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  America is BROKE

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Topic:   America is BROKE

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Mech
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posted 12-14-2002 11:52 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
We're Broke!
Don Stott


Check out the papers. California is $21 billion in the red. All states are in the red. Counties, cities, towns, and even villages are broke. Ford stock hovers around $7, and United Airlines stocks which got almost to $100, now are worth pennies. They're broke also. Continental Airlines, and all of the others, except those who are run decently, are broke as well. Qwest has debts of $25 billion, and Kroger super markets are heavily in debt. The county in which I live is struggling, as is the whole state. Tourism is so far down, that thousands of tourist oriented businesses are broke, for sale, or hovering at that point.

Highway construction is shuttered in many places, because the department is broke. Airlines have cut travel agency commissions so severely, that hundreds of them have simply quit, because they can't make it. Building permits are so far down in most places, that hundreds of layoffs in those departments around America have taken place. Construction outfits, contractors, and manufacturers of construction items are down, down, down in their businesses. Auto sales are dismal, even with zero percent financing. Trucking companies have gone bankrupt, and thousands of drivers are laid off. Wanna buy a cheap tractor? Take over the payments…please! Rail freight traffic is way down, and lots of railway employees are on furlough.

McDonalds is in trouble, and a holder of over 500 Burger King franchises is bankrupt. Bankruptcies are up double percentage points everywhere. PBS (perennial begging system) is pleading for help, as the usual contributors can't afford it of late. K-Mart is almost a memory, thanks to poor management and China Mart competition. China Marts aren't even doing too well. Locally, a long time discount chain, Gibsons, bit the dust after doing nicely for several decades. Layoffs by the millions have bankrupted tens of thousands of families.

It is so sad. Millions of IRA's and 401K's are but a fraction of their former values, thanks to the stock market's tanking. Millions of people approaching retirement have little to look forward to, thanks to the stock market.

This reminds me of a few decades ago, when I was in the theatre business, and the entire industry was in the doldrums. The joke was: a caller asks, "When does the next feature start?", and the manager replies, "When can you get here?"

The plain fact is, there are no shortages of anything, and that's bad for an economy. E-Gold keeps e-mailing me, telling me my account is something or other, and that is strange because I wouldn't open an e-gold account for all the tea in China. It's their way of trying to get a rise out of me, so they can open one for me. It won't work. It's shortages of things that makes an economy buzz. Shortages make prices go up. Shortages of space on cruise ships, tourist trains, or hotels, makes the economy prosper. There are no shortages of anything. Plenty of movie seats, restaurants aren't full, and Greyhound isn't doing too well either. They just moved out of a $475 a month station here in my town, and had been there for 10 years. They couldn't afford it, and moved into a cubbyhole for half the price…just to try to show a profit.

With all businesses operating at far less than capacity, the entire economy is bad, and with a bad economy, tax collections are so far off, that state, county, and city governments are in deep trouble.

Notice, I didn't say a word about the federal government.

The fed is doing just fine, thank you. Thousands of new hires, expanding bureaucracies, and the military-industrial complex Ike warned us about, is going full throttle. DC is booming, and if, as a premonition of hyper-inflation, the presses are rolling. Officially 8% a year in increases of the dollar supply, but maybe a lot more, because of the "off budget" things, which aren't part of the official record. None of the bureaucracies can balance their checkbooks, but it doesn't matter, because there's plenty to make up any differences or shortages. DC drones don't have to worry about a shortage, as does a home owner, businessman, state, county, or city. If you make $25,000 a year, and bring home $20,000, you have to live on $20,000.

If you are a governor of a state, you can't print the dollars to pay your bills, and United Airlines can't print the mazuma to bring it out of the depths. The federal government will never go down, because it can produce what it calls "money," out of nothing. One of Sir Greenspan's newer henchmen said so a couple of weeks ago, lest we doubt the power of the fed to fill the coffers of the bureaucrats with all due haste. I'll bet the owner of those 500 plus Burger Kings wishes he could print his way out of bankruptcy. Credit cards maxed out, and 3 million unemployed doesn't make for a Merry Christmas. I'm playing Santa at a Christmas show on Dec 18th, and I'll shout Ho Ho, but inside, I am worried sick about America's economic future. Gold is up $5 today, and silver 7 cents. That's an indicator to me.

Now the Muslims are going to try to bury us with their gold dinar. They say it will kill capitalism, because their dinars will be made of, and backed by real gold, and become the only true money in the entire world. That may sound ominous, except for one thing. In order to produce gold money, you have to have the gold to do it. Muslims aren't the richest people in the world, and as a generalization, they are probably close to the poorest. Where are they going to get the dollars or euros to buy the gold to make their dinars? It's easy to say, "I am going to coin gold money or gold backed money and kill you capitalistic pigs," except it would take quite a few trillion dollars to do it. Sure, they have oil, but they spend it as fast as they get it. Those opulent palaces the sheiks live it aren't cheap. The rest of the rabble seems to live on the brink of extinction. Which country will produce the dinar? Whose capital will provide the gold? What denominations will it be in? How do we know it will be backed by gold? Who would believe them? If enough gold dinars are made out of real gold, to make them accepted around the world…to kill us capitalistic pigs of course… they'd have to buy thousands of tons of gold, coin it, distribute it, and then change the prices of everything. Let's see now, that Hershey bar is a 350th ounce of gold, which is the size of a pin head probably. Coins this small would be lost continuously, and become a joke. Maybe a silver dinar? That Hershey bar might be a 1/5th ounce of silver, or a dime size. That would work, except the amount of silver added to the gold required to formulate an entirely new currency known throughout the world, is impossible. No one has that many dollars or euros to buy the gold and silver. There aren't any gold and silver mines near those oil wells. I doubt that the dinar will ever harm the dollar or euro. They are harming themselves, because they are merely pieces of paper with ink on them.

In summers, while we were kids, we'd get the hose out, and squirt everyone and everything. Water was cheap. We'd go to the beach and build sand castles, and splash to our hearts desire. Endless amounts of water and sand for the taking, to amuse us. Just like the federal government's supply of dollars. They can have anything they want, just like the sands of the seashore. Just issue more dollars to pay for it. How wonderful! Why, we can go to war in Iraq with fancy, and technical arms of unimaginable sophistication. Drone planes shooting things up, and no pilots in danger. Only a million a pop. Expensive? Who cares? We can print all the dollars needed, and never you worry. Let's send $30 billion to Brazil, and spend hundreds of millions in Afghanistan. Bail out, subsidize, and spend, spend, spend, is the D.C. agenda and practice. They know no limits. Iraq? It'll cost a mere $200 billion…at least initially. "Hey Rube, print some more T-Bills."

The more they spend and print, the less yours will be worth. Too bad, you'll have to work longer hours, or get a second or third job to make ends meet, because times are tough…except in Washington D.C. You must make more. The more decreasing value dollars you have to make, you are automatically in a higher tax bracket. The dollars are going down the tubes, and you are working your head off to break even…and you find yourself in a higher tax bracket. Marvelous. Isn't out of control government wonderful? They print and spend, and you work and pay your higher taxes. They prosper, and just about every other entity, be they private or governmental, is in trouble. They can't print. The fed can, and the more it prints, the less yours are worth. Solution? Get the hell out of those absurd dollars, other than for day to day expenditures. Save in gold and silver. Save in antiques. Save in homes that are underpriced. Save in anything but dollars. I wonder if new presses are ordered yet. When inflation gets out of hand, as I honestly believe it is about to, there is always a shortage of fiat paper money. The prices go "up" so fast, that it takes a lot more paper money to buy the same stuff, and they always have to increase press runs. Yes, it's true, the new bills are being replaced again. This time in color, and supposed "re-design," which means they will print more billions. Surely I am not the only person who knows what's going on, am I? Protect yourself, and not with Technicolor $50 bills stored under your mattress. Do so with $50 Gold Eagles stored under your mattress. The paper money will automatically decrease in value, even while stored under the bed. A $50 Gold Eagle will buy the same or more in 25 years, even if you never touched it. Naturally, the $50 Gold Eagle is more than $50 in funny money, but it's still a bargain compared to its price in 6 months…I'll bet. You should have sold your United Airlines stock at $90, because it's worth 90 cents now. Protect yourself.

Don Stott
December 16, 2002

Don Stott has been a precious metals broker since 1977, has written five books, hundreds of columns, and his web site is www.coloradogold.com



[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 12-14-2002]

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David
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posted 12-14-2002 02:07 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for David     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yep we are broke, but, we can afford to spend an estimated 3 trillion dollars, thats 3 TRILLION DOLLARS, to finance the "war" with Iraq. Then to make matters worse, bush says that 'if', yeah right, we go to war, gas will shoot to $4 per gallon! That should help stimulate the economy, $4 gas and $10 for a loaf of bread.

Here in broke Calif, our criminal governor says that we need to cut expenses. How, well the first thing he proposes is big cuts in education and health program. Makes perfect sense, if you are a criminal governor that is.

Will this never end? Are the American people ever going to wake up and smell stench coming from Washington DC, Sacramento Calif and the rest of the political arenas?
Are they ever going to wake up and kick some collective butts and throw these bums out, reclaim America from the criminals posing as our elected officals?

[Edited 1 times, lastly by David on 12-14-2002]

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Mech
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posted 12-14-2002 02:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
They're too busy accusing each other of being "liberal" or "conservative". They are ENTIRELY out of touch with real people...both Dems and Repubs. You can't tell them apart at this point.

Unfortunately I forsee the rest of the American people waking up when it is already too late. The constitution will be dissolved and we will all be in breadlines..OR LESS.When this happens..the takeover will be complete.That's the time I put my pack on my back and head for the middle of nowhere.

The "California Crunch" was entirely orchestrated by Enron and Bush...There was no energy crunch per se. Monopoly and Deregulation is to blame.You can thank Klinton for that too.

The next "energy crunch" will be manipulated as well.

If most Americans actually knew what is REALLY going on in Washington...they would be calling for Bush and Cheney's head in the streets.

Like any Fuedalist government..the easiest way to control the masses is to keep them focused on a non-existant or exaggerated enemy. 9-11 was our "Reichtag fire"..the public willingly now follow everything Bush says.

SEIG HEIL!! BUSH EIN FUHRER!!!!

It won't belong before the rest of them (the sheeple) have the rug pulled out from under them.

[Edited 7 times, lastly by Mech on 12-14-2002]

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Mech
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posted 12-14-2002 04:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
....and getting MORE in debt by the minute.


See here.......
http://www.toptips.com/debtclock.html

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Mech
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posted 12-14-2002 10:24 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Bush tries to re-ignite failing economy: MORE CEO'S??


Bush reshuffles economic officials: more CEOs and bankers

By Patrick Martin
14 December 2002

WSWS.ORG

After a year of dismal economic performance, in which American capitalism has been rocked by the biggest series of corporate scandals since the Great Depression, the Bush administration has replaced three leading officials responsible for economic policy. But the identity of the “new faces” only underscores the extraordinarily narrow social base of this government—yet another corporate CEO and two investment bankers, for a regime already top-heavy with former officials from Wall Street and the Fortune 500.

The resignations of Treasury Secretary Paul O’Neill and chairman of the National Economic Council Lawrence Lindsey were announced by the White House on Friday, December 6, only minutes after the release of Labor Department figures showing a further jump in the unemployment rate to 6.0 percent. The two men had been informed of their dismissal on Wednesday evening, in phone calls by Vice President Richard Cheney, and both submitted the requested letters of resignation the following day.

O’Neill’s replacement, John Snow, CEO of the giant railway firm CSX, was announced on Monday, December 9. The next day the White House announced the appointment of William Donaldson, founder of the investment banking firm Donaldson Lufkin Jenrette and former head of the New York Stock Exchange, as chairman of the Securities and Exchange Commission, replacing Harvey Pitt, who was sacked on election day, November 5. On Thursday, December 12, came the appointment of Lindsey’s replacement: Stephen Friedman, former co-chairman of the huge investment banking firm Goldman Sachs.

The brusque character of the dismissals of Lindsey and O’Neill reveals the underlying fragility of the Bush administration and the weakness of its political support, barely a month after the November 5 elections which supposedly, according to the media and the Democratic and Republican politicians, demonstrated Bush’s wide popularity.

The White House and Bush’s principal political adviser, Karl Rove, clearly fear that the ongoing deterioration of the US economy—with unemployment steadily rising and more than $2 trillion wiped out in the stock market decline—will undermine the administration, despite the virtual collapse of any opposition on domestic or foreign policy from the Democratic Party.

The firing of the two top economic officials does not signal any significant shift in Bush administration policy. Its domestic agenda for 2003 reportedly includes such measures as a $300 billion cut in corporate taxes, making permanent the income tax for the wealthy which was enacted in 2001 but will expire in 2010, further efforts to privatize Social Security, the beginning of a drive to privatize the Postal Service, and a drastic cut in environmental and health and safety regulation of big business.

Bush has also announced he will implement portions of his “faith-based initiative” unilaterally and without congressional approval, to increase the federal financing of churches and other religious organizations.

Both O’Neill and Lindsey were reportedly blamed for public relations blunders during their tenure. O’Neill repeatedly roiled the international currency markets with offhand comments about the value of the dollar and the inadvisability of bailouts of countries like Turkey, Brazil and Argentina. Lindsey raised eyebrows in September when he estimated the cost of war with Iraq at $200 billion, undercutting suggestions by the most rabid warmongers in the Bush administration that conquest of Iraq could be accomplished cheaply and easily.

Their dismissal in favor of two more cautious spokesmen for corporate America reflects the belief of Bush, Rove & Co. that better “communications skills”—i.e., cynical lying on a scale matched only by the administration’s spokesmen in the “war on terror”—can make popular a policy which aims to rob the vast majority of the American people to increase the wealth of the top one percent.

Whatever the difference in style, John Snow would appear in terms of background and career to be a clone of Paul O’Neill. Both were mid-level officials in the Ford administration—O’Neill at the Office of Management and Budget, Snow in the Department of Transportation—where they became acquainted with Cheney, the real power behind the throne in the current White House.

They left government after Ford was defeated in the 1976 elections, and did not return to government during the Reagan years, instead moving up to lucrative positions at the top of the corporate ladder—O’Neill as CEO of International Paper and then Alcoa, Snow as CEO of the largest railroad in the eastern half of the US, the Chessie System (Chesapeake & Ohio, later CSX). Both retained contacts and influence in Washington, O’Neill as a crony of Fed Chairman Alan Greenspan, Snow as head of the Business Roundtable, one of the principal corporate lobbies.

There is one significant difference in their corporate activities. O’Neill formed close relations with the trade union bureaucracy, particularly the United Steelworkers union at Alcoa, where he became identified with a policy of improving workplace safety. Snow worked on the deregulation of the trucking industry while in the Ford administration, then became a leading advocate of deregulation of the entire transportation industry. While CSX is a unionized railroad, Snow’s principal role there was to push forward deregulation and privatization, culminating in the breakup of the government-owned Conrail system, which was sold off to CSX and Norfolk Southern.

Friedman is also something of a clone, not of Lindsey, but of Robert Rubin, the head of the National Economic Council when it was first established by Bill Clinton, and later Treasury secretary. Friedman and Rubin were the co-chairmen of Goldman Sachs in 1991-92, with one multimillionaire investment banker raising money for the Republicans, the other for the Democrats. This association led to a three-day delay in the announcement of the Friedman nomination, as some far-right elements lobbied the White House to reverse its decision on the grounds that Friedman was not sufficiently partisan and not a fanatical tax-cutter.

The nomination of the third economic official, William Donaldson to head the Securities and Exchange Commission, reveals another major concern of the Bush White House—the fear that the scandals which devastated corporate America in the year since Enron filed for bankruptcy will touch leading administration officials personally.

Bush’s first SEC chairman, Harvey Pitt, was under heavy fire throughout the year because of his close ties to the accounting industry—he was an attorney for the industry and its chief lobbyist—and his disinterest in an aggressive investigation into the scandals involving banking, securities, telecommunications and energy-trading firms.

Donaldson, while inevitably described in the corporate-controlled media as a paragon of probity and the oxymoronic “business ethics,” will be a reliable defender, not just of big business in general, but of the Bush family in particular. He is a long-time friend of the elder George H.W. Bush and his brother Jonathan Bush. A Yale graduate, Donaldson is a member of the Skull & Bones society, the secretive fraternal organization to which both the presidents Bush belong. Before co-founding the powerful investment firm Donaldson Lufkin Jenrette in 1959, he served his stock market apprenticeship as a broker and banker at G.H. Walker & Co., run by Herbert Walker, a Bush relation.

Donaldson later served as undersecretary of state to Henry Kissinger and counsel to former vice president Nelson A. Rockefeller, went back to investment banking, then headed the New York Stock Exchange (1990-1995) and served on the board of directors of Aetna, the huge health care insurer, before being named Aetna’s CEO last year. The selection of a former head of the stock exchange to be the market’s chief regulator typifies the Bush administration’s policy of giving corporate America free rein.

All three men are fabulously rich—Donaldson and Friedman through the stock exchange, Snow from the huge payouts now commonplace for the CEOs of big American corporations. Their appointments symbolize the vice-like grip which a tiny oligarchy of wealth exercises over American society.

Snow enjoyed a $2.2 million salary and an $11 million bonus last year, according to CSX financial statements. Under the company’s executive compensation program, he borrowed $24.5 million from CSX in 1996 and purchased company stock valued at $32.3 million. After the windfall profit of nearly $8 million, the company forgave its outstanding loans to Snow and other executives in 2000. He is also eligible to receive several million dollars in severance benefits under terms of a contract provision that awards this perk if he leaves the company to “fulfill an appointment to public office.”

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Jeanie
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525 posts, Nov 2001

posted 12-15-2002 05:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Jeanie     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Sunday Morning America this morning brought out that 2/3rd's of the nations economy depends on consumer spending.

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Mech
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posted 12-15-2002 06:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Amen to that....

What's so sick about it is these corporations have no patriotism anymore. You don't know where Ford, Hershey's, or Huffy bike manufacturing may be tomorrow...it could be in Mexico it could be in Tasmania.

The greed of corporate CEO's and compliant national leaders are the REAL traitors in this country...not anti-war protesters.

It doesnt take a freaking GENIUS to figure out that without an infastructure and manufacturing base there will be NO MONEY to buy all those snazzy new Techno toys they say we have to buy on TV, Billboards, magazines etc. when nobody has any money to spend on them. "Service sector" jobs create a low wage, low spending class of people. Those numbers continue to grow and there isn't anything our leaders plan on doing about it. The U.S. will be the new third world.

We should be already years ahead of all other major industrialized countries with alternative energy, computers, cars, new types of transportation,efficient housing....etc. But NOOOOO...We have to spend most of our GDP on military toys.

It's a disgrace!

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Mech
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posted 12-16-2002 06:14 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
HOW TO RUIN A GREAT COUNTRY......

As a casual observer of what makes this country work and what stops it cold, I hereby offer a few suggestions on how we can ruin American competitiveness and innovation in the course of this century. I think the reader will agree with me that we are already far down the road on many of them:

1) Allow schools to fall into useless decay. Do not teach civics or history except to describe America as a hopelessly fascistic, reactionary pit. Do not expect students to know the basics of mathematics, chemistry and physics. Working closely with the teachers' unions, make sure that you dumb down standards so that children who make the most minimal effort still get by with flying colors. Destroy the knowledge base on which all of mankind's scientific progress has been built by guaranteeing that such learning is confined to only a few, and spread ignorance and complacency among the many. Watch America lose its scientific and competitive edge to other nations that make a comprehensive knowledge base a rule of the society.

2) Encourage the making of laws and rules by trial lawyers and sympathetic judges, especially through class actions. Bypass the legislative mechanisms that involve elected representatives and a president. This will stop--or at least greatly slow down--innovation, as corporations and individuals hesitate to explore new ideas for fear of getting punished (or regulated to death) by litigation for any misstep, no matter how slight, in the creation of new products and services. Make sure that lawsuits against drugmakers are especially encouraged so that the companies are afraid to develop new lifesaving drugs, lest they be sued for sums that will bankrupt them. Make trial lawyers and judges, not scientists, responsible for the flow of new products and services.

3) Create a culture that blames the other guy for everything and discourages any form of individual self-restraint or self-control. Promote litigation to punish tobacco companies on the theory that they compel innocent people to smoke. Make it second nature for someone who is overweight to blame the restaurant that served him fries. Encourage a legal process that can kill a drug company for any mistakes in self-medication. Make it a general rule that anyone with more money than a plaintiff is responsible for anything harmful that a plaintiff does. Promulgate the pitiful joke that Americans are hereby exempt from any responsibility for their own actions--so long as there are deep pockets around to be rifled.

4) Sneer at hard work and thrift. Encourage the belief that all true wealth comes from skillful manipulation and cunning, or from sudden, brilliant and lucky strokes that leave the plodding, ordinary worker and saver in the dust. Make sure that society's idols are men and women who got rich from being sexy in public or through gambling or playing tricks, not from hard work or patience. Make the citizenry permanently envious and bewildered about where real success comes from.

5) Hold the managers of corporations to extremely lax standards of conduct and allow them to get off with a slap on the wrist when they betray the trust of shareholders. This will discourage thrift and investment and ensure that Americans will have far less capital to work with than other societies, while simultaneously developing that contempt for law and social standards that is the hallmark of failing nations. Hold the management of labor unions to no ethical standards.

6) While you're at it, discourage respect for law in every possible way. This will dissolve the glue that holds the nation together, and dissuade any long-term thinking. Societies in which the law can be clearly seen to apply to some and not to others are doomed to decay, in terms of innovation and everything else.

7) Encourage a mass culture that spits on intelligence and study and instead elevates drug use, coolness through sex and violence, and contempt for school. As children learn to be stupid instead of smart, the national intelligence base needed for innovation will simply vanish into MTV-land.

8) Mock and belittle the family. Provide financial incentives to people willing to live an isolated existence, vulnerable and frightened. This guarantees that men and women of sufficient character to bring about innovation will be psychologically stifled from an early age.


9) Develop a suicidal immigration policy that keeps out educated, hardworking men and women from friendly nations and, instead, takes in vast numbers of angry, uneducated immigrants from nations that hate us. This, too, leads to the shrinking of our knowledge base and the eventual disappearance of social cohesion.

10) Enact a tax system that encourages class antagonism and punishes saving, while rewarding indebtedness, frivolity and consumption. Tax the fruits of labor many times:

First tax it as income. Then tax it as real or personal property. Then tax it as capital gains. Then tax it again, at a staggeringly high level, at death. This way, Americans are taught that only fools save, and that it is entirely proper for us to have the lowest savings rate in the developed world. This will deprive us of much-needed capital for new investment, for innovation and our own personal aspirations. It will compel us to ask foreigners for ever more capital and allow them to own more of America. It will also promote an attitude of carelessness about the future and, once again, encourage disrespect for law.

11) Have a socialized medical system that scrimps on badly needed drugs and procedures, resorts to only the cheapest practices and discourages drug companies from developing new drugs by not paying them enough to cover their costs of experimentation, trial and error.

12) Elevate mysticism, tribalism, shamanism and fundamentalism--and be sure to exclude educated, hardworking men and women--to an equal status with technology in the public mind. Make sure that, in order to pay proper (and politically correct) respect to all different ethnic groups in America, you act as if science were on an equal footing with voodoo and history with ethnic fable.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 12-16-2002]

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Mech
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posted 12-26-2002 03:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ECONOMY FADING FAST AS RETAILERS CUT PRICES AS HIGH AS 80 %!!!!!!!!!!!!!

THIS IS SERIOUS.

BLOOMBERG.COM

12/25 12:12
Toys `R' Us, Sears Try Sales in Christmas Salvage Bid (Update1)
By Greg Wiles

New York, Dec. 25 (Bloomberg) -- Toys ``R'' Us Inc., Sears Roebuck & Co. and other retailers will offer after-Christmas discounts of as much as 80 percent, trying to salvage what may be the worst holiday shopping season in more than three decades.

Best Buy Co. is offering two DVDs for $25. Casual Corner will take 50 percent off already-discounted women's clothing. Other retailers, such as department stores Macy's and J.C. Penney Co. plan to open their doors early tomorrow for bargain hunters.

The promotions are aimed at enticing shoppers who curtailed spending in the weeks before Christmas because of concerns about the economy and their jobs. Retailers also need to boost sales to clear shelves for spring merchandise, even if the discounts erode profits, analysts said.

``Consumers have been showing signs of weakening and backing off some, and that just continues,'' said James Luke, who helps manage more than $10 billion at BB&T Asset Management and owns shares of retailers including Wal-Mart Stores Inc.

Sales at stores open at least a year are forecast to rise 1.5 percent in the November-December period from a year earlier, the smallest increase since 1970, according to Bank of Tokyo- Mitsubishi Ltd., which tracks more than 80 retailers.

Department stores and apparel retailers are expected to have the most items to sell because sales forecasts overestimated demand, analysts said. The week after Christmas can account for 11 percent of holiday sales at most mall stores, according to the International Council of Shopping Centers.

Federated Department Stores Inc., which owns Macy's and Bloomingdale's, said Monday that sales were declining more than its estimated 2.5 percent in the November-December period. Macy's will offer discounts of up to 70 percent tomorrow.

Lower Profits

``Retailers are already planning for the spring shopping season,'' in the first half of 2003, said Stephen Spiwak, an economist at management consultant Retail Forward Inc. ``The goal will be to get rid of the current inventories and hope the spring brings better sales.''

Some companies, expecting a slow holiday season, cut back orders and carried less merchandise, so discounts on a number of toys, clothing items and consumer electronics may be hard to find, analysts said. Holiday items will be reduced, with Sears promoting a 50 percent price cut on Christmas decorations.

Electronics retailers Tweeter Home Entertainment Group Inc. and Ultimate Electronics Inc. said this week that quarterly profits will rise less than forecast because of lower sales.

Analysts have lowered fourth-quarter profit forecasts on such retailers as Target, Toys ``R'' Us and Circuit City Stores Inc. because of lowered sales expectations. Circuit City will offer a $190 camcorder and $500 desktop computer, 17-inch monitor and printer package to discount-minded shoppers.

The average profit growth forecast for 137 retailers on Tuesday was 10.7 percent, according to a Thomson First Call survey of analysts.

That's less than the 11.5 percent average profit increase last year, and the 14.6 percent fourth-quarter forecast for Standard & Poor's 500 companies, First Call said. More analysts may revise estimates tomorrow, First Call analyst Ken Perkins said.

Bargain-Driven

``It was a totally bargain-driven holiday season, with consumers looking at price tags before they looked at the product,'' said Kurt Barnard, president of Barnard's Retail Consulting Group. ``Buying was restrained; spending was extremely cautious.''

Some Internet sites began advertising after-Christmas sales on their sites today. Amazon.com Inc. offered 25 percent off some electronics, while Spiegel Inc.'s site promoted 40 percent discounts on bedding. Last year, after-Christmas sales let some retailers, including Wal-Mart, exceed their same-store sales forecasts for December.

Tomorrow, Wal-Mart will report the results of its holiday sales from Saturday through Tuesday. Toys ``R'' Us and some other retailers rely on the two-month holiday season for more than 40 percent of annual sales.

Some companies may close stores, ponder mergers, slow expansion or file for bankruptcy protection because of the lackluster sales season, analysts predicted.

Kmart Corp. filed for bankruptcy last January and later closed stores after poor holiday sales. FAO Inc., the owner of FAO Schwarz and Zany Brainy toy chains, on said yesterday it will close as many as 70 stores before March. The toy seller also is negotiating new credit terms to avert a possible bankruptcy.

``It's almost inevitable in January that retailers who were weak and struggling sort of give up the ghost after the Christmas season,'' said Neil Stern, a partner at McMillan/Doolittle, a retail consultant. He said Kmart may close 15 percent to 20 percent of its stores next year.

``There's probably more on the horizon,'' Stern said.

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theseeker
One moon circles

Damnit...I'm a doctor jim
3403 posts, Jul 2000

posted 12-27-2002 12:22 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for theseeker   Visit theseeker's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
that's crap...

I talked to a wal-mart cashier on the 23rd that ran 7000 in two hours...

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T/S

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David
Chemtrail Information Agent


1280 posts, Oct 2000

posted 12-27-2002 01:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for David     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
According to the experts...

Growth in Sales for Holiday Period Weakest in Years http://www.nytimes.com/2002/12/27/business/27SHOP.html?ex=1042261200&en=439471ebd057b8a4&ei=5004&partner=UNTD

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theseeker
One moon circles

Damnit...I'm a doctor jim
3403 posts, Jul 2000

posted 12-27-2002 02:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for theseeker   Visit theseeker's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
this is funny...you chemtrails folks always say "don't listen to the experts"...and here david is...quoting the nytimes and saying personal observation means nothing...LOL...

the parking lots have been full for weeks...lines long...and the cute girl behind the counter...said she's changing drawers every two hours...2 days before Christmas...hmmm....

screw the nytimes...those liberal bastards wouldn't report factual info unless it would benefit liberal democratic agenda...if clinton were in office..."holiday shopping is at an all time high"...according to the nytimes....

60,000 less folks are on unemployment....seems since their benefits will run out on the 28th of this month some unemployed folks went out and got employed....

m'agine that...

when you have to work you will...

and david as far as lines being long at stores,parking lots full,and talking to real people who know whether people are spending or not...

I seen it with my own eyes !

THOSE DAMN LONG LINES ARE REAL !!!

LOL

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T/S

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David
Chemtrail Information Agent


1280 posts, Oct 2000

posted 12-27-2002 09:18 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for David     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yeah seeker the lines were long, because most stores were offering merchandise at bargin prices to get you to spend your money. Most of the stores in this area and the rest of the country were offering anywhere from 50-80% off, Wal-mart, Kmart, macys, etc, prior to Christmas. Might be crowded but the cash is not there. And I'm sure that W oklahoma is no exception.

Facts seeker, just the facts.

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swamp gas
Senior Member


Jersey City
159 posts, Jun 2001

posted 12-27-2002 09:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for swamp gas   Visit swamp gas's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Seeker,
First of all, I don't feel the New York Times is a liberal paper. At best it is middle of the road. Where the money is, there's the New York Times, be it liberal or conservative. On the other hand, The New York Post, not exactly a haven for liberals, has this article.

http://www.nypost.com/business/65588.htm


I believe it was the deep 50-80% bargains that got a lot of people out shopping, but still not enough to rescue the holiday shopping from it's 30 year low.

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theseeker
One moon circles

Damnit...I'm a doctor jim
3403 posts, Jul 2000

posted 12-28-2002 01:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for theseeker   Visit theseeker's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
well hey so it was and has been a buyer's market ! what the heck is wrong with that...that's the way it should be !!!

see gas...these big companies (toy) in particular...have been having chinese make almost all our toys and plastics...now they are getting a hefty labor break from the free countries overseas that formerly produced toys...india,korea,singapore...etc...

if they are not willing to lower prices at the same time as their costs are lower...then screw'em...and they get what they deserve...the same goes for CEO as everyone else...if you don't want to work find another line of employment...if Americans want bargins the big boys better shit them or go outta business...people don't have to spend money....

profit taking and expectations are too high and have been for 8 years pre-bush2...all the way around...that's why there is a correction going on economically...

a pull back is good, people have the power...and it's about time they excersised it...if a statement were to be made as has been implied of buyer's seeking the better deal,it's only for the good of everyone...companies have to be competitive...

the best statement is boycotting of products...big co.s hate that stuff....and it works...I only buy chinese stuff when there's no suitible replacement...(not including food)

millions of working families who could not afford to buy a home during the clinton years, can now because interest rates are at 40 year low...

things ain't as bad as they seem...

btw gas kwanza is a joke...about as far away from a tradition as can be...it was "invented" in 1966...

inclusion based on falsehoods build resentment in mortal men...

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T/S

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swamp gas
Senior Member


Jersey City
159 posts, Jun 2001

posted 12-28-2002 09:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for swamp gas   Visit swamp gas's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Seeker,
Individual buyers can't prop the economy up forever, and since manufacturing is all going to countries that pay 1-5% of what they pay here, the CEO's are getting hit. The buyers love cheaper goods, even if some of it is inferior. The problem lies in high level financiers taking everybody down in their sinking ship. Could deflation be the next step? This is where libs and cons diverge. One says equality for all......SOCIALISM. The other says you get what you work for........CAPIALISM. Now seriously, Seeker, do you personally know anyone who is extreme in either direction? Socialized Capitalist Proxy Democracy is what I'd like to see. Everyone votes for every issue, no leaders, just honest data collectors. Fines if you don't vote. You can make as much money as you want. Everyone gets a basic living quarters with minimal luxury. Sick, injured, and old never have to worry about being abandoned. If you are young and capable, no welfare. Legalize Pot and make other drugs available through prescription. Close the boarders to cheap laborers and let in scientists and artists. Put art and science back as important subjects in school. Cut off the Arabs life line.....OIL. Develop hydrogen and solar on a Manhattan Project level. Again, it'll take a lot more than shopping at Wal-Mart to get everyone happy.

BTW,
Kwanzaa was "invented" in 1966, just the same as Christmas was "invented" by the Romans. The date of December 25th probably originated with the ancient "birthday" of the son-god, Mithra, a pagan deity whose religious influence became widespread in the Roman Empire during the first few centuries A.D. Mithra was related to the Semitic sun-god, Shamash, and his worship spread throughout Asia to Europe where he was called Deus Sol Invictus Mithras. Rome was well-known for absorbing the pagan religions and rituals of its widespread empire. As such, Rome converted this pagan legacy to a celebration of the god, Saturn, and the rebirth of the sun god during the winter solstice period. The winter holiday became known as Saturnalia and began the week prior to December 25th. The festival was characterized by gift-giving, feasting, singing and downright debauchery, as the priests of Saturn carried wreaths of evergreen boughs in procession throughout the Roman temples. Is it a problem that Africans have their own holiday, as do the Jewish, Muslims, Pagans, and Christians, Pagans?

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Mech
New Member


posts,

posted 12-28-2002 12:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Talking to Seeker about economics is like re-arranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

You are talking to a wall. Seeker has his Wall Street traded nesting egg. I sincerely doubt he gives a rats @$$ about the next man. He's in La la land.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 12-28-2002]

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Mech
New Member


posts,

posted 12-28-2002 12:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote

Nearly 800,000 jobless lose aid
In California, 100,000 are affected. Congress could restore funds next month.

By ANDREW GALVIN
The Orange County Register

Nearly 800,000 jobless Americans - already facing a bleak hiring outlook - are today losing their federal unemployment benefits.


A temporary law that allowed workers who had exhausted their 26 weeks of regular unemployment-insurance benefits to get an additional 13 weeks of payments expires today. Congress was unable to agree on a continuation of the program before adjourning this month.

About 100,000 Californians who have been collecting unemployment on the 13-week extension will lose their benefits, said Suzanne Schroeder, a spokeswoman for the state's Employment Development Department. Schroeder didn't know how many of those people are in Orange County.

Unemployment in Orange County stood at 3.9 percent, or 61,000 people, in November, according to state figures released this month.

Alfred Carrillo, a 44-year-old father of four from Orange who lost his $18-an-hour machinist job in July, still has a month of benefits left under the regular 26-week program. But he will stop getting the $330 weekly checks next month unless Congress acts.

"I don't see why they can't do it," he said. "There's money everywhere. There's money in the budget for this, money in the budget for that. We ought to be able to get money out of the pot for an extension."

Democrats and labor unions, sensing political opportunity, are blaming the cuts on President George W. Bush and Republicans in Congress. Bush, in a late show of support for an extension, urged Congress last week to get it done when lawmakers return to work next month.

"Regrettably, the House Republican leadership refused to act, and the administration chose not to intervene before Congress adjourned," Senate Democratic leader Tom Daschle said.

Bush has now sent a "very strong message" to Congress to extend the benefits and make them retroactive, said Labor Department spokeswoman Kathleen Harrington.

The agency is confident that benefits will be extended, she said, and has been relaying that to many governors who are calling with questions.

Some states will continue to process claims for benefits and at least one state, Idaho, will keep paying them with the expectation that funding will be available early next year, she said.

California has no plan to extend the benefits until Congress acts, said EDD's Schroeder. "Congress will be meeting about it shortly and presumably will pass something. It could be retroactive, but at this point we just don't know," she said.

Scott Carmichael, 45, of Rowlett, Texas, was laid off in June from his job at WorldCom, where he had worked for 17 years.

Carmichael's state benefits are running out and he had counted on an extra 13 weeks of federal benefits that he now won't get because of Congress' inaction on the extension. The biweekly check of $574 helped him and his wife, Laurie, pay the mortgage and health-care costs for their two children, ages 1 and 3.

"It's really an act of discrimination," Laurie Carmichael said, expressing anger at Congress. "They give themselves a raise before they leave and they leave all of us Americans high and dry."

Congress authorized a 3.1 percent pay raise for themselves to $154,700 next year. Lawmakers' salaries have risen $18,000 since 1999.

Catolina Campbell, 60, has been living part-time with her daughter in Anaheim and part-time in her car since losing her job with a medical insurance billing company a month ago. "I'm beating the bushes again," looking for a new job, she said.

She's still getting $500 a month in unemployment benefits, but said the money doesn't go very far. "I can't live on $500 a month. It's pathetic."


THIS IS CONCENTRATION OF WEALTH AND POWER INTO THE HANDS OF THE GLOBALISTS...IT WILL CREATE VAST MONOPOLIES...THIS IS WHY THE ECONOMY IS BEING IMPLODED

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theseeker
One moon circles

Damnit...I'm a doctor jim
3403 posts, Jul 2000

posted 12-29-2002 02:48 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for theseeker   Visit theseeker's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
well yes kwanza it is a problem when it's rammed down my throat...taught at schools etc. and it is...isn't that what kwanza people need to teach ?

anyway mechs an looney when it comes to economics...gas....our system is simple based on consumption....people drive it...and companies produce stuff we want...your idea is rather trekish...and pie in the sky...good intentions...but not feasible...see, our government "representative republic" keeps radical swings of thought in check...providing balance...whereas if everyone had a vote on everything nothing would ever get done because all we would do is vote all the time...and imagine what a *lobby* TV would become...oh...the horror...

we have the best system world wide...it's not perfect and folks just need to understand that...work hard, educate their minds and lift themselves up...it can be done...

I'm with you on the borders, and the alternative fuel...needs to be done...but how bad would that cripple the middle east economy's ? we are stuck with fossil fuels for a long great while I'm afraid...

I'll regret this...but here we go anyway...mech why would it take 26 weeks to find a job ?

Merry Christmas and a healthy new year... gas...In case I forgot



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T/S

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swamp gas
Senior Member


Jersey City
159 posts, Jun 2001

posted 12-29-2002 10:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for swamp gas   Visit swamp gas's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here in Jersey City, the schools definitely teach Kwanzaa, but they also teach other holidays. I don't see it as a problem. It's like the dial on your radio. Tune it if you don't like it.


Voting by proxy could have potential. Just imagine if people voted for their own issues instead of surfing for porn or watching sports. But that would be to much for sleeping America, to THINK FOR ITSELF.


Seeker, that's for the salutations. I happened to see a tree that looked just like that on Solstice Day ( DEC 21). You know the thing about Pagans dancing naked around trees.

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Mech
New Member


posts,

posted 12-29-2002 10:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Again, it's none of your buisness how I make a living. I have a source of income so BITE ME.

Yep, you ARE living in La la land. Stop smoking so much grass and get your head out of your @$$.People are hurting financially. Only a bonehead would think otherwise.

You support a 100% iligitimate and 100% CORRUPT...through-and-through...corporate government that is busy bleeding the system DRY with big payoffs to corporations that contributed to BUSH being "elected" (pfff). That prep-school little $#!+ iscreating debt unseen in decades and starting World War 3...burning EVERY bridge of good will in the middle east we ever had and ensuring further "terrorist attacks" here as well. But hey....the CIA will let it happen.They have before. After all, there HAS to be an excuse to bring in the police state and a world government. All we need are a few more WACO's, OKLAHOMA CITIES, 9/11's mabey even a DIRTY BO^^B?

Yeah...you are just Sooooooo patriotic and such a good little consumer aren't you Seeker.Why don't you just go get your microchip right now like a good PAN-AMERICAN-UNION citizen?

The system need to be 100% overthrown and constitutional law restored. Bush stands accused of high treason and is 100% GUILTY.

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