posted 04-21-2004 12:52 PM            

I'm concerned that we stay united and refrain from allowing disrupters whose sole aim is to distract into argumentation on a personal level in order to take our attention away from our goals, readings, and research. It does not matter whether the intentions are purposeful or not.

On many sites, the stipulation of joining entails a written and stated rule that those who join agree on the purpose and united goal of the board. For example, on Democrats.com, in order to join, you MUST be a Democrat. No Republicans or other party members are allowed. And yes, this is free speech, just as women's clubs, men's clubs, various political clubs, and various organizations limit their membership to those who share the same vision. So should this board adopt that principle. The purpose for this organizational confluence, although based in human nature, is to assure the progress of the group's goals. Whether the group's organizational goals are built upon furthering scientific investigation, exploring the natures of reality, joining in political change, uniting in a group educational goal, or any of a myriad of groupings, the fact remains that distracters and disrupters negatively influence the progress of any group.

This board is named CHEMTRAIL CENTRAL.

For those who do not agree or show effort to learn about this subject -- they shall be on "probation" if you will. They can scream about free speech all they want, but just as any club or organization limits and describes it membership, they cannot be a member if they prove themselves
opposing every premise of the club's formation. Would a bowler join a swimming club? -- to pose it bluntly.

Just as in the wide world of real life organizations, the net world organizes in parallel. Obviously, before I even joined, this group of individuals formed solidarity with the agreement and stipulation that all would contribute to the acquiring of truth and knowledge of aerosol spraying called "chemtrails." If I had not studied in advance and educated myself on the subject, I would not have joined at all. I might have read out of curiosity, but I would not have posted realizing my social position in reference to the group. It's truly a matter of respect and life knowledge. Would I go to a Near Death Experience site and proclaim that everyone there was hallucinating if I strongly held that notion? No, because I respect. Would I join a pro-logging board and scream environmental forest preservation and expect to remain a member? No, because I know my place and it wouldn't further my cause as enmity rarely does. Also considering that creating disunity and disruption seems to be the hallmark of debunker behavior, and this board has had a history in such deviant hosting -- I recommend that the membership be tightened.

All free societies contain smaller circles of social-organizational gatherings. It is legal, democratic, and perfectly socially acceptable to limit membership in a group to those who share the group's goals. Those who do not share the goals will not be allowed.

After a probationary period, they will simply and politely be told to leave. In this way, there will be no hassles, no personal-level argumentative distractions, and thus a furthering of the goal of the board itself.

On the subjects not related to chemtrails, the board, I feel, could be more loose in its requirements on debate and argumentation. But for the main subject and purpose of this board, I suggest the moderators rewrite the rules to include a probationary period of proper behavior that includes the acceptance of the reality of chemtrails in one's posting.

If this seems narrow and confining to any of you, then I suggest you look at the wasted time and emotion we have all spent in trying to convince either a debunker or an ignorant soul of the very existence of aerosol spraying itself. Should I mention the wasted time of allowing those same types onto the board and then reaping the consequences of hacking and manipulation?

Letxa's negative commentary to a curious student on two threads regarding the subject of chemtrails and the nature of the members who have learned about them was enough, finally, to awaken me to the need to discriminate and do it with objectivity and grace. It is democratic, it is organizationally sound, and it is obviously needed on CHEMTRAIL CENTRAL.

Thanks,

Boomer Chick

Could we have a board vote, or a level of discussion on this?

posted 04-21-2004 12:57 PM            

Hello and welcome to Chemtrail Central.

The forums have been created for those who are concerned about the reality of Chemtrails.

Those who aren't sure, want to learn more, or don't acknowledge the reality of Chemtrails are also invited to participate. Please show respect for your fellow posters. Rudeness and derision may be grounds for loss of posting rights at the discretion of the administrator.

Please be aware that if you do not supply a valid email address, you will not receive your initial password. The administrator of the board will have no way of informing you if this occurs. If you do not receive your password within a few minutes or hours of registration, this is the reason. You may mail the administrator or reregister to correct this problem.

The fine print:

posted 04-21-2004 01:19 PM            

I run radarmatrix.com and I provide a lot of information that is very useful to those on this board. I personally broke the story about BAE buying HAARP. I recently posted that HAARP was doing an experiment of very weird proportions. I provide a one stop place to find documentations and stories. I would like to be able to post on the chemtrail activist board. I have yet to fully attack that issue but will soon. When i put my mind and resources to something I produce results.

At this point if the rules are not changed I am going to exit and sit back and watch good people wither away from this forum out of disgust.

Like CTTUSA, I will round up all the good people there and take them to my own forum and show them what unity is. I sniffed out all of my disinformants and I have a great forum that includes people who provide excellent news and converse without the frustration of those who try and create a wedge.

This posting is exactly what they are trying to achieve only without this beginning process. They want people to just be frustrated and leave. I'm walking towards the door and I think many here are starting to get to that point.

Get united or be divided!

posted 04-21-2004 02:16 PM            

quote:

---

Those who aren't sure, want to learn more, or don't acknowledge the reality of Chemtrails are also invited to participate. Please show respect for your fellow posters. Rudeness and derision may be grounds for loss of posting rights at the discretion of the administrator.

---

Possible rewrite:

Those who do not acknowledge the reality of chemtrails and/or aerosol spraying will not be allowed to join. Those who are curious will be allowed to join on a probationary basis. If any posts reflect a debating nature, or show inappropriate question asking, or reflect a disruptive influence --the member posting will be banned. No exceptions. This is a goal-oriented board dedicated to the sharing and research of chemtrails/aerosol spraying. It is not our job to educate others, although information is readily available in links, photos, and discussions for those who wish to read.

All other subjects besides chemtrails will be allowed more leeway on debate and disagreement all with the stipulation and understanding of the rules regarding typical board decorum.

no flaming

no personal criticisms or digs

no profanity

(and then the other parts already written will be still be included)

ANY OTHER IDEAS ON REWRITES? PLEASE POST!

We need to unite as a board and come to consensus on this!

Mods? Members?

posted 04-21-2004 04:47 PM            

A difference of opinion IS a good thing on a discussion board. It brings thoughts together and helps form conclusions that might not otherwise be reached in a sole effort. Group minds functioning as ONE are a beautiful thing to behold. That type of atmosphere is obtainable and can be reached here with a few minor changes put in place. Although it is not up to us to decide if new rules should be written, I do feel a change here would serve to generate more activity. Many people do not post here because they are afraid of ridicule and exposure. This board should be a place of open exchange and not a place of distraction! When a piece of information is disclosed, we should be allowed to dissect it, discuss it, and form conclusions in virtual peace. Yes, at times we disagree with belief systems or ideas - that is to be expected. But we should NEVER have to tolerate distracters when their sole purpose is derogatory in nature of the overt or covert kind.

To use part of an analogy that was recently in the news: We WASTE a considerable amount of time here swatting flies. Just think of what could have been discussed instead of arguing with some SILLY member(s) that claim they are only looking for answers. Ha! What a bunch of bull! Anyone that “truly” wants to find answers to chemtrails is always provided with resources when asked. They in turn take it upon themselves to form an opinion of belief or disbelief. If an agenda full of lies and deceit is exposed or becomes obvious, we should not be obligated to further oblige the game player. Neither should current members be twisted to appear as if they are NOT providing sought for information. I do not appreciate being used as a pawn in these type of games! They can play the innocent observer all they want, but many of us find this behavior QUITE ANNOYING!

I do not need someone balancing information for me by providing opposing viewpoints either. I can find it all by myself. All I’d have to do to hear “from the other side” is turn on the TV and be told what to think. I could stop forming my own conclusions! I must say that I bless the day Mojoman came here for two main reasons – 1) I was able to learn a lot about his theories (especially since I always wondered what they were; and 2) he distracted Letxa (sorry!) which allowed the rest of us to keep plugging out the Chemtrail and Anti-NWO information. I must also admit that at times I have contemplated leaving this board for the very reasons stated here today.

posted 04-21-2004 09:10 PM            

This discussion is a replay of what we went through last year in relation to PHX Pilot, culminating in the downfall of the Council and victory to the debunkers.
http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000085.html
http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000093.html
http://www.chemtrailcentral.com/ubb/Forum2/HTML/000095.html

This is the addition to CTC regulations that I proposed last year and Mech did not support:
“CTC moderators reserve the right to exclude from the forum any person falsely claiming to know that a very large-scale programme of aerosol (chemtrail) spraying is not being implemented, or indicating explicitly or by his/her attitude or manner of that he/she regards as unworthy of serious consideration claims made by other participants that they do have knowledge of the reality of such an ongoing aerosol spraying programme.”

posted 04-22-2004 06:11 AM            

If you would like an invite just email me at guitarzen@aol.com

posted 04-22-2004 09:23 AM            

Remember the ruless here are Thermit's. If you want them changed, you will have to privately message him (not email) and discuss the matter with him.

posted 04-22-2004 09:51 AM            

I have repeatily asked about getting into the chemtrail activist thread by you Mech and i got nothing. I bet you didnt even mention it to anyone else. I emailed the moderators and almost all got kicked back to me. What is up with that? the emails don't work? One has an email of email@email.com.....what the heck is that?

i would like to consider myself a pretty good asset to have around but this ship is turning into the Letxa disent forum.

You just watch, once I leave this forum how often I am attacked by him. His little underhanded jabs. Like the way he started in this forum with a 2 week study on me without my knowledge. Which came with a conclusion no less yet he still seems to think he needs more info. though he didnt need it to form his conclusion.

posted 04-22-2004 10:01 AM            

Again....SEE ABOVE my last message.

Whatever Letxa or you do on other forums is NONE of my buisness.

EMM:"I'm a leader and not a follower and you should too Mech."

Ummmm...

posted 04-22-2004 10:16 AM            

Mojoman, I am amused and enlightened by some of your posts. You are much more a valuable asset than Letxa, because on some other forums, there are people like him that do exactly the same. Disruption is the name of their game. I had a month long debate with a meat eater who came onto a vegetarina board, and insisted that vitamin B12 COULD NOT be manufactured within our own body. No matter how much data and perosnal experience I showed, he would keep saying derogatory things. Finally, he cursed me left and right, and then the noderator banned him.

Now there is a mention of near death experience vs hallucination discussion as some kind of litmus test. I assume that would be myself and Thetaloops. I still maintain that most NBE's are DMT infused experiences. Does that make me a candidate to be banned? Seems like by these new "rules" being postulated, that would, since there are a lot of people here that believe it's angels and demons.

Is Mech a candidate because he likes Aaron Russo? Should Thermit can his ass because of that? Mech and Shatoga think the 2nd Amendment is of first importance, I believe it is a tie between the First and Fourth. Should somebody be banned, if the majority believe it is the sixth?

Do we take votes of various subjects, and if you sway from the popular opinion, are you banned?

As far as chemtrails go, yes they exist (Whew! I'm OK to stay?). I'm not sure of the purpose...Sunlight blocking, Geo-Engineering, Radar Skipping, HAARP related, microbes in them.

posted 04-22-2004 10:59 AM            

My outlining an example using boards that come together in like mind and inserting one's opposing view, like NDE's and hallucinations, was only an example of human dynamics which you yourself have experienced. On this board, as halva has written and I have written, the goal and acceptance of chemtrails acceptance is primary. All other topics, even the ones you mentioned ARE NOT changed in the new tightening of membership rules. GET IT?

Please get your facts straight on this issue before pontificating, thanks!

Letxa DID badger, DID bait, and DID disrupt and continues to on the chemtrail issue. His discrediting mojo on our board and challenging him was not appreciated but even under the new rules as suggested would not have alerted the mods to any banning, except for the language.

THANKS!

posted 04-22-2004 11:02 AM            

If there is an American who can act as a leader on this issue I will follow his/her lead. Otherwise I will simply keep trying to help foreigners become adequate to the task of liberating Americans.

posted 04-22-2004 11:12 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by halva:
We had all of this out before over PHX Pilot. I made it clear that for me this is an issue of whether Americans can liberate themselves or whether they have to be liberated by foreigners.

If there is an American who can act as a leader on this issue I will follow his/her lead. Otherwise I will simply keep trying to help foreigners become adequate to the task of liberating Americans.

---

ALL HAIL HALVA!!!!!

Oh, thank you good King Wayne, we lowly Americans gravel at your feet in thanks for saving us.

Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you
Thank you

Sheesh

posted 04-22-2004 11:14 AM            

I realize it will take time.

posted 04-22-2004 12:34 PM            

quote:

---

Stacy: Realize that chemtrails are "conspiracy theory" that, in terms of general acceptance, is less plausible and believed by far fewer people than the JFK conspiracy, UFOs, and crop circles. Also realize that most (all?) of the people that believe in chemtrails lack relevant education or experience while most (all?) atmospheric scientists and commercial, military, and private pilots reject that chemtrails are anything but persistent contrails.

---

A debunker (aware or unaware of his/her motivations) does not need to use flaming language to disrupt, invalidate the subject of a board, and try to discredit the members of the board.

Thermit under rules for CT Science Forum

quote:

---

a. I will ruthlessly delete any flaming of people or ideas. This includes name-calling.
b. I will delete or move posts which take a thread off-topic.
c. I will delete material which openly proselytizes or advertises for religions, products or particular points of view. This includes proselytizing for the pro-chemtrail or the anti-chemtrail side. This forum will look at hard data, not personal opinions.
d. I will delete anything else that seems inappropriate. If you object, put a message in my message box and I will consider it.

---

Under "Other Trails:"

Letxa:

quote:

---

Whether or not you agree with me on the issues, the most useful discussion is that which challenges your beliefs. Patting each other on and saying one to another, "Yep, the government is evil" and "Yep, you're right, there are chemtrails" and patting each other on the back serves no intellectual purpose. You apparently strive to live in a comfortable environment without anything to make waves that would even slightly rock your boat. Interestingly, that's strikingly similar to what you accuse most of the population of doing by being "ignorant" of these important conspiracies. Why do you strive to live in an environment which you criticize others for living in?

---

Swamp:

quote:

---

That's why I like Megasprayer's and Method of Destruction's Rules. If you are a debunker or disinformant, you are banned. Language is secondary.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Letxa: Then I am sure there is a lot of stimulating discussion there . Shutting up the opposition is always the best way to deal with opposing viewpoints, right? Such a policy of immediately banning an opponent does not violate free speech since they are not the government and it is their forum, but it certainly violates the spirit of free speech we treasure in this country. It makes me wonder if their values are really in line with the values of most Americans or more similar to those of facism and censorship.

---

Swamp:

quote:

---

That is a very ignorant statement Lexie. Megasprayer is THE BEST site specifically for chemtrails. The mods there simply had enough of people coming in, calling them names, threatening them, and naysaying everything. And you know what? There is PLENTY of discussion on chemtrails and other subjects. We learn by friendly exchange. We disagree on there, and nobdy attacks, because we realize we are all on the side of the Little Guy. You have seen Mech and I disagree, I'm sure, on CTC. Almost passionate at times. We have met on occasions, and look each other in the eyes, and we know we are on the same side again. The little issues will auto-correct over time. The big issues, chemtrails, New World Order, Globalization, Brainwashing, and Eternal War are what we agree upon. If you want to really find out what goes on behind the scenes, stick around, we'll be glad to discuss. If you are dead set that everybody is out of their minds, and paranoid, then get lost, and do us a favor. I don't mean to be rude, but that is the truth.

To make my final statement succinct:

There simply is not enough time to waste arguing points that a schoolchild would understand.

---

Letxa:

quote:

---

As I've said many times here at CTC, I'm not a Bush supporter. I'm here to debate and I think we all learn from that UNTIL such time as the name-calling begins. I don't presume to be perfect but, honestly, I've never been the one that started the name-calling in any given thread. I think the reason so many people here fail to see the usefulness of healthy disagreement is that as soon as someone disagrees it doesn't take long before the CTC folks start flaming and ridiculing. Once that happens, little will be gained from any discussion.

---

SMT:

quote:

---

Over and over chemtrail researchers have provided evidence of chemtrails,
over and over and over. And over and over and over posters like Lex ignore it and repeat like a parrot with severe dementia, "prove it." So we again do and then they run away and a few posts later are asking the exact same questions. Did I mention insincerity is one of the easiest things to spot in internet communication. Real "debunkers" versus those who really want to know stick out like sore thumbs. Chemtrails programs are quite real, evidence of them is EASILY found now, and those who deny then are either underinformed, misinformed, or as I tend to think most likely disingenous.

SmT

---

Wolf:

quote:

---

This, however, is not "proof" that every persistent contrails that you see are in fact chemicals being sprayed on you. In fact I am willing to bet that those tests have proven just how futile it would be to spray chemical from 30,000 feet.

These things may very well be true, but they do not constitute proof that the resistant contrails that you observe above you, which have been documented as originating from commercial airline flights are anything other than that, persistent contrails.

Chemtrails are not real.

No one is out to get you.

---

electricmojoman:

quote:

---

In fact I called my local news to bring up the persistant contrails and I got a flat answer that it was the military doing exercises. Point blank. You should study the links about the Salt lake experiments in which the DOE tested perfluorocarbon tracers and how they tracked it spread across the US. The chemical aspect is from a electromagnetic structure. That is why Barium and perfluorcarbons need to be tested more in the air. I agree we need more people confirming this. Feel free to do so yourself.

Chemtrails are real. Skyline to SkyLine Condensation does not happen in such a manor and at such a high frequency. We are talking about freezing here. When a hot air collides with cold it condensates and goes away as it blends in. Such as your breath or the tail pipe on your car. It does not create long lines that stay. It blends it's temperature back in. If you would do a study you would find that many days that produce clear blue skys are also producing really large clouds from contrails. How is that? If the weather itself is not making clouds, how does a jet contrail end up going skyline to skyline and fan out into overcast?

You're nothing more of a nay-sayer Wolf. There is proof o'plenty at your door step but if you wish to believe it all not true you should move on. You either get it or don't. How long are you going to spend in a forum on something you don't believe in and what is your reasoning?

---

And the debate about the very existence of chemtrails took off with Letxa and Wolf arguing with mojo!

This is a waste of time on a chemtrail board. Other topics, sure, debate them, but the main purpose of this board is collecting chemtrail data, sharing photos and reports, and generally increasing our knowledge and activism. And for a member to continually "down" others on the board and dissuade new inquiring minds to use our board for research -- well it's obvious to me that such distractors should be banned quickly so that the rest of us can post about chemtrails in peace. No need to debate on chemtrails. They are real. It is not a belief system, they are real!

posted 04-22-2004 01:25 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by electricmojoman:
That is the world according to you. Airhead!
. . . .
Well now, thats speculation now isnt it. hypocrite!
. . . .
Over a populated city? Are you moronic? that is why we have installations and military experiments in the desert. You just make up stuff as you go along.
. . . .
No and I need not make a stink about it. None of my business. They were to busy playing your little game to be on message moron. You didn't think of them either because you were to busy with your agenda of being a nay-sayer.
. . . .
What kind of fucking logic do you have? You are insanely arrogant and stupid.

---

Such language. It is a good thing that Lexta is used to it from you already.

posted 04-22-2004 01:40 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Boomer Chick:
Swamp, apparently you didn't read the initial post which outlined the changes. The ban only has to do with the subject of [b]chemtrails.

My outlining an example using boards that come together in like mind and inserting one's opposing view, like NDE's and hallucinations, was only an example of human dynamics which you yourself have experienced. On this board, as halva has written and I have written, the goal and acceptance of chemtrails acceptance is primary. All other topics, even the ones you mentioned ARE NOT changed in the new tightening of membership rules. GET IT?
[/B]

---

You know, I made a vow not to communicate with you, but you really think you are a know it all, and are operating on a higher plane than anyone else. Maybe you should try some of those herbs Thetaloops mentioned.

Now this is addressed to all others who are having second thoughts about the direction of CTC. If this is a "Chemtrails" website, then get rid of all non-chemtrail material, including hallucinations, drugs, health, food, goofy pictures, spiritual, and politics. I'm sure that would be nice. Personally, I like challengers, but when somebody calls me an idiot, my ideas and lifestyle is BullShoot, a stinkin' Commie, or a fag lover, then they should be warned, with three total warnings. I can take a Wolf Larsen or even a Letxa, but when a Lulu posts my address on CTC, or Seeker sends me physical threats THAT'S where the line should be drawn. Ideas will bleed into each other, and that is human interaction.

posted 04-22-2004 01:48 PM            

Wolf has a point and you do too, that the agreement clause itself should be strengthened and banning rules should be adhered to. Lulu is not longer a mod, right?