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Chemtrail Central > The Neutral Zone

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defender





Joined: 27 Oct 2000
Posts: 1113
Location: Level 64
PostFri Nov 16, 2001 2:13 am  Reply with quote  

See what I mean? You can tell by the lack of responses from the more peaceful members of CTC that the creepy 'debunkers' are doing their thing.

In this case, 'debunkers' could be equated to racists, though I used the analogy of child molesters since seeker and DK used it to 'debunk' one of the people they call a 'chemmie'. I think it was JR who coined that term 'chemmie'?

BTW, that word 'Debunker' implies that there is something to debunk, as though there is something illegal or deceitful going on with people who have an interest in this website.

That term, IMO has never been descriptive of the individuals here who call themselves debunkers. Some of them will use anything they can, ridicule, lies, jpg's, jokes, philibustering, threats etc. to shut down conversations. You can see the difference between us and them by comparing TopGunns site to CTC.

Unfortunately, the truth is that sometimes, 'debunkers', when they rear their ugly heads, have to be the ones who are debunked.

I'm happy to have contributed 'CON-trail Artist' to the lexicon as a response to that 'chemmie' label I found last year when I first heard of Chemtrails. To me, that is a very accurate description of some of these weasels and CIA wannabes. Some are worse than others, some just have to respond to anyone who threatens their little pathetic and juvenile belief systems. But then some are really just outright CON-artists.


(prepare for a juvenile and pathetic retort, not worthy or indicative of defenders true nature.... )

BTW, I always knew the seeker was a pussy, now we know for sure!

See?? even I have a sense of humor. Now you can have lots to talk about in your meaningful and important 'debunker' discussions!!

defender (Master of the Snappy Comeback!)....

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Deb





Joined: 04 Oct 2001
Posts: 163
Location: Plainfield, Indiana USA
PostFri Nov 16, 2001 3:19 am  Reply with quote  

I'm happy to have contributed 'CON-trail Artist' to the lexicon as a response to that 'chemmie' label I found last year when I first heard of Chemtrails. To me, that is a very accurate description of some of these weasels and CIA wannabes. Some are worse than others, some just have to respond to anyone who threatens their little pathetic and juvenile belief systems. But then some are really just outright CON-artists.


(prepare for a juvenile and pathetic retort, not worthy or indicative of defenders true nature.... )

I used to be a chemmie. I set out to debunk the debunkers. So let's play, Debunk Da Debunkers! Here's your chance, defender to show off your investigative talents!
Here's some real juvenile, elementary and very simple stuff anyone can understand. You see, I do a little bit more than shoot off my mouth on a message board. So, go for it - http://cdebsjournal.topcities.com/

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Contrails - the signature of freedom and commerce
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theseeker





Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim
PostFri Nov 16, 2001 4:01 am  Reply with quote  

defender,

I usually call cats...cats...

I had a snappy pic & comeback here, but this quote is more fitting in retrospect...

I refuse to drown in "shallow" water.....

T/S

btw great cat pic 3t3......your creatures ?

[Edited 3 times, lastly by theseeker on 11-15-2001]
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3T3L1





Joined: 08 Mar 2001
Posts: 1344
Location: Lubbock, Texas
PostFri Nov 16, 2001 4:17 pm  Reply with quote  

Thanks, seeker! I wish the cats were ours...but Huskies tend to eat cats, so we can't have both species simultaneously.
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Chem11





Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
PostSat Nov 17, 2001 12:59 am  Reply with quote  


quote:
That term, IMO has never been descriptive of the individuals here who call themselves debunkers. Some of them will use anything they can, ridicule, lies, jpg's, jokes, philibustering, threats etc. to shut down conversations. You can see the difference between us and them by comparing TopGunns site to CTC.


Damned straight, Defender. The so-called debunkers rely on slander and obfuscation because of the overwhelming evidence that supports what anyone with two good eyes and a brain can clearly ascertain; non-commercial jets are deploying chemicals and many people being exposed to said chemicals are paying the price.

After Topgun/Maverick's recent profanity ridden slanderfest on CD's board, I swore off keeping up on the antics of this curious sub-species of the human race. Mr Sucks said it best; it's a waste of spirit.

My days of 'debunking the debunkers' are over, Deb. I just don't think it's possible to for you folks to screw up any worse than you already have, which kinda takes the fun out of the game...

You accuse chemtrail activists of perpetuating some sort of hoax, but when one of your fellow 'debunkers' cops to hoaxing an airline officials statement, you congratulate him. You accuse others of impropriety with regards to their legitimate fund-raising efforts, then start collecting funds from your website, ostensibly to help out some poor, starving college student that provides your so-called software. Whatever.

You couldn't be making this easier for me if you tried. The sad thing is that you were a lot better CT researcher than you are a sceptic. If you hadn't thrown out that fumigation link regarding fluorine, I'd still being drinking tap-water and brushing my teeth with Crest...



[Edited 1 times, lastly by Chem11 on 11-16-2001]
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theseeker





Joined: 25 Jul 2000
Posts: 3403
Location: Damnit...I'm a doctor jim
PostSat Nov 17, 2001 5:31 am  Reply with quote  

chem did I tell ya how glad I amto see you back !

The so-called debunkers rely on slander and obfuscation because of the overwhelming evidence that supports what anyone with two good eyes and a brain can clearly ascertain; non-commercial jets are deploying chemicals and many people being exposed to said chemicals are paying the price.

where this overwhelming evidence ?

damn I must have been reading the wrong sites the last 2 years...



T/S

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Deb





Joined: 04 Oct 2001
Posts: 163
Location: Plainfield, Indiana USA
PostSat Nov 17, 2001 5:54 am  Reply with quote  

My days of 'debunking the debunkers' are over, Deb. I just don't think it's possible to for you folks to screw up any worse than you already have, which kinda takes the fun out of the game...

Chem, I didn't ask anyone to debunk the debunkers, I want you to debunk me and what my research demonstrates. Show me where I've screwed up in that link where I journalize almost daily the weather, particularly relative humidity and temperature at flying altitudes
and the bona fide "chemtrail" reports from CTTUSA. There's a profession fest going on over there where posters are describing what a chemtrail is - nothing more than a persistent contrail. Except they don't know WHY one contrail will persist longer than another.


You accuse chemtrail activists of perpetuating some sort of hoax, but when one of your fellow 'debunkers' cops to hoaxing an airline officials statement, you congratulate him.

If you are referring to Sprayplane Pilot, than you definitely don't know what you're talking about. I was one of the first, if not the first chemmie to say I didn't buy the Mechanic's Statement. And had no idea at the time who wrote it. So if you are addressing me personally, once again you're wrong. In fact, no matter SP's agenda which I strongly suspect was just to screw with chemmies because he and I had some pretty tough go-arounds on another board you weren't even aware of, the fact that he lied totally blew any credibility with me, Jay, and Seeker. Show me where I congratulated him for what he did. You people who came into the game late are a joke. You don't know the score without a scorecard.

You accuse others of impropriety with regards to their legitimate fund-raising efforts, then start collecting funds from your website, ostensibly to help out some poor, starving college student that provides your so-called software. Whatever.

You sir, are delusional! I never solicited funds for anybody; the boy did it on his own and probably on every board he has out there. It's obvious why you can be a victim of the powers of suggestion and persuasion- you wouldn't know the truth if it walked up and introduced itself.



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Contrails - the signature of freedom and commerce
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Chem11





Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
PostSat Nov 17, 2001 6:28 am  Reply with quote  

Well, after SP fessed up, your response was 'drinks for everyone!', that certainly sounds congratulatory to me...

Sorry dear, but you are going to have to accept responsibility for what occurs on your website... just like everyone else.

And as far as coming on the scene 'late', I can only say that I hope that I'm not around long enough to decide it's OK to stab my associates in the back. So far, you and Cy are the only people morally bankrupt enough to pull off that little trick.

Hemmingway once said that 'what is true at first light is a lie by sundown'. I would think that you, of all people, would understand the subjective nature of truth.

In fact, you seem to define the concept.

Or maybe you're just wishy-washy. Or confused. Or spineless. Or easily misled. I don't know and I don't neccesarily care.

But I do know that you spend a great deal of time levelling personal attacks on anyone within spitting distance who is involved in this issue.

Now, I don't believe in Santa Claus, but I sure as hell don't run up to the kids in the mall and call them paranoid morons while they are sitting on Santa's lap.

And even that anology is giving you the benefit of the doubt. Scary, Huh?
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defender





Joined: 27 Oct 2000
Posts: 1113
Location: Level 64
PostMon Nov 19, 2001 5:23 pm  Reply with quote  

Let the games begin?

Half-wit, nodeb, noddebunker, CD, Deb, chickendeb and the other 5 or 6 names they've gone by in their CON-artist 'debunking' games... You and your posts have always been a waste of time, especially when it comes to chemtrails. Taking a 'challenge' from you would be like drinking a glass of Clorox, or driving into a Cul-de-sac and expecting to cross over to the next street. There's no reason to do it because it's a dead end. Trying to reason with someone who can't or won't accept the reality of Chemtrails only takes up time and webspace. You're arguments on the few occasions they have any merit only refer to contrails.... not CHEMTRAILS!

I sympathize with your arguments Chem11, but I wish we didn't have to go over all this again and again with these contrail robots. Their arguments and games are at least as old as the oldest Chemtrail website.

BTW, I personally don't have a problem w/TG. I haven't read everything at his website, but I know Im not interested in reading how everyone over there seems to suck up to him because he may or may not be an F-16 pilot. I've accepted that he may be, and I've always found his posts to be open-minded and well-intentioned when he posted here a few months ago. I never thought he was a CON-artist like some of these other clowns. But as far as they go, you can have'em.

Apparently, there will always be US and them and some people/areas that are undecided/ambiguous/gray when it comes to CHEMtrails.

For anyone still interested in 'debunkers', all you have to do is go back and read their posts and judge for yourself... but try to get a list of all their aliases first, if you can, or are so inclined to spend the time finding them.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by defender on 11-19-2001]
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3T3L1





Joined: 08 Mar 2001
Posts: 1344
Location: Lubbock, Texas
PostMon Nov 19, 2001 5:39 pm  Reply with quote  

But I do know that you spend a great deal of time levelling personal attacks on anyone within spitting distance who is involved in this issue.

Sorry, Chem. If you're talking specifically to Chickiedeb, I've got to disagree with you. There are some debunkers, like Jay Reynolds and Sceptic, who will spew names derisively and at length whenever they get the opportunity. But Deb, the housewife from Indiana, sticks to the facts and debates the facts. I may not always agree with her, but I do respect her for arguing on the basis of the evidence as she sees it.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by 3T3L1 on 11-19-2001]
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Chem11





Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
PostMon Nov 19, 2001 6:19 pm  Reply with quote  

Oh really 3T3?

Threatening to call the FBI on anyone who reports chemtrail activity to the authorities.

Calling someone like Lo a terrorist immediately following 9/11.

Accusing damn near every one involved in this issue from suffering from a mental illness.

And when the evidence doesn't support her idealogy, she simply ignores it.

And, by her own admission, the only reason she isn't engaging in these smear tactics is because they are 'against the rules' here.

Maybe she'll hang around and decide to turn over a new leaf. Again. That would be great. But please don't tell me that she 'sticks to the facts and debates the facts'. It's far to easy to prove you wrong and you've spent a good deal of time garnering a reputation as someone who is usually right. At least from a scientific perspective
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3T3L1





Joined: 08 Mar 2001
Posts: 1344
Location: Lubbock, Texas
PostMon Nov 19, 2001 6:33 pm  Reply with quote  

I'm right politically, too. But you knew that.

Okay, I'll issue a modified limited apology for my characterization of Chickiedeb as a truthseeker. (But in spite of all the evidence you can cite, I still really think she is a truthseeker. It's irrational, I admit it. )
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Chem11





Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
PostMon Nov 19, 2001 7:58 pm  Reply with quote  

Modified, limited apology accepted!

Well, Chickie Deb's return has certainly stirred things up a little, eh Defender? The Zone exists to provide a forum for rational, civilized debate on the issue and it has fallen to theseeker and myself (God help us) to facilitate that debate.

Whether that debate is at all useful is another debate in and of itself. Sometimes I think it's a good idea. Sometimes a line gets crossed and we lose someone, which sucks out loud.

I do completely understand peoples' exasperation with these often circular debates when they exist outside of the Neutral Zone, however.

If the smell of napalm in the morning doesn't particularly appeal to you, you should be able to go about your business unmolested within the majority of this website.

In the end that is up to Thermit, but as of now I'm seeing more debate and debunking outside of the zone than in it.
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3T3L1





Joined: 08 Mar 2001
Posts: 1344
Location: Lubbock, Texas
PostMon Nov 19, 2001 8:03 pm  Reply with quote  

I think it makes the site more interesting, Chem, though I do enjoy the special--relationship--you and theseeker have in The Neutral Zone.

And I'm so proud...I just did a Googlesearch correctly and figured out the meaning of "One Moon Circles." Yeeeehaw!
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Chem11





Joined: 21 Apr 2001
Posts: 1386
PostMon Nov 19, 2001 8:25 pm  Reply with quote  

Judging by the flood of emails that were waiting for me upon my return to so-called civilization, you would appear to be in the minority. I think people think of CTC as a safe place in the world to communicate with the cognescenti. And I seem to recall that you avoided CTC in the early days (as did I) because of the rampant debunking going on here during that time.

PS- Try doing a googlersearch on 'Megasprayer'

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