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Author
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Topic: CONTRAILS verses CHEMTRAILS | Topic page views:
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 03-17-2003 08:38 PM
   
Glad to hear it Lulu.Here's the deal, I will take a close up photo of the aircraft creating a long lasting, billowy, contrail so I can use my airline livery and aircraft type knowledge to ID the aircraft so we wont have any vauge "it looked white and big" airplane identifications that I see so often on here. I will listen to Albuquerqe and LA center ( enroute air traffic control) while watching these aircraft to get the low-down on the clearances they are getting so I can tell you how and why they are making the patterns you see. And I will keep an eye on the contrail for a few hours after it was created to watch for anything strange. I would have taken some time this afternoon to do this, but it has been low overcast and rainy for the last 2 days so I havent had a chance. And remember that I have alot of things on my schedule from 7:00 till 4:00, so once I have time in the afternoon I will see what I can get for you guys.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by PHXPilot on 03-17-2003] 
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Lulu
ice behaving badly
right here
2553 posts, Dec 2000
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posted 03-17-2003 08:52 PM
Sounds good, thanks Pilot!
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hitech_46253
Senior Member
Indianapolis, IN U.S.
499 posts, May 2001
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posted 03-18-2003 07:44 AM
So,,,, Lulu apppears after a few days to support another debunkie. How surprising..NOT! Especially after PROVING her debunkie mentality by asking for something in the 'drought thread' then totally ignoring the response laid at her unworthy feet.We know what you're all about Lulu. It's certainly has NOTHING to do with searching out the TRUTH!
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CaptWalker
logic infuser
99 posts, Feb 2003
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posted 03-18-2003 09:24 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Jeanie:
Pleeeease, don't waste our time with your silly questions.... in addition to what I see with my discerning eyes regarding the crazyness going on aloft.
First, I wasn't asking you Jeanie. Second you ONCE AGAIN (and again, and again, and again...) confuse fact with speculation. Golly, if we knew we could rely on your discerning eye to tell us the truth we would have come up with a better way of camoflaging the spraying. I mean, what were we thinking doing it right in front of you, let alone millions of people?
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Lulu
ice behaving badly
right here
2553 posts, Dec 2000
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posted 03-18-2003 09:29 AM
Larry I asked you specifically to post a satellite grab and explain how it relates to chemtrails. You failed to do this. And only one grab per day Larry, when the weather can change at the drop oif a hat...not very scientific eh Lar? >>However, I take one shot usually in the afternoon.<< A good chance for you to demonstrate how chemtrails are causing droughts, but not surprising you didn't follow through. So Larry I didn't ignore your post, just waiting for the ACTUAL reply to my post. An actual posted satellite picture and detailed explanation of the drought it is causing. And you expect me to believe you didn't know Thermit replied with a question on your Afghan Drought thread...what with the way you're on your thread replies like white on rice...paallleeeassseee. Gimme a break. More lies from the King of Liars. >>Lulu apppears after a few days to support another debunkie.<< Actually Larry, I am in support of GOOD IDEAS, regardless of where they originate. Got that? PHXPilot offered a very good idea!! Instead of encouraging that, you go off on another tangent. Your credibility is about zero Lar, and that's being generous 
[Edited 1 times, lastly by Lulu on 03-18-2003]
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hitech_46253
Senior Member
Indianapolis, IN U.S.
499 posts, May 2001
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posted 03-18-2003 11:17 AM
Anybody else here read what Lulu asked for and my response actually BELIEVE what she just wrote here???
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bigjoe
Weather Observer
Western New York
303 posts, Dec 2002
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posted 03-18-2003 11:27 AM
Not good enought PHX!!! Absolutely not good enough!!! Get up there in your jet like I asked you to in my previous posting and document for us a chem attack for us all to see FROM THE SKY!!! NOT FROM THE GROUND!!! And then post it on this website for all of us to see. ANYBODY CAN TAKE PHOTOS FROM THE GROUND!!! And I won't believe your commentary anyway, so it's useless for you to do it from the ground only!!! I want sky photos, and you have access to a jet. Put your money where your mouth is!!! And you wonder why I don't take you debunkers seriously!!!
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Jeanie
Senior Member
North East U.S.A.
551 posts, Nov 2001
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posted 03-18-2003 02:23 PM
The so called "untouchables" have gall and would spray right in your face if you happened to be close enough. Nothing sneaky going on here, after all who's going to stop you when you are 35,000 ft in the air and those on the ground have no idea where you took off from and have no proof as to who's giving the orders. Someone or group is meeting behind closed doors to orchestrate what planes go where and when. Maybe we believers in chemtrails should get together and hire a private investigator. My apologies Capt. for responding to a question I wasn't directly asked, can't say as I noticed the debunkers holding back from commenting on anything anyone says on this site. I'll try to control myself in the future but can't make any absolute promises. Peace
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the professor
KNOW YOUR ROLE
heartland USA
1164 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 03-18-2003 03:01 PM
In PHX's defense you must admit the photos he posted were actually contrails, Do you
think he would actually show film that he
has shot himself as a spray operation, I
think not unless maybe he were to fly into
one (a spray operation) I wouldn't suspect
nothing other than contrail photos.
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CaptWalker
logic infuser
99 posts, Feb 2003
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posted 03-18-2003 04:07 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Jeanie:
My apologies Capt. for responding to a question I wasn't directly asked, can't say as I noticed the debunkers holding back from commenting on anything anyone says on this site. I'll try to control myself in the future but can't make any absolute promises. Peace
My fault for jumping on you, but the question I posed to BigJoe is a legitimate one. He had said that CT's most definately had to do with weather. PHX started a string requesting CT believers to post why they thought CT's existed, what they were used for and who was behind it. You have to agree that there is no consensus amongst CT believers, I've seen weather mod, communication enhancement/blocking, health reasons, greenhouse gasses.... I am truly interested in why somebody would say they absolutely had to do with weather. I've seen the photo LL posted and I sincerely don't see anything strange. In the first photo there is a storm over Illinois and in the last it is over all of southern Indiana with no visible deflection/depletion/reformation...
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bigjoe
Weather Observer
Western New York
303 posts, Dec 2002
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posted 03-18-2003 04:40 PM
PHX Pilot. Please. NO long excuses and NO long explanations, can you do that? All I want from you is a simple YES or NO answer to this question:
Will you go up in your jet with your 600mm telephoto lens and photograph a "spraying operation" in progress for us and post your resulting photos on this website?PLEASE, just a YES or NO answer.
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 03-18-2003 04:51 PM
What the hell??? BigJoe, I thought we were getting somewhere. Now you come back with that craptastic response??? What did I tell you before? I CANNOT just take one of the jets whenever I want and go take photos up there tailing jets around! Thats why I said that I would do what you wanted, only from the ground. It case you didnt notice, it costs a TON of money to rent an aircraft. To rent a twin piper for 1 hour is 150$. I dont have that kind of money to spend going up and taking photos I could be taking on the ground. Besides, even if I could go get those photos, you would still say "NOT GOOD ENOUGH". You tell me why photos from the ground arent good enough for you.I give my time to you guys by sitting outside for hours listening to ATC and taking photos of airliners crossing the sky, and all most of you say is "not good enough". So the only thing good enough for you is somthing that is not even possible. Wonderful. I was trying to get back on your friendly side because I was sick of just hurling insults, so I tried to cooperate with you and even go beyond that, but all you guys do is come back with more crap! You guys arent trying to find the truth. You are trying to make chemtrails exist no matter what evidence says. That isnt truth.
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 03-18-2003 04:53 PM
BigJoe: No. Because I cannot do that. I am wiling to do it from the ground though. But for some reason that isnt good enough.So lets tell me to do somthing that I cant do so it looks like I am trying to keep the truth from coming out when I refuse to do it! Good plan bigjoe!
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Jeanie
Senior Member
North East U.S.A.
551 posts, Nov 2001
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posted 03-18-2003 05:06 PM
I've seen weather mod, communication enhancement/blocking, health reasons, greenhouse gasses.... Capt. Do I understand correctly that you are acknowledging chemtrail use for weather mod; communication effects, global warming?
Personally, I wouldn't elaborate on details of my beliefs and proofs for, thinking possibly the government would like to know just how much the public understands about this operation. I'm not saying you are govt; maybe you are, maybe you are not. Only you know for sure.
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 03-18-2003 09:31 PM
Everytime I read your posts on this page BigJoe, I want to punch the monitor. Im not just angry because of what you said but your sudden change in your stance toward me. When I first saw this from you: "I think that a 600mm lens is an excellent tool for capturing images of the distant jets high overhead. And please don't forget to use a wide angle lens too, for the overall views of the "chemmed" skies. I'm looking forward to seeing your photos. Many thanks!" I thought that we might be getting somewhere in our effort to find out if chemtrails exist or not.I was very happy that you supported my proposition. Now, I havent changed any of my plan and this is what you come back with today: "Not good enought PHX!!! Absolutely not good enough!!! Get up there in your jet like I asked you to in my previous posting and document for us a chem attack for us all to see FROM THE SKY!!! NOT FROM THE GROUND!!! And then post it on this website for all of us to see. ANYBODY CAN TAKE PHOTOS FROM THE GROUND!!! And I won't believe your commentary anyway, so it's useless for you to do it from the ground only!!! I want sky photos, and you have access to a jet. Put your money where your mouth is!!! And you wonder why I don't take you debunkers seriously!!!What happened???? Only you know why you suddenly had a change of heart. Lets pick this apart. Not good enought PHX!!! Absolutely not good enough!!! Why not? It seemed good enough before, why not now. And whenever one of the chemmies on here gets photos from the ground it is accepted like it is from the mouth of God. Get up there in your jet like I asked you to in my previous posting and document for us a chem attack for us all to see FROM THE SKY!!! Its not my plane!! I cant just walk in, take the Caravan or Citation, and say "Ill be back later". It doesnt work that way. ANYBODY CAN TAKE PHOTOS FROM THE GROUND!!! But very few people on here can adequately explain what is on those photos. Thats what I was planning to do for you. And I won't believe your commentary anyway, I figured as much. If I come up with actual, non-evil, explainations for what you are seeing, you need to find a reason to dis-regard it. "but it was taken from the ground, not the sky" will be your response. As if I cant remember how ATC works when I am on the ground. I want sky photos, and you have access to a jet. I have access to this aircraft on certain days (very few) for training purposes (CRM, IFR training). I cant go use it to chase airliners around taking photos. A million dollar aircraft is not a golf cart. You cant go tool around in it for no good reason. Put your money where your mouth is!!! And you wonder why I don't take you debunkers seriously!!! You dont take us seriously because we dont own a multi-million dollar jet? Wow, then you dont take 99% of the world seriously. Good luck with that. And I dont have that much money.
[Edited 5 times, lastly by PHXPilot on 03-18-2003]
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Lulu
ice behaving badly
right here
2553 posts, Dec 2000
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posted 03-18-2003 11:35 PM
>>You guys arent trying to find the truth. You are trying to make chemtrails exist no matter what evidence says.<<Generalizing isn't cool PHXPilot. I thought your idea was a good one, and I am definitely trying to find the truth. >>And I won't believe your commentary anyway<< BigJoe wasn't it you who said no need to listen to the debunkers, only listen to yourself? "YOU KNOW what's real for you. You don't need bigjoe, PHX, Cannex, or F.K. to tell you what's real or true. Tune into your own "Inner Wisdom", Lulu. Lulu needs to ask Lulu", and nobody else."
http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001726-2.html So what gives BigJoe? Why do you need proof from Pilot on anything. You apparently already have all the answers...
[Edited 1 times, lastly by Lulu on 03-18-2003]
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hitech_46253
Senior Member
Indianapolis, IN U.S.
499 posts, May 2001
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posted 03-19-2003 06:53 AM
NO YOU ARE NOT trying to find the truth Lulu! Go back a bit people where she asks me to post some satellite pics, then decries that there's only one per day. On the drought thread there's a clear lineage of 8 shots, one every 15 minutes that she's never bothered to comment on. It CLEARLY identifies what are the chemtrails and what is the oncoming storm front and CLEARLY shows the storm front dissolved as the two mix.You wouldn't admit or see the truth if it was right in front of you Lulu. Which it has been all along. Instead you cozy up to any debunkie that comes along on this list. We've got your number and it's a big fat ZERO!
[Edited 1 times, lastly by hitech_46253 on 03-19-2003]
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bigjoe
Weather Observer
Western New York
303 posts, Dec 2002
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posted 03-19-2003 07:15 AM
I've simply expressed my own personal thoughts, feelings and opionions on this issue, Lulu, which is what this website is (hopefully) still all about. I have nothing to hide, and nothing "gives". I stand behind everything that I've said. It's all down in black and white for everyone to see on these postings. I can't help it if certain people may disagree with me. That's their right and privilege, and as such I respect this. But likewise, when somebody disagrees with my own thoughts and viewpoints, I expect this right and privilege to be granted to me also.
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Lulu
ice behaving badly
right here
2553 posts, Dec 2000
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posted 03-19-2003 09:36 AM
Bigjoe--I'll ask this again--why do you need proof from PHXPilot??? Please try to answer this question!>>Get up there in your jet like I asked you to in my previous posting and document for us a chem attack for us all to see FROM THE SKY!!!<<
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bigjoe
Weather Observer
Western New York
303 posts, Dec 2002
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posted 03-19-2003 11:11 AM
This thread has now become negative, ugly and angry and I think that we're also starting to get into some pretty heavy duty "mind games" here, of which I will not let myself be dragged into. PHX Pilot can have all the temper tantrums that he wants, but I refuse to have any part of them. This is my last posting on this thread.
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Lulu
ice behaving badly
right here
2553 posts, Dec 2000
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posted 03-19-2003 11:25 AM
Yeah talk about evasive mind games bigjoe! And talk about contradictory statements on your part. So you will not answer a simple question? >>This thread has now become negative, ugly and angry<< I agree, especially your posts to PHXPilot... quote:
Not good enought PHX!!! Absolutely not good enough!!! Get up there in your jet like I asked you to in my previous posting and document for us a chem attack for us all to see FROM THE SKY!!! NOT FROM THE GROUND!!! And then post it on this website for all of us to see. ANYBODY CAN TAKE PHOTOS FROM THE GROUND!!! And I won't believe your commentary anyway, so it's useless for you to do it from the ground only!!! I want sky photos, and you have access to a jet. Put your money where your mouth is!!! And you wonder why I don't take you debunkers seriously!!!
And you wonder why I don't take bigjoe seriously... >>PHX Pilot can have all the temper tantrums that he wants, but I refuse to have any part of them.<< You are the one throwing the hissy fit bigjoe, IMO.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by Lulu on 03-19-2003]
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emfx13
Moderator
Hayward Ca.U.S.A.
801 posts, May 2002
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posted 03-19-2003 11:39 AM
REAL EYE'S/REALIZE/REAL LIE'S
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 03-19-2003 04:31 PM
Generalizing isn't cool PHXPilot. I thought your idea was a good one, and I am definitely trying to find the truth.My first draft of that post was "certain members on here obviously arent interested in finding the truth about chemtrails. They want to force chemtrails to exist no matter what the evidence says". When I re-typed the comment, I never put the "certain members" portion in. My bad. Many fols on here actually seem to be looking at both sides to make an honest judgement. Other people, on the other hand.... I've simply expressed my own personal thoughts, feelings and opionions on this issue, Lulu, which is what this website is (hopefully) still all about. I have nothing to hide, and nothing "gives". I stand behind everything that I've said. It's all down in black and white for everyone to see on these postings. I can't help it if certain people may disagree with me. That's their right and privilege, and as such I respect this. But likewise, when somebody disagrees with my own thoughts and viewpoints, I expect this right and privilege to be granted to me also. All I want to know, bigjoe, is why you had such a dramatic change of heart from the time you first read my proposition, to the time you posted you "not good enough" rant. All I can imagine is that once you started to do some thinking about my plan to keep very detailed records about what actually happens on your "spray days", you realized that I might come up with hard-core evidence that will come to the conclusion that it is all normal airliner and aviation operations. One you realized that might happen, you had to give the chemmies a reason to disregard any observations I came forward with and the end of my study. So you tell everyone that no one should believe my observations because they were conducted on the ground, no in the air, like you wanted. I still dont understand this. Why would my knowledge of aviation operations be any less on the ground? If ATC tells United 3763 to descend to FL320, it is still the same clearance whether I am listing on the ground or the air. So I can come to the same conclusion in either place. That aircraft changed altitude, not because he was "missing a spot" but because he was going to cause a traffic hazard so he had to be cleared below the offending traffic. Why this conslusion would be considered invalid to you because I was on the ground at the time is anyones guess, bigjoe.
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CaptWalker
logic infuser
99 posts, Feb 2003
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posted 03-20-2003 04:01 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Jeanie:
I've seen weather mod, communication enhancement/blocking, health reasons, greenhouse gasses.... Capt. Do I understand correctly that you are acknowledging chemtrail use for weather mod; communication effects, global warming?
No, I was saying that I've seen CT believers profess the reason for the spraying was all of those things. I do think that spraying a substance into the air is very possible, I just don't think it's going on to the extent that CT believers do. I don't question the patents but that doesn't mean that they're using them, I don't question that a company in FL sprayed trying to kill a cloud and that their goal is to put a dent into a hurricane (whatever became of that? they were supposed to do it last season, but I guess it didn't work or we would have heard about it). I can't refute that CT are a possibility, but I've seen no evidence that they are a reality.
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hitech_46253
Senior Member
Indianapolis, IN U.S.
499 posts, May 2001
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posted 03-21-2003 11:25 AM
And these silly debunkies NEVER address the FACT that the government has already ADMITTED to doing these things.Let's repeat for Capt. McFly. T h e y H a v e A d m i t t e d I t ! !
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