posted 03-26-2003 05:26 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by PHXPilot:
Well you might as well start believing the ocean is made out of washing machines. "But I saw foam in the ocean, so it must be true!!"

---

PHX, that'd be way too much evidence for them! I mean, how could they believe something with so much real physical evidence!!

PS - Those are some nice pics you've got from Airliners.net. Being a private pilot myself, I can't wait for the day that I can get dirty looks from these people as I fly over in my chemical spewing A320
I've only been reading this forum for about half an hour, but the ignorance I've seen is just incredible... Do some real research, people, and you might find the truth... it is out there, and it's really not what you seem to think it is... The government is not trying to poison you, control the weather or whatever else you think they're doing...

posted 03-27-2003 09:47 AM            

Speaking of odor, Larry...I can smell ya from here. Bathe much??!!

And you're wrong, again, about me out rounding up debunkies. The pilots are showing up here all on their own. No invite from moi, but I must say, I don't mind them one bit. You, Larry, on the other hand...

posted 03-27-2003 03:54 PM            

Scott Ritter thinks the US is going to lose in Iraq.

I agree with his stance on nuclear weapons, and I like the fact that he doesn't have a bee in his bonnet about Zionists.

I think I trust his (and my own) judgement more than I am intimidated by Captain Walkers and PHX pilots.

posted 03-27-2003 05:51 PM            

The damnable zionists and globalists are just like dirty cops. In fact, many ARE dirty cops. They'll STAGE ANOTHER EVENT and BLAME Iraq. That's what Alex Jones has been predicting and I AGREE as it's their modus oprendi. Like planting drugs on a place so they can take your land. Oh! That's Bush and his stinking daddy's CIA at work again. They are the ones bringing the drugs in, pushing the so-called drug war then planting evidence and locking everybody up in their CIA Wackenhut profiteering POLICE STATE! So I won't be a bit surprised to see nukes go off or chemical weapons and then these IDIOTS like PHX debunkie will crow..."See! We knew he had WMD there! We did the right thing going in there and sacrificing all those kids."

posted 03-28-2003 06:04 AM            

Actually using them goes against everything that has happened since Hiroshima and Nagasaki and would create more problems than it would solve. And I don't believe "terrorists" are going to use them because the terrorists all work for the same boss (who is not "the Zionists") and the boss is in trouble at this moment.

posted 03-28-2003 08:08 AM            

As to you not CARING about things, that's pretty obvious by your superficial study and careless reporting. Others on this forum HAVE taken the time to research this. The government HAS admitted to spraying biologicals on cities like San Francisco, sailors in the Navy, you can SEE IT in the satellite photo above the first gulf war, they're doing it NOW under the guise of bio-terror drills getting people CONDITIONED to accepting this as OK. Absolute refusals to check samples is what we get from the FEDs when people who DO care try to expose this.

Again folks, history is LITTERED with civilizations in denial. And AGAIN, if you don't find and READ a copy of the TALMUD, you won't understand the absolute SATANIC nature and plans of ZIONISTS. Zionists aren't the ONLY players in this globalist scheme, but they're certainly biggies running U.S. policy right into the ground.

From:
To: ;
Sent: Thursday, March 27, 2003 9:04 PM
Subject: Fw:Zionist Jews Dominate U.S. War Machine

I CERTAINLY SUPPORT OUR TROOPS IN IRAQ. AFTER ALL YOU AND I AND THE REST OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE SENT THEM THERE.

THEY ARE JUST DOING WHAT WE TOLD THEM TO DO!

BUT OUR FORIEGN POICY SUCKS!
BELOW EXPLAINS A MAJOR REASON FOR THAT PROBLEM.

Dave
=======

---------- Forwarded Message ----------

War on Iraq...not too hard to figure out...

For those who are shy about Who is Who in this dirty little war, read this
attached message to find out who and what has been instigating its
intentions. Any American who fails to understand that the Zionists are the
prime motivators behind this War will live to regret not knowing, or caring.

++++++++++++++

The Israeli lobby has many "thinktanks" that provide future advisors to the
various administrations, both Republican and Democrat. During the Clinton
Administration, the Israeli lobby provided officials from the Washington
Institute for Near East Policy like Martin Indyk. During the Bush Jr
Administration, many of the officials the Israeli lobby provided are from
their Republican "thinktanks," like the American Enterprise Institute (AEI)
and the Jewish Institute for National Security Affairs (JINSA).

1). Richard Perle----One of Bush's foreign policy advisors, he is the
chairman of the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board. A very likely Israeli
government agent, Perle was expelled from Senator Henry Jackson's office in
the 1970's after the National Security Agency (NSA) caught him passing
Highly-Classified (National Security) documents to the Israeli Embassy. He
later worked for the Israeli weapons firm, Soltam. Perle came from one the
above mentioned pro-Israel thinktanks, the AEI. Perle is one of the leading
pro-Israeli fanatics leading this Iraq war mongering within the
administration and now in the media.

2). Paul Wolfowitz----Deputy Defense Secretary, and member of Perle's
Defense Policy Board, in the Pentagon. Wolfowitz is a close associate of
Perle, and reportedly has close ties to the Israeli military. His sister
lives in Israel. Wolfowitz came from the above mentioned Jewish thinktank,
JINSA. Wolfowitz is the number two leader within the administration behind
this Iraq war mongering.

3). Douglas Feith----Under Secretary of Defense and Policy Advisor at the
Pentagon. He is a close associate of Perle and served as his Special Counsel.
Like Perle and the others, Feith is a pro-Israel extremist, who has advocated
anti-Arab policies in the past. He is closely associated with the extremist
group, the Zionist Organization of America, which even attacks Jews that
don't agree with its extremist views. Feith frequently speaks at ZOA
conferences. Feith runs a small law firm, Feith and Zell, which only has one
International office, in Israel. The majority of their legal work is
representing Israeli interests. His firm's own website stated, prior to his
appointment, that Feith "represents Israeli Armaments Manufacturer." Feith
basically represents the Israeli War Machine. Feith also came from the Jewish
thinktank JINSA. Feith, like Perle and Wolfowitz, are campaigning hard for
this Israeli proxy war against Iraq.

4). Edward Luttwak----Member of the National Security Study Group of the
Department of Defence at the Pentagon. Luttwak is reportedly an Israeli
citizen and has taught in Israel. He frequently writes for Israeli and
pro-Israeli newspapers and journals. Luttwak is an Israeli extremist whose
main theme in many of his articles is the necessity of the U.S. waging war
against Iraq.

5). Henry Kissinger-----One of many Pentagon Advisors, Kissinger sits on
the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board under Perle. For detailed information
about Kissinger's evil past, read Seymour Hersch's book (Price of Power:
Kissinger in the Nixon White House). Kissinger likely had a part in the
Watergate crimes, Southeast Asia mass murders (Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos),
Installing Chilean mass murdering dictator Pinochet, Operation Condor's mass
killings in South America, and more recently served as Serbia's Ex-Dictator
Slobodan Milosevic's Advisor. He consistently advocates going to war against
Iraq. Kissinger is the Ariel Sharon of the U.S. Unfortunately, President Bush
nominated Kissinger as chairman of the September 11 investigating commission.
It's like picking a bank robber to investigate a fraud scandal.

6). Dov Zakheim----Under Secretary of Defense, Comptroller, and Chief
Financial Officer (CFO) for the Department of Defense. He is an ordained
rabbi and reportedly holds Israeli citizenship. Zakheim attended attended
Jewâ?Ts College in London and became an ordained Orthodox Jewish Rabbi in 1973.
He was adjunct professor at New York's Jewish Yeshiva University. Zakheim is
close to the Israeli lobby.

7). Kenneth Adelman-----One of many Pentagon Advisors, Adelman also sits on
the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board under Perle, and is another extremist
pro-Israel advisor, who supports going to war against Iraq. Adelman
frequently is a guest on Fox News, and often expresses extremist and often
ridiculus anti-Arab and anti-Muslim views. Through his hatred or stupidity,
he actually called Arabs "anti-Semitic" on Fox News (11/28/2001), when he
could have looked it up in the dictionary to find out that Arabs by
definition are Semites.

8). I. Lewis Libby -----Vice President Dick Cheney's Chief of Staff. The
chief pro-Israel Jewish advisor to Cheney, it helps explains why Cheney is so
gun-ho to invade Iraq. Libby is longtime associate of Wolfowitz. Libby was
also a lawyer for convicted felon and Israeli spy Mark Rich, whom Clinton
pardoned, in his last days as president.

9). Robert Satloff----U.S. National Security Council Advisor, Satloff was
the executive director of the Israeli lobby's "think tank," Washington
Institute for Near East Policy. Many of the Israeli lobby's "experts" come
from this front group, like Martin Indyk.

10). Elliott Abrams-----National Security Council Advisor. He previously
worked at Washington-based "Think Tank" Ethics and Public Policy Center.
During the Reagan Adminstration, Abrams was the Assistant Secretary of State,
handling, for the most part, Latin American affairs. He played an important
role in the Iran-Contra Scandal, which involved illegally selling U.S.
weapons to Iran to fight Iraq, and illegally funding the contra rebels
fighting to overthrow Nicaragua's Sandinista government. He also actively
deceived three congressional committees about his involvement and thereby
faced felony charges based on his testimony. Abrams pled guilty in 1991 to
two misdemeanors and was sentenced to a year's probation and 100 hours of
community service. A year later, former President Bush (Senior) granted
Abrams a full pardon. He was one of the more hawkish pro-Israel Jews in the
Reagan Administration's State Department.

11). Marc Grossman-----Under Secretary of State for Political Affairs. He
was Director General of the Foreign Service and Director of Human Resources
at the Department of State. Grossman is one of many of the pro-Israel Jewish
officials from the Clinton Administration that Bush has promoted to higher
posts.

12). Richard Haass-----Director of Policy Planning at the State Department
and Ambassador at large. He is also Director of National Security Programs
and Senior Fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations (CFR). He was one of
the more hawkish pro-Israel Jews in the first Bush (Sr) Administration who
sat on the National Security Council, and who consistently advocates going to
war against Iraq. Haass is also a member of the Defense Department's National
Security Study Group, at the Pentagon.

13). Robert Zoellick-----U.S. Trade Representative, a cabinet-level
position. He is also one of the more hawkish pro-Israel Jews in the Bush (Jr)
Administration who advocated invading Iraq and occupying a portion of the
country in order to set up setting up a Vichy-style puppet government. He
consistently advocates going to war against Iraq.

14). Ari Fleischer----Official White House Spokesman for the Bush (Jr)
Administration. Prominent in the Jewish community, some reports state that he
holds Israeli citizenship. Fleischer is closely connected to the extremist
Jewish group called the Chabad Lubavitch Hasidics, who follow the Qabala, and
hold very extremist and insulting views of non-Jews. Fleischer was the
co-president of Chabad's Capitol Jewish Forum. He received the Young
Leadership Award from the American Friends of Lubavitch in October, 2001.

15). James Schlesinger-----One of many Pentagon Advisors, Schlesinger also
sits on the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board under Perle and is another
extremist pro-Israel advisor, who supports going to war against Iraq.
Schlesinger is also a commissioner of the Defense Department's National
Security Study Group, at the Pentagon.

16). David Frum-----White House speechwriter behind the "Axis of Evil"
label. He lumps together all the lies and accusations against Iraq for Bush
to justify the war.

17). Joshua Bolten----White House Deputy Chief of Staff, Bolten was
previously a banker, former legislative aide, and prominent in the Jewish
community.

18). John Bolton----Under-Secretary of State for Arms Control and
International Security. Bolton is also a Senior Advisor to President Bush.
Prior to this position, Bolton was Senior Vice President of the above
mentioned pro-Israel thinktank, AEI. He recently (October 2002) accused Syria
of having a nuclear program, so that they can attack Syria after Iraq. He
must have forgotten that Israel has 400 nuclear warheads, some of which are
thermonuclear weapons (according to a recent U.S. Air Force report).

19). David Wurmser----Special Assistant to John Bolton (above), the
under-secretary for arms control and international security. Wurmser also
worked at the AEI with Perle and Bolton. His wife, Meyrav Wurmser, along with
Colonel Yigal Carmon, formerly of Israeli military intelligence, co-founded
the Middle East Media Research Institute (Memri),a Washington-based Israeli
outfit which distributes articles translated from Arabic newspapers
portraying Arabs in a bad light.

20). Eliot Cohen-----Member of the Pentagon's Defense Policy Board under
Perle and is another extremist pro-Israel advisor. Like Adelman, he often
expresses extremist and often ridiculus anti-Arab and anti-Muslim views. More
recently, he wrote an opinion article in the Wall Street Journal openly
admitting his rascist hatred of Islam claiming that Islam should be the
enemy, not terrorism.

21). Mel Sembler-----President of the Export-Import Bank of the United
States. A Prominent Jewish Republican and Former National Finance Chairman of
the Republican National Committee. The Export-Import Bank facilitates trade
relationships between U.S. businesses and foreign countries, specifically
those with financial problems.

22). Michael Chertoff ----Assistant Attorney General for the Criminal
Division, at the Justice Department.

23). Steve Goldsmith----Senior Advisor to the President, and Bush's Jewish
domestic policy advisor. He also serves as liaison in the White House Office
of Faith-Based and Community Initiatives (White House OFBCI) within the
Executive Office of the President. He was the former mayor of Indianapolis.
He is also friends with Israeli Jerusalem Mayor Ehud Olmert and often visits
Israel to coach mayors on privatization initiatives.

24). Adam Goldman-----White House's Special Liaison to the Jewish
Community.

25). Joseph Gildenhorn-----Bush Campaign's Special Liaison to the Jewish
Community. He was the DC finance chairman for the Bush campaign, as well as
campaign coordinator, and former ambassador to Switzerland.

26). Christopher Gersten-----Principal Deputy Assistant Secretary,
Administration for Children and Families at HHS. Gersten was the former
Executive Director of the Republican Jewish Coalition, Husband of Labor
Secretary, Linda Chavez, and reportedly very pro-Israel. Their children are
being raised Jewish.

27). Mark Weinberger-----Assistant Secretary of the Treasury for Tax
Policy.

28). Samuel Bodman-----Deputy Secretary of Commerce. He was the Chairman
and CEO of Cabot Corporation in Boston, Massachusetts.

29). Bonnie Cohen-----Under Secretary of State for Management.

30). Ruth Davis-----Director of Foreign Service Institute, who reports to
the Office of Under Secretary for Management. This Office is responsible for
training all Department of State staff (including ambassadors).

31). Lincoln Bloomfield-----Assistant Secretary of State for Political
Military Affairs.

32). Jay Lefkowitz-----General Counsel of the Office of Budget and
Management.

33). Ken Melman-----White House Political Director.

34). Brad Blakeman------White House Director of Scheduling.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Peace is patriotic!
Michael Santomauro
Editorial Director
253 West 72nd street #1711
New York, NY 10023 http://www.RePortersNoteBook.com
Available for Talk-Radio interviews 24hours 212-787-7891 http://reportersnotebook.com/newforum/indexforum.html
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

The QUESTION:
To subscribe and grow with knowledge or
to unsubscribe and Die Stupid? Send an E-mail to:
RePorterNoteBook@aol.com

posted 03-28-2003 08:53 AM            

I'll give you the quote off of the other forum. I don't think the people from that board want a bunch of conspiracy nuts invading... But if you're willing to take this whole conspiracy thing on faith, one more bit of evidence without a direct link should be easy

"I made a long post on there with an explanation of Contrails.....compliments of my AirCommand Manual!

I look forward to hearing their responses...

Idiots."
Posted one hour later from the same person:

"They removed my post after about 15mins.....
<------------I feel like doing this to them!

posted 03-28-2003 09:39 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by hitech_46253:
OK guys, let's analyze what Guido here insinuates. You say there was this post your cousin's sister heard of eh? WHERE? This debunked my theories so completely and it was removed. WHAT? Pretty crappy lame post here dude. Anything on MY forum is still there. All posts are sequentially numbered by yahoo and none are missing.

---

quote:

---

As to you not CARING about things, that's pretty obvious by your superficial study and careless reporting. Others on this forum HAVE taken the time to research this. The government HAS admitted to spraying biologicals on cities like San Francisco, sailors in the Navy, you can SEE IT in the satellite photo above the first gulf war, they're doing it NOW under the guise of bio-terror drills getting people CONDITIONED to accepting this as OK. Absolute refusals to check samples is what we get from the FEDs when people who DO care try to expose this.

---

posted 03-28-2003 10:43 AM            

1. Is your age really between 16 and 20?

2. Will you ever get help for your Chemmie Internet Addiction?

quote:

---

But debating with chemmies is addicting. Its like a drug. A stupid, ignorant drug

---

3. Is PDXPilot's age really between 16 and 20? If so a bright lot you young pilots are and would also explain your impatience in waiting for replies.

4. Will you ever learn to stop generalizing?

quote:

---

For those who think that his idea may be deceitful and misleading, you must remember that these people have taken to calling anyone that thinks contrails are just contrails, "Nazis, F**** lieing idiots, etc...". We have to take some crooked measures if we want to teach these people how flawed their arguments are. They will be swayed by very, very, little.

---

quote:

---

A word of warning though, if you become a "debunker" on chemtrailcentral, you will be viciously attacked verbally by the extremists on that site who will change their mind for no one. Ive learned to deal with them, but you should be prepared to be called "F**** nazi" or a government agent sent to hide the truth. I have been told 3 times to "choke on your F**** dinner you F**** Nazi!!"

---

quote:

---

They really like jumping to conclusions

---

I'd like to generalize and say that you PHXPilot, and your fellow airliners.net student pilot members like to jump to conclusions.

You seem to thrive on those who oppose your views PHXPilot, what no mention of the good people over here fighting the good fight? Which is a chemmie coined term I believe...

5. Do you really get only 3 hours of sleep a night and the remainder is spent flying on checking us out?

quote:

---

Where are all of you?

I was up till 1 last night responding to some new chemmies, then I got up at 4 this morning to do it some more. We've been having some nice banter you guys might want to get in on.

---

quote:

---

Man, Ive been checking up on chemtrailcentral every few minutes and we havent gotten one response back yet. This is quite possibly one of the longest times between chemmie posts I can remember. I think we scared them off.

---

quote:

---

..and another. I welcome PDXpilot to the debunker family

I also find it interesting that some of the new debunkers have chosen names similar to mine.

PHXPilot
PDXPilot
YYCPilot

$5 says that the chemmies will accuse you guys of really being me (PHXPilot) just under different names.

Just watch

---

Beats TV eh Pilot (oops guess I can't call you Pilot anymore--would be too confusing with in the influx and all...)

6. Do you really think you and your 13-25 yr old student pilots can get thousands of people to stop yakking about chemtrails?

quote:

---

Get on chemtrailcentral and explain what they are seeing, and we can get through to as many people as possible. Then they will stop yakking about it

---

quote:

---

Well, they seem to have caught on to the influx of debunkers.

I would like to thank all of you who decided to join and post. Hopefully some of our posts will filter through, and someone will be enlightened.

And I encourage anyone else to join and fight the good fight

---

There you go borrowing a chemmie phrase again...snort! x 2.

7.And just a thank you to Akula--here known as YYCPilot--for the plug!!

quote:

---

Come and join up, and fight the good fight over at chemtrailcentral.com!

---

And to akula, are you referring to some sort of chemmie s+m?

quote:

---

Sorry there Beefmoney, I haven't been on much this last day or so. I've had pretty full days of flying, but rest assured I will be on tonight bashing the chemmies good and hard.

---

9. One last quick question...would all the new pilots care to share the significance, if any, of their Pilot initials? DBNK is obvious no need to elaborate there...and btw are you really in the 13-15 yr old age bracket?

10. OK two last quick questions--YYCPilot, are you speaking attacked in Iraq attack terms or chemmie attack terms? You must thrive on banter with oppositional viewpoint as does PHXPilot ?

quote:

---

I can hardly wait to be attacked!
"I love the smell of debunking in the morning. It smells like....victory."

---

Kudos for your admittance of being a shit-disturber. I was one of those...as a kid...but I grew out of it

quote:

---

If I am noticing a trend...the new signups are all using the basic context of your username Beefmoney. "IDENT"Pilot, then they will know that they are dealing with the debunkers and general %$it disturbers!

---

posted 03-28-2003 11:43 AM            

quote:

---

They removed my post after about 15mins.....

---

posted 03-28-2003 11:53 AM            

As you look at these photos, notice that the storm approaches and overtakes what I've indicated ARE the CHEMTRAILS.

MIDWEST SERIES OF STORM BEING DIFFUSED BY CHEMTRAILS http://www.angelfire.com/ca3/bibletoday//chemmp.html

The first mention was in the August 4, 2002 newsletter:

(Folks, Friday I mentioned hearing a storm approaching and took some Midwest Satellite photos. A couple are forwarded to LLNews. I actually took a series of EIGHT and watched a storm INTERCEPTED. What makes this interesting is there was a CLEAR CHEMTRAIL LINE laid down ahead of the approaching storm. I then was able to SEE the storm approach and get ZAPPED by this chemtrail particulate. Since the CHEMTRAILS were laid down at a higher altitude, they 'rained' down into the approaching thunderheads. For those interested in this process, I've saved all eight photos and will send them to LLNews a couple a day so as not to overwhelm LLNews members. I'll then post the URL links so you can see this for yourselves. It was like watching a storm run into a force field or something. I've also reduced the size by half and put all eight on a single HTML page. For those that want THIS, email me directly here at: hitech@smithville.net and I'll send you a copy. It's 271KB in size. If you don't think this is an important topic, just LOOK at the RELATED stories on DROUGHT below! Here are the initial photos at LLNews

Midwest Satellite 08-02-2002 0445pm http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LLNews/message/2391

Midwest Satellite 08-02-2002 0500pm http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LLNews/message/2392

Midwest Satellite 08-02-2002 0515pm.jpg http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LLNews/message/2402

Midwest Satellite 08-02-2002 0530pm.jpg http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LLNews/message/2406

Midwest Satellite 08-02-2002 0545pm http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LLNews/message/2413

Midwest Satellite 08-02-2002 0600pm http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LLNews/message/2426

Midwest Satellite 08-02-2002 0615pm http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LLNews/message/2431

Midwest Satellite 08-02-2002 0630pm http://groups.yahoo.com/group/LLNews/message/2437

posted 03-28-2003 04:31 PM            

2. Will you ever get help for your Chemmie Internet Addiction?

If my addiction is trying to combat ignorance, then no.

What you dont seem to understand is this: This theory you have all put together is not somthing that can be taken lightly. It is a horrible fabrication that puts a bad light on aviation and the government. I am trying to teach you the reality of what you see. You dont want this. You WANT to stay blinded in your dream world. You need someone to blame for the clouds, your cough, your cold, the drought, the wind, the sun, the heat. You found your scapegoat in chemtrails. You turned beautiful water crystals formed from engine exaust into ugly chemical poison spread by the nazi government. I can not tolerate you spreading this around as truth when it quite obviously is not. Ignorant, and unknowledgable people will grab hold of it as undeniable truth and go telling there friends until we have a rampaging mob of ignorant people trying to shoot down or disable airliners (which I have heard a few people on here suggest). This is unacceptable. Why do I spend so much time on here? Because I want this dead. Thats why. It helps no one, and it hurts everyone. There is no truth in chemtrails. Only misleading lies. Why do you keep banning debunkers? Because you do not want to be enlightened. You want chemtrails to exist. You have said that you would be happy if you found out chemtrails dont exist. We try to explain why they dont and you kick us out. You like believing in chemtrails. You cant stand around believing that your problems are caused by other things. You just conveniently trace all your problems back to these poison trails. If chemtrails didnt exist, you would go insane. You would have to find somthing or someone else to blame the problems on.

You want to know the truth? Then research from non-biased resources about contrails.

You want to stay blind, and live in a fictitous world? Then keep us out.

Choose.

posted 03-28-2003 07:46 PM            

Now as for my involvement with any possible spraying with reference to my post on the other site, nope, unless someone fitted my Twin Commanche with some sort of spraying device.

And I would also think that getting an influx of some of the more senior fliers from the other message boards could be of great benefit, seeing as they can bring practical knowledge and experience to this debate. Even I could be convinced, given the right proof.