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Oregon
Joined: 04 Apr 2002
Posts: 24
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 Mon Apr 08, 2002 12:44 am
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3T..Wish there were more straight stretches of highway near where I live..
I can 'estimate' altitude and height using simple geometry well enough for loggers and artillery men in the old school who had no rangefinders....I can tell you the height of a tree within inches from the ground..
That's not enough for what we are tackling..
Concerning the Flight Explorer:
I have yet to use it or sign up for it..
IF the aircraft is recorded by the FAA in Flight Explorer, what does that indicate?
Are any military flights recorded/logged so they will appear in Flight Explorer?
Are ANY non military/Intelligence flights NOT recorded( other than drug runners)?
With the use of a home-made clinometer and plumb bob, how would such altitude assessments be viewed/accepted by the jurisprudence system?
Legal sharks would eat such evidence for lunch and drown it with two martinis..
IF we are seeking to establish truth and prove that two aircraft, burning the same fuel at the same altitudes BUT laying down widely divergent trails are:
One which is burning fuel with typical contrail and the other which is doing likewise but ALSO spraying chemicals in the atmosphere, how would such 'evidence'hold up?
I would think it'd be easily refuted or debunked, even tho valid.
What about air speed, even given the same altitude, same fuel, same 757 MD jet etc?
Are contrails effected by any of that?
These are questions we MUST know before we present our case to some Senator or Congresscritter who might be willing to stake his career and credibility on helping to secure the truth, but only IF he is assured of coming out a winner/hero.
We MUST gain the knowlege and have as many of the rebuttal questions answerable when we solicit 'horsepower' from the elected reps, EPA, Fox news or whoever.
We cannot take 'estimates' and homemade calculations done by persons not professional and hope to get a positive decision, or to even investigate.
IF what we suspect is happeneing IS happening or worse, the players have much power, beaucoup dollars( probably yours & mine) and plenty of legal spin meisters and disinformation specialists.
AMATEURS CANNOT WIN IN SUCH AN ARENA.
These people will do every thing from dredging up one's driving record to divulging one's sex life and high school science & math grades before it's over.
Maybe even worse for those who are paranoid..
Steal on'es identity, falsify records, and instantly, the whistle blower becomes a terrorist or child molester or fugitive felon..
Or, they just assinate you, making your death look like congestive heart failure, suicide or a car wreck at the beach..
The case must be credible, well prepared and nearly 100% irrefutable or NO ONE will touch it..
ALL evidence must be validated & triplicated at least, from different angles, and confirmed so there is no single key witness to subborn..jim
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3T3L1
Joined: 08 Mar 2001
Posts: 1344
Location: Lubbock, Texas |
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Mon Apr 08, 2002 5:13 am
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The case must be credible, well prepared and nearly 100% irrefutable or NO ONE will touch it..
Yep. If you're serious about this, I'd suggest you get yourself a subscription to Flight Explorer and learn how to use it. If you're not, you'll give me an excuse and a bunch more questions.
Do you know what a troll is, Oregon?
[Edited 1 times, lastly by 3T3L1 on 04-08-2002] |
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Oregon
Joined: 04 Apr 2002
Posts: 24
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Mon Apr 08, 2002 1:58 pm
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3T3L1, Well, I am 'serious' about learning more about chemtrails, their origins, purpose(s) and effects on life(including human life).
Beyond some solid answers to those initial inquiries, I am interested in doing what I might as an ordinairy layman and citizen to make others aware at the very least..
and to do what I can to have those responsible abate the 'experiment' or whatever it is by adding one more small but credible voice to the outcry.
I am not 'retired', independently wealthy,well connected in politics,or a degreed scientist.
Concerning your 'veiled question', my purpose in coming to this site or posting here on this forum is not as a 'troll', but as an honest person seeking answers, and from there, helping as I can to seek solutions.
From my experiences in life, recognizing that there is a problem or danger is the first step in resolving the problem or abating-minimizing the danger.
Beyond identifying a flight and it's altitude( IF Flight Explorer has it's record and it is not unidentifiable))
what do those who subscribe to it and use it do with the data they gather?
I want to do more than build a scrapbook if I can.
Concerning any questions you or any others have of myself, ask away..I'll give you straight answers as best I am able..jim
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3T3L1
Joined: 08 Mar 2001
Posts: 1344
Location: Lubbock, Texas |
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Mon Apr 08, 2002 2:57 pm
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jim,
1. I have given you serious answers to several of your questions and you have dismissed every one. Not that my answers are Gospel, but my sense is that you'd rather ask questions than get answers.
2. Initially I thought that the questions you asked were good ones. However, the certitude you demand is the kind that requires megabucks or at least kilobucks to achieve. You say that you are not independently. wealthy. Neither is any of us. If you cannot afford to buy a chase plane and keep it ready to fly, if you cannot afford to take numerous sets of pristine samples at altitude and have them analyzed by reputable labs, and if you cannot afford to buy your own radar and weather sounding gear, you might want to listen to some of the suggestions we have.
3. Flight Explorer will give you rather precise information on most commerical flights. Its value is that it allows you to understand what is normal air traffic for your area. If you go out hunting and spend your time shooting decoys, you don't bring home a lot of meat.
4. As to your questions about the physical characteristics of normal contrails, please take some time to do background research by reading all the posts in the Science Forum. Most of the questions you have will have already been addressed there, and you will also find answers to questions you haven't thought of yet.
Please let this thread return to its original topic and start a new one if you would like to continue a discussion on the methodology of chemtrail research. If you decide to start a thread in the Science Forum, please be sure to read the rules first. I moderate the Science Forum and (as you may have guessed) the rules there are fairly strict.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by 3T3L1 on 04-08-2002] |
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David
Joined: 20 Oct 2000
Posts: 1381
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Mon Apr 08, 2002 3:39 pm
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http://cdec.water.ca.gov/misc/monthly_res.html
You can use this site to check on the current and past levels of lakes and water impoundments all up and down Calif.
Pretty useful. It gives the levels from the past and present in a easy to use foremat.
I went to one of our countys backcountry lakes yesterday to do some fishing. I was shocked at the lack of water, usually this time of year it is full and the spillway is running, not so now. Even the main feeder creek is drying up early, so no fish spawn this year. Last year at this tme it had over 24,000 acre feet, this year less than 17,000 and is falling rapidly. That is dramatic for a lake 1x5 miles in size. Most of the lakes in my area are the same, low, low.
Rain forecast for the past couple of days was sprayed away, and the spraying continues today. |
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Oregon
Joined: 04 Apr 2002
Posts: 24
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Mon Apr 08, 2002 11:30 pm
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3T3L1, Well, I have only been coming to this site for a week so I apologise that I am not versed in all you have covered on the science boards.
Alot of what is there is above my head..
I have not dismissed your answers, but there's alot to digest.
I may return when I am more 'educated' on this subject and can converse better..
Thanks for your help. Jim
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Molliani
Joined: 16 Mar 2001
Posts: 428
Location: Illinois |
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Mon Apr 29, 2002 7:31 am
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This is from The Trends Journal web site.
WATER, WATER
For over almost two decades -- long before Americans started chugging water from plastic bottles and before Coke and Pepsi concocted fake sounding brand names to get their share of the bottled water market -- we've been recommending investment into all things related to water.
The Trends Journal®:
* Allows you to anticipate, recognize and preempt significant changes in virtually every field of modern life.
* Alerts you to the trends that motivate or that result from change and that will in turn shape the future.
* Identifies short- and long-term strategies for profiting from trends.
Individual readers from every walk of life, along with small businesses, corporations, industries, trades, professions, educational and religious institutions ... all can put The Trends Journal®'s trend forecasts and trend analyses to practical use.
http://www.trendsresearch.com/
The Trends Research Institute® is on the record for accurately forecasting many major social, economic, and political trends |
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Molliani
Joined: 16 Mar 2001
Posts: 428
Location: Illinois |
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Sun May 26, 2002 9:32 am
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Nestle purchases Vernon Hills firm
By S.A. Mawhorr Daily Herald Business Writer
Posted on May 17, 2002
Vernon Hills-based Sparkling Spring Water Co. got its start more than 100 years ago when William Tillman tapped into an artesian well on his farmland and started selling the water to neighbors.
On Thursday, the company announced it is being sold to Nestle Waters for an undisclosed sum.
It had been in the Tillman family for at least four generations with Warner Tillman most recently at the helm.
According to a news release from Nestle Waters, Sparkling Spring sold $33 million worth of water last year and has 250 employees at six sites. The company serves northeast Illinois, southwest Wisconsin and northwest Indiana.
The acquisition is part of Nestle Waters' strategy to grow in the North American market. The company had captured more than 32 percent of the bottled water market in the United States in 2001 and is looking to grab more.
Nestle leads the bottled water market worldwide with such brands as Perrier, San Pellegrino, Vittel, Poland Spring and Deer Park. Nestle, which is headquartered in Switzerland, is one of the world's biggest food companies.
Nestle will keep the Sparkling Spring brand name at least for the time being, said spokeswoman Jane Lazgin. Nestle also will keep the Sparkling Spring operations as they are now for the time being, she said.
All of that could change after Nestle executives have a chance to examine the business, Lazgin said.
"We will explore what works best and all of it will be decided in the future," she said.
But a news release from Nestle Waters did say that the company's growth in North America is based on 15 strong regional brands, which are among the strongest in their respective markets.
About 85 percent of Sparkling Spring sales came from deliveries to the home and office while the remaining 15 percent comes from retail outlets.
Bringing small bottles of Sparkling Spring water to store shelves was a strategy pushed by Warner Tillman, who is the great grandson of the company's founder and who saw an opportunity to expand the company's market share and increase sales. Tillman could not be reached for comment Thursday. |
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