posted 06-11-2002 02:40 AM            

I don't think the FAA has a "military department" so to speak, but considering it is a federal agency I think it is obvious that they do regulate a certain amount of military aviation. Somebody has to control the airways, and I assure you the military is too busy with other things to worry about civilian air routes and craft, and i would assume this is where the FAA comes in. I think it is completely plausible that they would possibly have operational knowledge of military movement.

posted 06-11-2002 09:30 AM            

I've got all the numbers for the towers that actually exist, but Auburn is an uncontrolled field, basically a runway with a few hangars, and a place to get fuel. Maybe I'll call the FBO (Auburn Flight Services) and see if they've heard of this military desk. Maybe they can check p. 60 of the yellow pages for me.

posted 06-11-2002 12:33 PM            

Unhappy you're still faily new,
So I have some advice for you,
On this you can depend,
Your words you must defend,
Illuminated can read too!
_____________________________
(The following is a joke, or attempt thereof.)

posted 06-11-2002 06:59 PM            

or it could be

Seattle Aircraft Certification Office, ANM-100S (ANM-ROC)http://www.faa.gov/avr/aai/Appx1.htm

or...

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...FEMA headquarters, the Regional Operations Center (ROC) in Atlanta and various field locations.

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quote:

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This overview illustrates response and recovery actions Federal agencies likely will take to help State and local governments that are overwhelmed by a major disaster or emergency. Key operational components that could be activated include the Regional Operations Center (ROC), Emergency Response Team - Advance Element (ERT-A), National Emergency Response Team (ERT-N), Emergency Support Team (EST), Emergency Response Team (ERT), Disaster Field Office (DFO), Catastrophic Disaster Response Group (CDRG), and Disaster Recovery Center (DRC).

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quote:

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FEMA Headquarters may activate an Emergency Support Team (EST) and may convene an executive-level meeting of the Catastrophic Disaster Response Group (CDRG). When FEMA activates the EST, FEMA will request FBI Headquarters to provide liaison. The responsible FEMA region(s) may activate a Regional Operations Center (ROC) and deploy a representative(s) to the affected State(s). When the responsible FEMA region(s) activates a ROC, the region(s) will notify the responsible FBI Field Office(s) to request a liaison.

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posted 06-11-2002 10:28 PM            

I think you're reluctant to post a phone number because there is no phone number to the FAA control tower at the Auburn Municpal Airport, because there is no tower at that airport. I hate to call someone a liar, but either you misspoke about which control tower you called, or you made all of it up. Now which is it?

"If you are who you say you are pacer, how come you're not privy to the FAA having a military desk?"

I'm sure I would be privy to such info if it actually existed. I've asked the OSS guys at work today (they run our control tower) and they had never heard of it either.

"It only makes sense that there would be someone coordinating flights between commercial aircraft and military. Especially when they're as close as McChord AFB and Seatac airport. It makes total sense to me."

So, are you just speculating that such a thing SHOULD exist? Or do you know for a fact that such a thing DOES exist? You know how the military flights are coordinated with the civilian flights? BY THE SAME EXACT SYSTEM. Our flights are entered into the same FAA database as everyone elses. We don't have some super-special flight plan clearance system, nor do we fly special "military routes" (except MTRs, but those are low-level, i.e. less than 500 ft AGL).

We fly the EXACT SAME ROUTES and talk to the EXACT SAME CONTROLLERS and request our clearances from the EXACT SAME CLEARANCE DELIVERY FREQUENCIES as all the other civilian traffic out there.

You know who coordinates flights between McChord and KSEA? Seattle Center, that's who. And about the closest you'll get to a "military desk" is whoever happens to be receiving flight plans from McChord or Ft Lewis and inputting them into the system.

"What prompted the call in the first place is that when the military have been in the air, the commercial airliners have been grounded untill they leave"

posted 06-12-2002 12:41 AM            

The military does have representatives with the FAA, but they serve in the capacity to write letters of agreement (LOAs), and help resolve airspace issues with Military Operations Areas, etc. But they don't deal with traffic flow...that's soley the FAA's responsibility. We (the military) just "goes with the flow" of other commercial and private traffic out there.

In any case, I'm not angry. I don't believe that you're simply lying to me, after all I did eventually find a number for the Seattle ARTCC, which is located in Auburn. See, I don't jump to conclusions so quickly...my post above stated that you either misspoke or was making it up, and I'm glad that I don't have to call you a liar....but an ARTCC is not a control tower, just for clarification.

posted 06-12-2002 01:13 AM            

I was about to say that there is the Seattle Air Route Traffic Control Center located in Auburn. They're an ARTCC controlled by the FAA. http://www.lockheedmartin.com/atm/news/1998/atmnewe.htm

The McChord AFB is in Tacoma southwest of Auburn and may have been doing something with FEMA and SARTCC. - Order 7610.4J regarding Special Military Operations under section 7 also comes to mind. http://www.faa.gov/ATpubs/MIL/Ch1/mil0107.html

The 446th Airlift Wing is stationed at McChord . - 0f course they are

quote:

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Washington's only flying Air Force Reserve Unit. On any given day, the 446th flies missions around the globe in support of Department of Defense missions.

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posted 06-12-2002 10:15 AM            

"my post above stated that you either misspoke or was making it up, and I'm glad that I don't have to call you a liar....but an ARTCC is not a control tower, just for clarification."

posted 06-12-2002 01:25 PM            

I wouldn't start pointing fingers about posturing and huffing and puffing. Anyhoo, you're just as much a guest here as I am.

Back to Unhappy Trails. I apologize for any rudeness, but you did have me confused for a while. Based on what you DID say, it wasn't making any sense whatsoever.

The "military desk" you likely spoke to was probably the person handling the departures out of McChord, but there isn't a "military" department that only handles military issues. There IS, however, a military advisor for each branch fo the services that works at the regional offices for the FAA. But they don't deal with traffic sequencing, but more related to airspace issues, waivers, and letters of agreements. For example, the FAA has a maximum speed limit below 10,000 feet of 250 knots. But the USAF has a waiver for some aircraft because flying at 250 knots would be dangerously slow for them.

I thought about the "grounding" of airplanes you spoke of when the military aircraft departed McChord. I think your Air Force friend ment having to wait for IFR release. This is common for both military and civilian IFR departures. Our airfield is located very close to Montgomery Regional Airport, and it's common for us to have to wait a few minutes for an IFR release. They don't just make civilian traffic wait...we have to wait when civilian traffic is taking off too.

Again, I seriously doubt that the FAA would tell you about anything that is top secret. Just telling people that there was a top secret operation going on would serve to only compromise the security classification.

posted 06-12-2002 01:32 PM            

Cities and the FAA offices located in them. http://www.nw.faa.gov/cities/wa-city.htm