posted 08-18-2001 10:39 AM            

Please follow up this heading in your Internet groups
and express what YOU feel on these urgent problems.
We need to find solutions that work and we can do
that if we speak freely and join our efforts together.

------------------

THE GLOBAL DEBATE FOR WORLD ACTION
STARTS: 18-20 AUGUST 2001 - WORLDWIDE
AND CONTINUES UNTIL SANITY RETURNS

WORLDWIDE EMERGENCY ON EARTH:
Science, Military, Industry and Government are going mad.
People worldwide are being forced to eat genetically modified
food. The world is being destroyed by continued burning of
fossil fuels. Over-Unity energy production has been hidden from
humanity for 50 years. Humanity is being farmed, manipulated,
abused and killed - while a mad machine runs and ruins the world.
Mammals in the sea are dying from US Navy use of advanced
sonar radar. Chemtrails are being sprayed worldwide and people
are dying of respiratory problems at an alarming rate.

ELECTRONIC & MICROWAVE POLLUTION:
Microwave pollution is increasing at an alarming rate. During
the week 12-18 August, unpleasant physical and psychological
symptoms have been noted across the Earth - especially on the
North American continent. On Friday 11th August, the HAARP
installation in Alaska, began transmitting extremely high-powered
energy pulses into the Earth's atmosphere. Psychological effects
reported during this week include: disrupted sleep patterns;
alarming dreams; disturbed thought processes; panic; dread; etc.
Physical symptoms include: respiratory problems; static build-up
all over the body; nose-bleeds; headaches; migraine; fever; etc.

HISTORY OF ABUSE BY USA AUTHORITIES: http://home.earthlink.net/~bkonop/GermIncidents2.html

----------------------
Bizarre and dangerous developments worldwide:
Proliferation Of Genetically Modified Foodstuffs; Climate
And Weather Warfare; Germ Warfare; Chemtrails; US Navy
Sonar Of Oceans; Microwave Pollution; Suppression Of
Over Unity Energy Production; Weaponisation Of Space;
Son Of Star Wars; NWO - Emergence Of A One World State;
AIDS - Deliberate Genocide Of Humanity; Suppression Of
The Truth Of ET Existence; Science, Medicine, Industry
and Military Acting Without Moral Regard; Leaders Acting
Without Reference To The People; Cloning Of Life-Forms.

You name it - it is about to happen unless WE stop it.

----------------
We must do what we conceive to be the right thing and
not bother our heads or burden our souls with whether
we will be successful. Because if we don’t do the right
thing, we will be doing the wrong thing and we will just
be a part of the disease and not a part of the cure.
E. F. SCHUMACHER
----------------
COMMIT TO ACTION by W. H. Murray:
"Until one is committed there is hesitancy, the chance
to draw back, always ineffectiveness. Concerning all acts
of initiative and creation, there is one elementary truth,
the ignorance of which kills countless ideas and splendid
plans: that the moment one definitely commits oneself,
then providence moves too. All sorts of things occur to
help one that would never otherwise have occurred.
A whole stream of events issues from the decision,
raising in one's favour all manner of unforseen incidents
and meetings and material assistance, which no person
could have dreamt would have come their way."
----------------

HAVE WE HAD ENOUGH?

---------------

Please follow up this heading in your Internet groups
and express what YOU feel on these urgent problems.
We need to find solutions that work and we can do
that if we speak freely and join our efforts together.

THE GLOBAL DEBATE FOR WORLD ACTION
STARTS: 18-20 AUGUST 2001 - WORLDWIDE
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Action-Group9
http://www.world-action.co.uk

posted 08-20-2001 10:34 PM            

"People worldwide are being forced to eat genetically modified food."

Explain to me why the EU has practically banned GM foods, and the same backlash is being seen here, springboarded by the neo-Luddites that inhabit these forums.

"The world is being destroyed by continued burning of fossil fuels."

Inasmuch as renewables such as wind turbines, microhydro, and photovoltaics seem to be cost-ineffective for any but niche applications -- and these same anti-GM food Luddites are dead set against nuclear power -- what do you recommend as a source of electricity for the six billion people here on earth?

"Over-Unity energy production has been hidden from humanity for 50 years."

Is this like the 200-mpg carburetor that the oil companies have "conspired" to hide from us? If there is any such thing as "over-unity energy production", do you have any evidence that it really exists and that it works?

"Chemtrails are being sprayed worldwide and people are dying of respiratory problems at an alarming rate."

Do you have any evidence that such spraying is anything but an abundance of normal contrails and, if so, are you able to show any statistical correlation between such spraying and people "dying of respiratory problems..."?

Now if -- and that's a mighty big if, pardner -- you can come up with any evidence that will convince people with any real authority and following in this country, then maybe these same folks will listen to you.

But until you can come up with any evidence for your scenarios -- and a coherent approach to ameliorate them -- I doubt you'll be convincing many people beyond the usual lambs being sheared in the sheeple-shed.

posted 08-21-2001 12:08 AM            

If auto emissions were said to be
responsible for smog and illness and
atmospheric modification ....... why
doesn't the same hold true for contrails?

You seem to have a "my kid can do no
wrong" attitude when it comes to the
industry you represent.

You said:
"and these same anti-GM food Luddites are dead set against nuclear power -- what do you recommend as a source of electricity for the six billion people here on earth?"

I am all for nuclear power, but I am
against GM food. I must be a Luddite
without a camp.

As far as a power source for the people-
I am most curious about China. Surely
this country has been chosen to be the
next industrial capital of the world. They
can't do this without electrical power.
Do you know how they plan to solve this
power problem?

By the way Mr. Kunz, I enjoy reading
your post's and I think you're an
all right kind of guy even though you're
asleep.

posted 08-21-2001 02:58 AM            

We are living within the "system". If we
were all to step out of "their system",
then maybe there would be some hope.
I don't see that happening.

posted 08-21-2001 09:24 AM            

Thank you for your comments. I was hoping to get something out of poor "Michael639", but, inasmuch as his entire post on this board was a word-for-word cut-and-paste from a rather incoherent UK website, I should've realized that his forte was not his own thoughts, reason, or comments. I also found it interesting - but rather depressing - that his response to someone who asked some tough questions was exactly the same as his response to those who took the fatalistic "ain't nuthin' we can do about it anyway" approach, i.e., he didn't want to get into anything but insults for all of us.

Permit me now to respond to your comments. As usual, your comments are in "quotes"; mine are in [bracketed italics].

"If auto emissions were said to be responsible for smog and illness and atmospheric modification ....... why doesn't the same hold true for contrails?"

[No reason at all why not! I believe that contrails are involved somewhat in at least the potential for atmospheric modification, in that the presence of additional cloud cover they engender will modify the diurnal temperature delta. I don't have a clue as to the long-term climatic results, but i fear that they are not going to be good.]

[But I also think that smog and illness are different things, and there is not nearly the same evidence for contrails causing such problems. Smog usually is the result of low-altitude emissions trapped under an inversion-blanket. To the best of my knowledge, contrail emissions are too high to be trapped in an inversion layer, even in Mexico City, where the valley is over 2000 m in altitude.]

[Illness? Despite various reports of illnesses following contrails, they are simply too scattered and anecdotal to draw any serious conclusions. If there are any studies showing a statistical correlation between aircraft contrails (as opposed to aircraft on the ground) causing illnesses, I have not seen it.]

"You seem to have a "my kid can do no wrong" attitude when it comes to the industry you represent."

[I disagree. There are many things about the aerospace/defense business I consider repugnant; our willingness to sell high-tech products to potential adversaries being near the top of the list. But you should ask yourself whether my lack of belief of some of the more exotic hypotheses extant today is the result of my slavishly defending everything my industry stands for - or because I've been in the business for thirty years and probably have a good knowledge of what's actually going on.]

"I am all for nuclear power, but I am against GM food. I must be a Luddite without a camp."

[My response to that comment is simple: I screwed up. I made a sweeping generalization that anti-GM people were anti-nuclear as well, and I was wrong. I apologize.]

"As far as a power source for the people- I am most curious about China. Surely this country has been chosen to be the next industrial capital of the world. Do you know how they plan to solve this power problem? "

[I wouldn't say 'chosen' per se, but, given their work ethic, low wages and the unprecedented ability to combine capitalism and tyranny, they certainly have a big future in the manufacturing game. Of course, their Three Gorges Dam, if completed, will provide gigawatts of hydroelectric power (at the risk of destroying priceless history and culture, but what the hey - they don't need any history or culture). They have a great big bunch of hydrocarbon fuels - coal and oil - which they have burned and will continue to burn merrily to furnish electricity for their industries and infrastructure. And any country which can execute pro-democracy demonstrators and Falun Gong exercise groups isn't going to care doodly-squat about their people complaining about pollution!]

[Plus, of course, they were exempted under the rules of the Kyoto Accords - another reason why I'm glad we didn't sign that hideous thing.]

Regards,

posted 08-21-2001 09:45 AM            

I ONLY CAME BACK HERE COS I'M STARTING TO GET ANGRY

THERE'S JUST NO POINT

YOU THINK THE PLANNED DESTRUCTION OF HUMANITY WILL 'DEVOUR ITSELF'?

YOU SHOULD COME DOWN TO THE REAL WORLD AND TAKE A LOOK AROUND

YOU THINK NUCLEAR POWER IS A GREAT IDEA?

WHERE HAVE YOU BEEN!

DID YOU NOTICE THE SCIENTISTS AND INDUSTRIALISTS AND MILITARISTS OF THE DISCLOSURE PROJECT SAYING THAT WE'D BEEN DENIED OVER UNITY ENERGY FOR 50 YEARS

BUT WHO CARES. EH. WE'LL JUST GO OFF AND FIND ANOTHER PLANET TO BURN WHEN THIS ONE HAS GONE

YOU THINK KUNZ WRITES INTERESTING POSTS.

WHAT A BORING LIFE

THAT PERSON SHOULD CHANGE HIS LAST LETTER TO A 'T'. THAT HAS HIM DOWN TO A T.

T FOR TIT.

I DOUBT IF I'LL BE BACK

HAVE YOU DONE SO MUCH ACID OR ECSTACY THAT YOU JUST CAN'T GET AN ANGLE ON REALITY?

posted 08-21-2001 10:11 AM            

quote:

---

Would anyone with any brains, initiative or commonsense like to reply to this topic?

---

Michael, no need to SHOUT, allude to vulgarities or insult the forum members. Being mad as hell doesn't require using verbal violence. Your brains and commonsense should free you from the need for such.

quote:

---

...the neo-Luddites that inhabit these forums.

---

Ouch. So what is a neo-Luddite? Obviously not a complete technophobe, since they wouldn't be using the Internet, much less participating in an electronic discussion. Maybe someone who is discriminating in the technologies they embrace? I've been programming for over 50% of my life, but I'm not exicited about GM foods, nor our ability to destroy the Earth several times over with nuclear weapons. If that makes me a neo-Luddite, I'm proud to be one...

posted 08-21-2001 10:20 AM            

YOU PEOPLE ARE NEVER GOING TO GET IT

YOU PUT POLITENESS FIRST (DENIAL)

AND A PLANET AND A CIVILISATION ARE RUNNING OUT OF TIME

posted 08-21-2001 03:34 PM            

That's TWICE today I had to apologize for my mistaken generalizations! Do you realize what this does to my fragile ego?

Actually, I'm sure you know that not everyone who posts here is a Luddite. I was referring to that group which equates complex technology with evil, simply because they haven't taken the time to really look at the problem / solution to see whether the advantages outweigh the disadvantages (or vice versa).

For example, you could have two folks that are against the idea of adding 'growth enhancers' (read: antibiotics) to the feedstocks of chickens and pigs. One of these people might be against it because the research shows an increase in antibiotic-resistant bacteria in the meat of the animals, and those bacteria are beginning to show up infecting people who eat the meat. Being antibiotic-resistant, those people are not responding well to treatment! This first person reads that farmers in Denmark have pretty much eliminated antibiotic additives and still manage to produce tasty and cost-effective hams and drumsticks. She figures that the bad outweighs the good and tries to talk people into getting rid of such additives.

The second person heard that antibiotics in chickens cause west nile or leprosy or something and by gum! grandpaw never added that stuff to his chickens, and besides, it's all a plot by TPTS.

Both folks are against antibiotic additives, but only one's a neo-Luddite.

Maybe it's all those antibiotic additives in my morning Egg McMuffin that's causing me to over generalize....

Regards,