healthy lifestyles through toxic-free living environments and alternative technologies." You want an outside office equipt with all office supplies, staff and payroll.
2. "Research, publish and distribute worldwide, historical and current, risks and effects from identified hazardous activities and practices, case studies and alternative technologies and actions." Are you speaking of Chemtrails or other hazardous practices? Where do you get this historical and current research and case studies? NASA, DOE, Chemtrail message boards?
3. "Sponsor a worldwide outreach program, including educational speaking and video tours, special forums and panels where residents, community leaders, governmental representatives, experts and other concerned members of the public may meet to exchange ideas, suggest solutions, and implement strategies to enhance the world's quality of life through toxic-free environments and alternative technologies." BSI would be responsible for setting up worldwide panels of government leaders and experts? I can only say, more power to ya, and good luck...cause I can't even get replies to my e-mails.
4. Network and coordinate with other nonprofits...through worldwide conferences, seminars and workshops...Again, this will require funding for travel expenses Yep, hooking up with with other non-profits will require lots of meetings and seminars in other cities...and the government leaders and experts will expect their airfare to be paid for too.
5. "Publish a newsletter and sponsor a web site, focusing on information related to toxic-free living environments, healthy lifestyles and alternative technologies." Like the outside Office and Airfare, this one is easy to understand too...a Website and Newsletter.
Yep, sounds like a business to me.
Christy |
| |
|
|
blueskiesintl
Joined: 31 Aug 2000
Posts: 12
Location: Blanding UT USA |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 7:48 am
|
|
|
Yup, yup, and yup. Nonprofits are truly a business, they are allowed to make "a profit", pay staff, have expenses, all of this. Difference is that their "profit" goes towards a public cause--not in the Director's pockets. A "for profit" corporation splits the money between the shareholders. Nonprofit Directors are specifically excluded from distributing any profits to themselves--an IRS rule and standard.
If a nonprofit doesn't get donations and funding, they cannot function. Nonprofits also report to IRS just like any other business, based on the $25,000/year figure which I previously quoted.
As I said, donations and memberships are coming in--people are putting their money where their mouth is. We have only begun in the last few months. The last nonprofit I founded took several years to get fully established. Even now 5 years later, they call me in when they're struggling.
Sierra Club, Green Peace, American Cancer Society, (the "public charity" list is endless) did not get where they are today in 2 months. All of these groups receive public donations and memberships, pay staff and pay their expenses to operate.
I don't have any control over the CTTUSA, Will Thomas, Cliff Carnicom or any other individual or entity involved in CTs. If you have a beef with their presentations, actions, etc. I would recommend you contact them.
I explained indepth exactly how a legal nonprofit functions. I feel that I have been quite open and honest, there is absolutely nothing to hide. Please do seek legal counsel or legal action if you feel that we're doing something illegal. I'm confident in my work--it has withstood many tests and trials.
[Edited 3 times, lastly by blueskiesintl on 10-14-2000] |
| |
|
|
Swedishoo
Joined: 09 Aug 2000
Posts: 429
Location: NC |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 7:56 am
|
|
|
I have to hand it to you Toni, you're right, you certainly don't hide what you're doing.
I have chosen not to help you establish your business, however I wish you great success in all you do.
Sincerely,
Christy
Chemtrail and Company
*this post was edited to remove Swedishoo's personal contact information
Last edited by Swedishoo on Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:24 am; edited 2 times in total |
| |
|
|
blueskiesintl
Joined: 31 Aug 2000
Posts: 12
Location: Blanding UT USA |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 8:06 am
|
|
|
Christy, this will be my last post regarding nonprofits. Where you're dead wrong is the thinking that its "mine". It's the public's.
If your thinking was correct, then the last nonprofit I established would now be closed because I'm not there running it. In fact, it's doing well. It has a "paid" Executive Director to man it and as I left the Board of Directors several years ago, my slot was filled with other interested public members. It continues to fulfill the goals, however, which I helped establish along with 8 other individuals because that's what we set up with IRS in the formative years. |
| |
|
|
theseeker
Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 8:12 am
|
|
|
No toni, nothing to hide yet....
The deeper you get the more your 'constitution' will be tested....
The only problem I have with any established institution, is that they may seek an answer to questions, but when comfronted with facts that may endanger the existance of the organization, they rebuke and attack...
Since the human genome has been figured out and that scientist say all disease and plague will be solved in 10 years, how long these "non-profit orgs." will try to hang on and keep their dollars flowing....
The same could be applied here....
If chemtrails are genuinely a atmosphereic phenomena, then this non-profit org .(BSI) is moot....
Are you ready ????? |
| |
|
|
Swedishoo
Joined: 09 Aug 2000
Posts: 429
Location: NC |
|
Sat Oct 14, 2000 8:18 am
|
|
|
I'm very sorry if you think that I don't know how non-profits work, as you keep implying. So you sold your old seat...maybe you lost interest or wasn't enough incoming finacial support....whatever. Instead of putting words into my mouth, you should have gracefully accepted my well wishes and be done with it.
Christy |
| |
|
|
 
|
|
 Goto page
1, 2, 3, 4, 5 Next
All times are GMT. The time now is Fri May 25, 2012 11:36 pm
|
|
|
|
|
Login
