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Author
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Topic: Things that I wonder about | Topic page views:
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roman
New Member
posts,
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posted 03-20-2003 06:24 PM
  
There are plenty of things these days that make me wonder.The Stock Market it falls 100 points a day for several days then bounces up close to 300 in one day. Lots of people seem to loose money while others make money . I had a 401 k that was doing well before 911. I don't play that game any more.Chemtrails remind me of the market. one day you may have a total cover it does not seem to matter if the weather is right for trail formation or not they just happen. This may go on for several days then just stop on a day when you would think that their should be plenty of trails. That is why that I think that something is just not normal. I grew up near Dayton Ohio I got to see all the latest and the greatest jets from the fiftys until today and as I remember Contrails did evaporate. I wonder why the don't do that now. roman...
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roman
New Member
posts,
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posted 04-12-2003 08:53 PM
Had something unusual happen today. Today was a beautiful warm sunny day here in the valley .After almost a week of solid overcast it was good to see the Sun againMinor trails earley then plenty of the fast evaporating contrails. Everybody in the neighborhood was out doing lawn work or just chatting over the back fence.Our new neighbors had a friend visiting from Texas.He was complaining that his allergys were really ugly today. He is about 30 years old I told him that allergys were common this time of year here in the valley.Then he mentioned the morning haze. I told him that this was also a common thing here in the valley because of the chemical plants and the smelter down by the river.Then out of the blue he mentions all the jet traffic overhead.I told him that that too was normal here in the valley.Then what he told me next really made me wonder. He ask if I had noticed that the contrails were much shorter and evaporated much quicker then when he was a kid.I then ask him how long ago was that. He then said about twenty years.Now this really does make me wonder.Like I said New neighbors.This guy then went on to say that twenty years ago the trails would cover the sky horizon to horizon and last all day.I have never said a word to these people about my thoughts on the trails. I now wonder if just maybe the program has been going on much longer then we believe and maybe the program began out there in the desert . Oh well it is just a thought but I thought that it was unusual for this stranger to say this to me . roman...
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NW41Heavy
Negro with an Attitude
Tallahassee, FL
88 posts, Mar 2003
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posted 04-15-2003 01:02 AM
Ya know.... I often why hot dogs are called hot dogs? Hey! If you were a hot dog.... and you were starving.... would you eat yourself? Well... would ya?? I know I would... I'd smother myself with ketchup and relish! I'd be sooooooo delicious! Then I'd wash it down with a nice tall cold one! ------------------
Dude, that guy has a black belt in redneck!
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roman
New Member
posts,
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posted 04-28-2003 07:19 PM
Lot's of things that make me wonder these days.Like the Trails, I look up and see all the traffic wonder !Well maybe it is just vapor trails, Then again that sure is a lot of traffic I can't believe that all that traffic and still the airlines are loseing so much money.I don't think so!!Then we get a day like today So many trails and so much traffic that soon the Sunny bright day has turned into a Artifical overcast mess.roman...
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 04-28-2003 11:13 PM
Then again that sure is a lot of traffic I can't believe that all that traffic and still the airlines are loseing so much money.I don't think so!!If you want to think that, I guess we cant stop you.
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theseeker
One moon circles
Damnit...I'm a doctor jim
3403 posts, Jul 2000
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posted 04-28-2003 11:55 PM
really it's odd when I don't see any trails...what's interesting to me is why certain carriers like jet blue and southwest consistently make money... look at these numbers for losses of united and american...it's insane ! The January loss puts United on track to lose $900 million to $1 billion in the first quarter, analysts say. That exceeds the $800 million that AMR, American Airlines' parent, which is 20% bigger than United, is expected to lose. http://www.usatoday.com/money/biztravel/2003-03-04-united-esop_x.htm
man that's a lot of money...
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 04-29-2003 04:16 PM
jetBlue and Southwest have been the best airlines in the industry. The major airlines have seen that these two low fare carriers are doing faaaaar better than they are and have tried to create their own low cost carriers to snatch away some passengers from SW and JB.Delta has created "song"
Air Canada has created "Jazz" and "Tango"
etc... There is a reason they keep making money. They are the best. But some people probably think JB and SW are making money because they are carrying chems for the gov.
[Edited 1 times, lastly by PHXPilot on 04-29-2003]
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NW41Heavy
Negro with an Attitude
Tallahassee, FL
88 posts, Mar 2003
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posted 04-29-2003 09:47 PM
I still don't like southwest though.... ugh.... 737's.... Did you hear about those guys getting fired last week for playing a prank on the flight attendant and getting naked in the cockpit? ------------------
Dude, that guy has a black belt in redneck!
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Hornblower
Senior Member
central europe
91 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 04-30-2003 02:21 AM
I live in a small mountain village and have a great panoramic view. In the past few days, it seems that all the jets flying around have contrails that fail to disappear (...)
At arm's length, a jet at 30'000 ft usually had a contrail of 1 inch (between finger and thumb); now these contrails stretch all across my "screen" and linger in the sky, forming cirrus clouds. There are "X"'s and wide, staccato/dotted lines. I've never seen anything like it before.Could any of you explain the reasons for this? Has the world sky been tampered with?
Do ALL commercial flights have "products" in their jet fuel (which affects their exhaust)or does high-altitude temperature play a role in the dissemination of "contrails"? I'm a new member and have been following your discussions on this list. Now that I have seen with my own eyes strange phenomena, I require answers. Thanks for any assistance you can give me.
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ChemCaptain
Senior Member
United States
495 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 04-30-2003 07:11 AM
I think most people who believe that they've never seen a long or persistant contrail are wrong (just don't remember or didn't notice), or lying.People use the 'I've never seen persistant contrails before but now I have' argument so something must be going on. I can tell you, I've seen them my entire life. What do you mean by contrails only being an inch or so long (from ground perspective).. I've never seen a contrail, even ones that vanish in a couple minutes, that short. Listen folks.. I'm fine and happy to accent listening to chemtrail arguments, just be consistant, most believers don't even agree on what the purpose of chemtrails are. Some believe there is such thing as persistant contrails, some don't. Some think that all planes in the sky are leaving chemtrails, some believe it's just the military. Everyone seems to agree that they are "bad" dispite lack of proof or effect. I'm sorry I am being kind of an ass now, but because you got the flu or runny nose, it doesn't mean it was from a trail 30k feet up. You wonder why people question you and think you have gone off the end- it's pretty obvious from a 3rd person perspective. It's really hard to argue facts when the entire chemtrail community isn't even in agreement with what they believe the truth is. Sorry for that rant 
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Lulu
ice behaving badly
right here
2553 posts, Dec 2000
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posted 04-30-2003 08:20 AM
Hi Hornblower...glad you finally decided to join in our discussions. Hopefully you'll get some answers here? 
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Jeanie
Senior Member
North East U.S.A.
525 posts, Nov 2001
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posted 04-30-2003 08:52 AM
Welcome Hornblower***You ask if the worlds skies have been tampered with. You Betcha, Big Time. Good Luck on getting answers. I still marvel at what has been and is being done to our atmosphere. If you get too close to the source you no doubt will get harassed. Check out http://www.carnicom.com There is such an experience related, scroll way down list on left. Would you mind telling what country you are in ? Sounds like a beautiful area, too bad mirky skies have to spoil it.
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Hornblower
Senior Member
central europe
91 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 04-30-2003 09:26 AM
quote:
Originally posted by ChemCaptain:
People use the 'I've never seen persistant contrails before but now I have' argument so something must be going on. I can tell you, I've seen them my entire life.
I can't say you're answering my questions but yes, I can confirm that I've seen contrails my entire life too.
quote:
What do you mean by contrails only being an inch or so long (from ground perspective).. I've never seen a contrail, even ones that vanish in a couple minutes, that short.
If I look up into the sky, normal commercial flights (at 10'000 meters or so) appear to be 2-3 centimeters long and the contrails emerging from their engines, also 2-3 cm long. Sure, were the jets to be on the ground, they would appear much bigger (and not like miniatures). Question of perspective, right?
quote:
Listen folks.. I'm fine and happy to accent listening to chemtrail arguments, just be consistant, most believers don't even agree on what the purpose of chemtrails are.
So you believe that I'm talking about chemtrails? What makes you say that?
quote:
Some believe there is such thing as persistant contrails, some don't. Some think that all planes in the sky are leaving chemtrails, some believe it's just the military. Everyone seems to agree that they are "bad" dispite lack of proof or effect. I'm sorry I am being kind of an ass now, but because you got the flu or runny nose, it doesn't mean it was from a trail 30k feet up. You wonder why people question you and think you have gone off the end- it's pretty obvious from a 3rd person perspective.
This "some people" argument does not reflect what you think. What do you think about what I saw in the sky? I am not sick. Why should I be sick? Do you believe there is something about contrails that makes one sick? Nobody's questioned me before; you're the first! That I've gone off the deep end? Entirely possible but nothing to do with vapors in the sky.
quote:
It's really hard to argue facts when the entire chemtrail community isn't even in agreement with what they believe the truth is.
Why would you want to argue facts? If they are facts, then they are true. Arguing about facts means that truth is a lie in your mind.
How about giving me a few of the rumors which you agree with? It would make my day.
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Hornblower
Senior Member
central europe
91 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 04-30-2003 09:49 AM
[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jeanie:
Welcome Hornblower***You ask if the worlds skies have been tampered with. You Betcha, Big Time. Good Luck on getting answers.
Thanks Jeanie [and Lulu] for the welcome. Chemcaptain comes across right rude, bashing me for asking such a simple question. It's like being on a first date and hitting each other on the head with frying pans.
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ChemCaptain
Senior Member
United States
495 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 04-30-2003 10:05 AM
"Chemcaptain comes across right rude, bashing me for asking such a simple question."I'm sorry if I came off rude hornblower, it wasn't my intention, but to make you feel better I had the same reaction when I first posted here. You'll get used to a lot of rude people here  . I used my reply as a rant against others, not you. Most I was talking about (consistantsy, sickness) are unrelated to your post, sorry for the confusion. I just felt I had to say what I had to about other arguments I've seen for chemtrails in other threads, sorry for hijacking you When I said that people are either wrong or lying, it came off a bit harsh, but I think it's the truth. Usually more of the former, people's memorys simply are not as good as they think they are. Now for what I actually intended for you I was saying I've seen persistant contrails my entire life, not just ones that go away immediately. From a ground perspective (I made that clear in my reply), I have never seen a contrail that looks only an inch or so long, they have as I remember stretched across most of the sky- some disapearing quickly and some lasting most of the day.
[Edited 2 times, lastly by ChemCaptain on 04-30-2003]
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Hornblower
Senior Member
central europe
91 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 04-30-2003 12:11 PM
quote:
Originally posted by ChemCaptain:
"Chemcaptain comes across right rude, bashing me for asking such a simple question."
Ok ChemCaptain, no problem.
We'll just see how it goes from here. 
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 04-30-2003 09:02 PM
Chill out!So you believe that I'm talking about chemtrails? What makes you say that? If you come on to CHEMTRAILcentral.com and start talking about seeing contrails lasting longer than you think they should then it IS going to be assumed you are talking about chemtrails. It is not meant to be rude, but its just how it is. Its like someone walking into a gay bar and getting angry when people start thinking they are gay. The truth (yes, the truth, not an opinion, its an actual observed fact) is that contrails lasting for many hours and forming clouds decks is entirely normal. This has been documented ever since WWII when aircraft started flying high enough to produce them. That is the TRUTH. It is FACT. It is very possible, and likely, that new generations of engines are more prone to longer lasting contrails, then the older ones. This is probably the reason for the jump in long lasting contrails in recent years.
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Hornblower
Senior Member
central europe
91 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 05-01-2003 02:30 AM
quote:
Originally posted by PHXPilot:
Its like someone walking into a gay bar and getting angry when people start thinking they are gay.
[QUOTE]Like bombing a foreign country and saying that you're doing it for PEACE?
[QUOTE]
The truth (yes, the truth, not an opinion, its an actual observed fact) is that contrails lasting for many hours and forming clouds decks is entirely normal. This has been documented ever since WWII when aircraft started flying high enough to produce them.
You may be right here but again, you may be wrong. Normal for me is blue sky. When it becomes white sky with patches of blue, it's no longer normal. I joined this "chemtrail" forum for alternative data. Telling me that I've got a carrot pushing out of my head because I'm not wearing socks doesn't advance my investigation. Thanks PHXpilot anyway for explaining what it's like in the USA. 
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NW41Heavy
Negro with an Attitude
Tallahassee, FL
88 posts, Mar 2003
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posted 05-01-2003 09:41 AM
Normal sky is not necassarily blue.... you get a broken altocumulus layer, you have a high level overcast layer with little blue patches. You go down south you can barely see the sky during the summer usually because of the haze...just a fact of the way the high humidity acts during the hot summertime. The atmosphere is so incredibly complex.
What the crap did that bombing comment have to do with this conversation?
Remember, if you come someplace and ask legititmate questions, then cop an attitude when someone gives you a straightforward answer- your stock drops quite rapidly.
------------------
Dude, that guy has a black belt in redneck!
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Hornblower
Senior Member
central europe
91 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 05-01-2003 10:22 AM
quote:
Originally posted by NW41Heavy:
Normal sky is not necassarily blue.... What the crap did that bombing comment have to do with this conversation?
Thanks for the info on the clouds NW41Heavy. I don't care for jokes about gay bashing and you don't care for jokes about asswipes. Perhaps PHXpilot is the one you should be complaining to.  Remember, if you come someplace and ask legititmate questions, then cop an attitude when someone gives you a straightforward answer- your stock drops quite rapidly. [/B][/QUOTE]
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PHXPilot
Your Mode C Veil is Showing
Phoenix, AZ, USA
800 posts, Jan 2003
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posted 05-01-2003 06:32 PM
Like bombing a foreign country and saying that you're doing it for PEACE?
What the hell does this have to do with ANYTHING?!?!? Normal for me is blue sky. When it becomes white sky with patches of blue, it's
no longer normal. That is how the atmosphere works!!!! If you cant deal with that, TOUGH!!! ITS COMPLETELY NORMAL. Telling me that I've got a carrot pushing out of my head because I'm not wearing socks doesn't advance my investigation. What?!?! Your "investigation" apperantly means that you look at the sky, assume it isnt normal, and end it at that. IT IS NORMAL.
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Hornblower
Senior Member
central europe
91 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 05-02-2003 02:27 AM
quote:
Originally posted by PHXPilot:
[b]Like bombing a foreign country and saying that you're doing it for PEACE?What the hell does this have to do with ANYTHING?!?!?
What has anything to do with HELL?
quote:
What?!?! Your "investigation" apperantly means that you look at the sky, assume it isnt normal, and end it at that. IT IS NORMAL.
The end is but months away
The trails have gone and the sky is gray
It's obvious you're not in tune to what I have to say
So fare thee well, PHXpilotplay! I won't be back where the form is free
And I'm sure even you will see the sky differently ... VERY SOON NOW.
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Hornblower
Senior Member
central europe
91 posts, Apr 2003
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posted 05-05-2003 05:41 AM
quote:
Originally posted by Hornblower:
I live in a small mountain village and have a great panoramic view. In the past few days, it seems that all the jets flying around have contrails that fail to disappear (...)
I just visited carnicom.com's message board [thanks Jeanie] (Aerosol Operation Crimes & Cover Up Documented) and the following message posted by Yaak (4/5/03)asks EXACTLY the same question:
"Chemtrails - another theory Almost every jet, commercial or military, is now leaving a persistent contrail regardless of weather conditions or elevation. This is occcurring world wide. How could an operation of this magnitude have been kept secret for this long? It would seem to require the cooperation of thousands of people. People talk, regardless of threats. We know the mainstream media is completely controlled by TPTB, but why hasn't something leaked to the alternative news services?" Ga Fla's reply (5/3/03) was astute: "...The actual white spray planes don't seem to follow any given location or direction in the sky, however I've noticed some other planes do on days of heavy aerosol activity. I believe the actual spray planes are responsible for making those common short "strip trails" but can also produce the much longer ones as well. I still firmly believe commercial jets have nothing to do with the aerosol spraying. During heavy spray periods though, I've noticed (what appear to be) commercial jets also leaving persistent trails. These are the planes which do follow the same pattern every time the sky fills with lingering trails. Also, these are the trails that don't have any specific "on" or "off" points. So there are select planes making real chemtrails but it just may be that not all lingering "trails" are what they appear to be. Atmospheric conditions for genuine persistent contrails are not as common as they appear to be either. This is hardly the black and white issue that many on both sides make it out to be."
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NW41Heavy
Negro with an Attitude
Tallahassee, FL
88 posts, Mar 2003
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posted 05-05-2003 03:46 PM
"Almost every jet, commercial or military, is now leaving a persistent contrail regardless of weather conditions or elevation."
All I can say is..that is very...very wrong. Frequency of persistent contrails is the same I have seen for years. It varies greatly with the weather conditions... and remember that high altitude weather is much different than what you experience on the ground. Some days it is much more humid (relatively- air up there is extremely dry compared to down here on the ground in all cases) up there in comparison to what it is down low (relatively, obviously).
------------------
Dude, that guy has a black belt in redneck!
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NW41Heavy
Negro with an Attitude
Tallahassee, FL
88 posts, Mar 2003
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posted 05-05-2003 03:53 PM
http://www.airliners.net/discussions/tech_ops/read.main/59728/ Check this out for some contrail info from some real people that know what they are talking about. People on the ground don't have a clue what goes on up there..seriously. It sickens me all the misinformation for people accusing us of conspiracies and such. On the black lines post on the main forum... there is a clear picture of an MD-80 making a normal contrail, but they call it a spray plane. Stupid stuff like that. Not to mention the black lines thing is rediculous.. when there is an upper level thin layer, it is very common to see that.... i saw a really cool shadow from a contrail the other day from my point of view at 10,000 feet... could see it cutting through the haze with the beams of sunlight down to the ground.
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