posted 12-05-2001 12:20 PM            

quote:

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WORLD TRADE CENTER ATTACK - UNANSWERED QUESTIONS

By: Lawrence Stephen Maxwell

http://www.rumormillnews.net/cgi-bin/config.pl?read=13104

Four planes that were supposed to go to particular destinations did not go to those destinations.

Three of the planes hit buildings. One of them crashed in a field in Pennsylvania.

No ones knows what happened because EIGHT (8) indestructible black boxes (2 on each flight) were destroyed or reportedly damaged beyond possible restoration. Guess that is why they are referred to as indestructible. The crash in Pennsylvania did not even cause an explosion. Even if it had, the boxes are designed to withstand twice the maximum heat that can be generated by a jet fuel fire. Why didn't they show us the destroyed boxes?

Do you think the guys who actually found them would talk to anyone? Or are they still alive to discuss what THEY saw with their own eyes? Paper passports of two (2) of the alleged hijackers survived just fine and were supposedly found in the burning ruble of the Pentagon crash, and another three blocks from the WTC.......three blocks. I would bet good money to anyone who thinks he could contrive a way to launch a passport a distance of
three city blocks.

We have been told that seven cell phone calls were made from the planes. Not ONE of the callers described the hijackers as Arabic, Saudi, Muslin, Iranian or anyone from the Middle East.

Barbara Olson, writer, author, investigative reporter, famous commentator, attorney, and wife of the Solicitor General of the United States (Mr. Olson being George W's lawyer who argued before the Supreme Court in Bush v. Gore), did not describe the hijackers to him as being from the middle east. She was trained to be observant and mentally record details, yet there has been no report that she described the hijackers at all. Are we to believe
she didn't describe them, or did she describe them and we just aren't being told? And if we aren't being told, is it because her description doesn't match the profile being fed to us?

And are we to believe the Solicitor General forgot to ask her to DESCRIBE the criminals? I guess we are to accept that this is obviously an insignificant "fact" that the most high-powered-lawyer in the United States would understandably forget to ask.

From almost the moment it happened it was dubbed an ATTACK ON AMERICA. I have videotape referring to it in that manner BEFORE George W made his speech in the Florida elementary school and went prancing across the country. It has NEVER been referred to as an Attack on the United States. In everything the federal government does from a legal perspective - writing and executing laws, prosecution -- everything is the based on an entity known as the United States. But on September 11, 2001 and every day since,
the criminal acts were an Attack on America. Why are we suddenly America, not the United States?

The Pentagon is NOT in the District of Columbia -- it is in Virginia. That is a FACT and it would take volumes to explain its significance. I will give you a hint. D.C. is the United States. Virginia and New York are American States. I am doing some research to find out, but I do not believe that the soil under the Pentagon was ever ceded by Virgina to the United
States. I know for CERTAIN that the Arlington National Cemetery has NOT been ceded because a federal prosecution for larceny in the Cemetery was dismissed a few decades back by a federal district court because the federal government has no territorial jurisdiction (United States v. Penn, 48 F. 669 (E.D.Va., 1880). The State of Virgina prosecuted the felony. That area was
first ceded to the federal government for the seat of government in 1791 along with land on the east side of the Potomac ceded by Maryland for the same purpose.

Collectively the 10-mile-square was to be the seat of government as specified in 1.8.17 of the federal constitution. Thomas Jefferson and the Virginia Legislature took it back (22 square miles) after Jefferson and Washington had a serious rift over civil rights issues in 1792 (making Virginians license carriages and wagons and carry identification on their person). The place where the Pentagon and the Cemetery are situated was the General Robert E. Lee Plantation and Estate. It was sold to the federal
government after the Civil War.

Had the planes hit a military installation that had been ceded (federal territory) or anything in DC (78 square miles of federal territory ceded by Maryland under 1.8.17 of the federal constitution in 1791) it would immediately be considered and ACT OF WAR, not terrorism. Pearl Harbor was a military base. Hawaii was federal territory. That ATTACK was an ACT OF WAR. In this instance none of the planes hit anything in federal territory.

The soil was American soil of two of the States which united to form the United States of America and to create the military government known as the United States that would protect America. Hence, Attack on America.

BATF (Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, and Firearms) agents have been walking around all over the ruble for two weeks. Why?

More defense systems were disabled than can even be listed. And the media are NOT talking about THAT.

When OKC was bombed, all we heard for more than a week was Osama Bin Laden, Osama Bin Laden. Then they pinned it on a guy that they said was driving a Ryder rental truck.

They arrested McVeigh, according to news reports, 2 hours after the bombing, driving south on Interstate 45 toward Dallas..barefoot, no shirt, plates expired, no driver license, speeding, with a loaded .45 caliber automatic on the front seat. Just exactly what you would expect from someone who had
just blown up an 8 story building with a fertilizer bomb.

From that moment on, they called OKC a terrorist act. Without McVeigh they had no terrorist. We still, to this day, do not know what McVeigh was supposedly trying to influence the civilian population to do, or how he was supposedly trying to influence government policy....

By definition this was NOT a terrorist act (attached as PDF file). But the media spin is NOT based on FACT or LAW.

See Attachment: PDF of definition of ACT OF TERRORISM from Black's Law Dictionary, Abridged 6th Edition -- adopted word for word by Congress codified at 18 USC § 3077. (You will need Acrobat Reader to download and read Black's Law Dictionary's legal definition of "terrorism." If you cannot download it, email Widowmaker and he will send it to you in email form).

Do you really think that a few 120 pound middle-easterners overtook eight pilots, and their crew members and passengers, using razor-blade boxcutters? Do you really think a commercial pilot would give up his plane under threat from ANYONE with a boxcutter? How many hijackings have you ever heard of where the hijackers brought their own pilot? And four times in one day?

And if you were going to do this deed, wouldn't you have a driver's license in your own name, get your pilot's license in your own name, and leave your calling card everywhere you went, being rude and obnoxious so everyone would notice you?

Explain to me how all of the defense systems were disabled? How did four planes, that were not on their computerized flight paths, fly around for more than an hour and a half without alarms going off all over the place? When their altitudes and positions CEASED TO BE VISIBLE ON RADAR, why weren't people (air traffic
controllers) alarmed?

As close as Boston and Dulles are to D.C., why would disappearing planes NOT be a cause for alarm? Why was it more than an hour AFTER the WTC crashes that fighters were scrambled? Was the Air Force sleeping at 7:45 AM on a Tuesday morning when the planes were supposedly hijacked, and deviated from their designated flight paths?

Are we supposed to believe that when a transponder is turned OFF that no one is alerted that the plane is no longer being tracked by altitude; and that such a thing could occur to four planes almost simultaneously in the same geographical region, dangerously close to the seat of government, and NO ONE was alerting the media, the defense department, or anyone?

Am I supposed to believe that no one even had a clue for an hour and a half from the time the first plane left its flight plan until smoke started coming out of a WTC tower? And when the first plane hit the tower, no one knew that three other planes were missing, and thought it prudent to call the media or government officials and tell them that three other planes were missing and that other locations might not be safe?

I have talked to three pilots who have told me in their own words and understandings that what we are being told happened, could NOT possibly have happened.

What I DO KNOW is that we are not hearing much TRUTH. And 110 story buildings do NOT collapse because a plane hits them. The second plane nearly missed the building, only going through the corner. Most of the fuel burned in an outside explosion. It collasped first, long before the tower that the plane completely entered. The refined Kerosene (a/k/a jet fuel) burned up fairly quickly. The stuff burning from that point on was desks, paper, plastics, carpet, etc. That fuel did not generate 2000-degree heat that would compromise 6 tubular steel columns in the center of the building designed SPECIFICALLY to keep the building from collapsing if hit by a Boeing 707 that, because it was older and less efficient, carried MORE fuel that the 757 and 767 that hit the towers. The structural engineer who designed the WTC Towers explained how the towers were designed to withstand a hit by a commercial jet -- and he did explain this to an international
coalition on Terrorism in Frankfurt, Germany on Wednesday before the event.

And 53 minutes after Tower 2 was hit the tower just imploded because it was on fire? Yeah right! I discussed this with a structural engineer who investigated a HOTEL in Los Angeles that he said was 30 stories and it burned from the ground floor up. It burned for nearly a week. The fire totally destroyed everything on all 30 floors. The estimated temperatures
were 2200 degrees because of the natural gas and other fuel that was the catalyst for the fire.

The concrete and infrastructure did not budge. It cost more than a million dollars to TEAR IT DOWN. The 30 floors above the first floor did NOT cave in on the first floor when the support structure go hot. And he reviewed the architecture on the WTC and said the type of steel and the type of construction for the WTC was double the strength of the LA hotel.

Just like in OKC, people reported hearing multiple EXPLOSIONS before the WTC collapsed. I have video of people who were interviewed after the collapses and they said they heard a series of explosions (not floors collapsing) and then the buildings came down. The media dismissed it as exploding main gas lines. Gas mains on the 104th floor? Yeah right!

We know that there would NOT be any safety mechanism in place that would have shut off gas flow throughout the buildings in the case of fire -- 53 minutes after a plane hit the building. Guess it was a big gas valve and it could not be vented to the outside air after it was shut off. If that is true, I have better safety measures in my own house than the WTC had.

And why would they need safety mechanisms in place? It isn't like anyone has ever tried to blow up those same two towers before.

The strength of the WTC towers was in the 6 Tubular Steel Columns in the CENTER of the buildings, not the steel structure on the outside like most construction. The buildings were literally, according to the builder, designed NOT to pancake in the event of a Boeing 707 crashing into them. But they collapsed. It took 53 minutes for Tower 2 and 88 minutes for Tower 1 -- to simply COLLAPSE. Excerpts of his speech in Germany were posted to
the internet five days before the planes hit the towers.

My take? Americans are not very bright. Americans don't think. They accept what they are told. They don't TEST what they are told. They are lazy, and naive to the point of being undeserving of liberty. And for that reason they will sacrifice liberty for what they perceive to be security. That is exactly, in fact, the genesis for the federal government.

The States gave up their RIGHTS in exchange for perceived security. And as long as the talking-heads can convince the general public that the federal government can PROTECT THEM, the sheople will patriotically give up every right they have if it makes them feel safe -- while singing GOD BLESS AMERICA.

Copyright October 2001
Lawrence Stephen Maxwell
Permission granted to reproduce and distribute

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by Barry Chamish
http://www.rumormillnews.net/cgi-bin/config.pl?read=12647

posted 01-27-2002 07:32 AM            

A White Knight Talking Backwards

By Michael C. Ruppert
1-25-2

[Copyright 2002, Michael C. Ruppert and From The Wilderness Publications, www.copvcia.com, all rights reserved. May be reposted, reprinted or distributed for non-profit purposes only when this statement appears with the text.]


TORONTO - Delmart Edward "Mike" Vreeland, an American citizen whose claims to being a US Naval Lieutenant assigned to the Office of Naval Intelligence (ONI) are being increasingly corroborated in open court, has been in a Canadian jail since December 6, 2000. On August 11 or 12 of 2001, the date is uncertain, after trying to verbally alert his Canadian jailers to the coming World Trade Center attacks, he wrote down key information and sealed it in an envelope which he then had placed in jailers' custody. Exactly what the letter said is unknown at this point. The letter has fallen into a black hole of national secrecy with the lid sealed by two governments. What is known is that when the envelope was opened on September 14th it set off alarms in the US and Canada. According to reports in The Toronto Star, a burgeoning court record, and his lawyers, the envelope mentioned Osama bin Laden, the World Trade Center, the Pentagon and imminent attacks.

The US wants Vreeland back in the States on a Michigan warrant for credit card fraud - using his own credit card. Vreeland, convinced that a return to the US means certain death, wants to stay in Canada in a witness protection program. His lawyers Rocco Galati and Paul Slansky, two former Canadian prosecutors, agree with Vreeland's assessment. They should. Both have been the victims of harassment and threats including dead cats hung on porches and car windows smashed out in car burglaries.

The position -- less defensible by the day -- of the United States government, as represented by Crown Solicitors in Toronto, is that all of this is nonsense. Vreeland, says the Navy, was discharged as a Seaman after a few months of service for unsatisfactory performance in 1986. He has never had anything to do with intelligence according to 1200 pages of Navy records filed in Toronto Superior Court.

On its face the official US position is absurd. And the courtroom prowess of Slansky and Galati in making a mockery of the straight-faced presentations of opposing counsel and the US government are eerily unnoticed by any major media and, apparently, also the judge.

"How is it," says Galati, "that the Navy says that he was only in the service a few months and then send us a 1200 page personnel file? Some of the entries are obvious forgeries or alterations and the sanitizing of his records was done so hurriedly that some dates of medical exams in the 1990s were left intact."

In a January 10, 2002 tactic worthy of Perry Mason, with the greatest possible risk to his client if it failed, attorney Slansky got the judge to agree to let him call the Pentagon from open court. Using a speaker phone, in front of at least six witnesses, Slansky first dialed directory information and got a number for the Pentagon switchboard. Then, calling that number he asked the Department of Defense operator to locate the office of Lt. Delmart Vreeland. Within moments the operator had confirmed Vreeland's posting, his rank as a Lieutenant O-3, his room number and given Slansky his direct-dial number.

All of this is a part of the court record.

On January 17, as this writer sat in the courtroom, another mind numbing event occurred.

As Vreeland sat shackled in a corner, closely flanked by two guards, the Crown Solicitor sought to debunk Vreeland's assertions that he had been assigned to travel to Moscow to review and retrieve highly technical and classified documents pertaining to Russian and Chinese efforts to counter the proposed US "Star Wars" missile defense system. [Ed Note: We believe this to be a cover story]. "Why," said the Crown Solicitor, "would the US choose, in a case involving some of the most highly technical intelligence, a random seaman with training in the tool and die field." The point that someone discharged in 1986 with no special training and rank would be sent to review technical documents sounded reasonable - assuming that Vreeland's background was as the Solicitor argued.

The reasonableness vanished a few moments later as the Crown Solicitor argued that Vreeland, who has been in jail and without access to a computer for thirteen months, had somehow cracked the Pentagon's personnel records and inserted his name, an office number, and telephone extension into the Pentagon database.

No one except for Vreeland and attorney Galati seemed to notice the contradiction.

The Crown Solicitor ventured further through the looking glass by then arguing that Vreeland, having certain papers in his possession at the time of his arrest, had memorized Russian and Albanian documents and then had translated them from memory. Vreeland doesn't speak Russian or Albanian. The judge, waking up for this one, asked the Solicitor to restate the point. The argument then became that Vreeland had an unnamed colleague go to an unspecified web site, print Russian and Albanian documents for him, and then used foreign language dictionaries to translate them.

Vreeland's extradition process could take years and his time in jail has not been easy. There have been threats, illnesses and his every move is watched. Galati and Slansky wonder how long his psyche will hold up. The history of jailhouse deaths of key witnesses leans heavily in favor of Vreeland's belief that he could be killed at any moment. His apparent strategy is to not reveal any accurate Top Secret material to either his lawyers or the press, hoping that his silence will provide him with some support from US clandestine services. This a standard approach taken in dozens of similar cases researched by FTW in the past They include the cases - well known in research circles - of William Tyree and Michael Riconosciuto. Tyree has been jailed on a questionable murder conviction since 1979 and Riconosciuto on a variety or drug-related charges since the early 1990s. Both men have been directly connected to CIA and other intelligence operations by official documents.

"We don't need to know and we don't want to know the secret details, "says Galati. "They're not necessary for us to do the job of keeping our client alive and in Canada. He faces a special danger in the US because he has also been an informant against an organized crime family in Michigan where the criminal charges originate. The most he is facing there is two years but we believe he might not live for two days in that system."

Additional press reports indicate that Vreeland's intelligence work was connected to drug smuggling - a much more likely reason for his trip to Moscow. And the history of the relations between Naval Intelligence and the mafia is documented as far back as the Second World War when ONI officers made deals with convicted mafia don Lucky Luciano and his Lieutenant Vito Genovese to protect New York docks and assist with the subsequent Allied invasion and occupation of Italy.

Mike Vreeland is one man who, in a rational world, could totally expose the complicity of the US government in the attacks of September 11th. No one has disputed what he wrote and stuffed into that mysterious envelope. In a rational world that would be the most pressing and public inquiry of all. The two questions remaining are whether Vreeland will live and whether or not he will ever tell what he knows. That may be a mutually exclusive proposition.

FTW has retained the services of freelance journalist Greta Knutsen in Toronto to report on developments in this critical case for our subscribers. Important updates will be posted and sent out via subscriber bulletin to our readers as they become available.
http://www.rense.com/general19/knight.htm

posted 01-27-2002 08:12 AM            

BUSH KNEW ABOUT THE FIRST CRASH BEFORE ENTERING BOOKER SCHOOL

Associated Press reporter Sonya Ross was one of the journalists covering Bush's trip to Florida on the morning of 9-11. Ms. Ross was either on her way to the Booker School or already there when she learned of the first WTC crash:

"My cell phone rang as President Bush's motorcade coursed toward Emma E. Booker Elementary School in Sarasota, Fla. A colleague reported that a plane had crashed into the World Trade Center in New York.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Cheney was talking with MEET THE PRESS journalist Tim Russert about the flight path of American Flight 77, which struck the Pentagon. Here's the exchange:

"VICE PRES. CHENEY: ...As best we can tell, they [American Flight 77] came initially at the White House and...

"MR. RUSSERT: The plane actually circled the White House?

"VICE PRES. CHENEY: Didn't circle it, but was headed on a track into it. The Secret Service has an arrangement with the F.A.A. They had open lines after the World Trade Center was... "

"MR. RUSSERT: Tracking it by radar.

"VICE PRES. CHENEY: And when it entered the danger zone and looked like it was headed for the White House was when they grabbed me and evacuated me to the basement... (Etc.)" MEET THE PRESS Transcript (5)

It appears that Cheney may have blurted out the crucial fact that the Secret Service had an open line to the FAA, then realized he was talking too much and stopped before completing his sentence. But if he did indeed talk too much, he also stopped talking too late. It is obvious that the sentence should have ended with the word 'hit' or something similar. Thus:

"The Secret Service has an arrangement with the F.A.A. They had open lines after the World Trade Center was hit."

The Secret Service had a special connection with the FAA so that it could rapidly access information relevant to the President's safety. After the first WTC attack, the connection between the FAA and the Secret Service was elevated to the level of open lines.

(In a similar fashion, orders issued by the FAA and the Joint Chiefs of Staff require heightened contact between the FAA and the National Military Command Center (NMCC) during hijackings. See 'Guilty for 9-11, Section 2: Cheney's Cover Story ') (6)

Therefore, by the time American Flight 11 crashed into the World Trade Center, around 8:46, and most likely before that happened, the Secret Service knew what the FAA knew.

So, what did the FAA know?

The FAA admits that at 8:20 it 'suspected' that American Flight 11 had been hijacked. (7) And according to the official story released Sept. 14th:

"8:40 [the] FAA notifie[s] NEADS (the Northeast Air Defense Sector) of NORAD, the military's civil defense system, about Flight 11, [i.e., that it had been hijacked.]" Newsday 23 September 2001 (7)

Therefore, based on the official story, the Secret Service knew by 8:40 or before that Flight 11 had been hijacked. And since the FAA was tracking Flight 11, as was the National Military Command Center, which is notified of hijackings and has access to radar from all over the country, (8) it is definite that at 8:46 the Secret Service knew a hijacked plane had crashed into the World Trade Center.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
So according to the official story, before the President entered the Booker School, indeed, apparently before he left his hotel, the Secret Service knew that, for the first time in US history, the country had been attacked by terrorists from the air.

The Secret Service, which employs more than 4,000 people, has several responsibilities. The most important is protecting the President. And surely, this means first of all keeping him out of unnecessary danger because prevention is better than cure. This is especially true in regard to certain dangers:

"During the cold war, when security agents used to play war games involving terrorist threats to the White House, the one unsolvable problem was a commercial airliner loaded with explosives working its way into the landing pattern at Washington National Airport, then veering off for a suicide plunge into the White House." (TIME Magazine) (9)

The Secret Service has long been aware that one of the trickiest security dangers is posed by a suicide attack from a hijacked commercial airplane from a nearby airport. On a day when planes were being hijacked from different airports and crashing into buildings, a top security precaution would be to keep the President away from a publicly announced appointment at a building near an airport.

The Booker School is fewer than 5 miles from the Sarasota-Bradenton International Airport.

posted 01-27-2002 09:02 PM            

I'm not trying to bury other peoples posts!

posted 01-27-2002 09:05 PM            

Other Trails is my favorite area, because it covers more than chemtrails. I'm not going to stop adding comments just because you think I'm trying to push your topic to the bottom of the list or it's too hard for you to assimilate. If you don't want to read my messages, then don't. You can always just 'bump' a thread to the top, if it makes you feel better.

posted 01-27-2002 09:34 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by KnewEyes:
I don't want to talk for weeks on those other subjects defender. I think this is pretty much the most important thing to allow our brains to assimilate.

I am tired of seeing the important information being pushed to the bottom. I'm calling you on that defender, I knew you'd be posting your brains out in the "Other Trail" categories after I posted this ,, this morning. You also did that with IZAKOVICS "Saturation Within" report post, 2 times last week after I brought it to the top.Youtend to do it "all the time".

---

You are waayyyy off base with this stuff KnewEyes. I have no knowledge of Izakovics report, or whatever it was you said about what you posted this morning that would make me "post my brains out"!?

Maybe you've been reading something from those great 'debunker' websites? Maybe some disinfo about yours truly? That's my best guess as to these accusations and use of "Fighting Back" against me. "Fighting Back" has always referred to 'debunkers' attempts to shut down conversations about conspiracy. If you've really read any of my posts, you'd know that I am anything but a 'debunker'! Why do you think I'm writing all these posts, trying to get people to think about these things I bring up in Other Trails??

In fact, I just brought up the topic of "17 methods of Suppressing the Truth" this very morning as a follow-up to my trying to find the "Fighting Back" thread on 1/17/02 in the Chemtrail Forum.

Check it out. Did you know that? or did you just forget? If you knew that, then you must be playing games?

posted 01-27-2002 10:10 PM            

Canadian Television Openly
Questions 911 'Problems' http://www.rense.com/general19/canadianTV.htm

posted 01-28-2002 08:10 AM            

KnewEyes, the last post on Page 1 of "Other Trails" is dated 01/09/02. If you want to keep important topics on Page 1, just add another post every two weeks, and they will stay there.

posted 01-28-2002 10:54 AM            

Maybe I'm posting too much lately, in your opinion and certainly in the opinion of 'debunkers'. I have hot and cold streaks. When I get onto something thats interesting to me, like mind control theories about rock music, or other mysterious stuff like Masonry and ET contact, I like to talk/write about it.

I think it's relative to conspiracy issues like chemtrails, non-consensual human experimentation, political corruption, WTC bombing, OK City Bombing, assassinations.

If you look in the archives over the past 2 years and even more recently, you can see that my messages are like yours, just not centered on what you think is the main problem.

If you're not as interested in these things as I am, all you have to do is talk about your own interests, or explain why you think my posts aren't relevant to how things are, even as you see them. If you feel so strongly about something, like I do, then you should be writing about it, not complaining about how many posts I make, or how you think I'm trying to bury your topics.

I think my threads are self-expanatory. If all or even some of these conspiracies are real, then it's that much more likely that chemtrails are a conspiracy, and possibly a very dangerous conspiracy that is having a negative impact on our health. It's also another indication to me that there is a 'power elite' in control of world events that we have little, if any control over, partly because most people have never heard about it, that's why I personally look at media control and 'infotainment' (among many other things) as something that people need to be aware of. I look at the broad picture, whereas, you may just be interested in one or a few topics.

There are members, I'm sure who won't read a message just because they see it's been written by 'defender'. There are a couple of members posts I don't read for the same reason, I don't care about what that member may have to say. So, how hard it that?

Still, I don't see how any of my subject matter runs contrary to what you claim to be your opinions about why things are the way they are? So, I'm not going to keep trying.

posted 01-28-2002 03:34 PM            

For the record I have not noticed usurping of threads here by Defender. Both of you do seem to post some of the same types of ideas so I'd have to think that maybe it is just one of those Internet things. You know... when you try to discern intent behind the posts and read too much in to it. With all the conspiracies that do exists it is easy to find or believe in ones that may not in fact be there.

posted 01-30-2002 11:14 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by KnewEyes:

I tend to look for the roots of whatever I am trying to figure out, whereas, maybe you like to look at the branches.

When I see articles others post that are extrememly relevant, I try to either add to them, but I never, never post 4 to 6 new topics about "anything else" above theirs.

See, I want to get to the bottom of who the hell started this wtc bull to begin with. I want to concentrate on finding the culprits. The real ones. Those are the roots of this whole "war" scene the World is gearing up for right now. I think it is important for everyone to begin to question EVERYTHING about 911... not just the supposed loss of the black boxes, or the fringe of the whole episode.

I want the eyes of the public to be drawn to the Roots of the problem.

I am not afraid to speak out about controversial subjucts as you well know.

---

KnewEyes,

As I've said before, some of my messages are for the benefit of any govt.type orgs that may be tuning in, as Thermit has mentioned before. Some of my posts are directed at law enforcement agencies that are compartmentalized, meaning that many of those agents/employees aren't aware of the information/links I'm posting. What you consider 'branches' of a problem are extremely important pieces or clues necessary to solve a crime, which is what these conspiracies are, large or small. That's the audience I'm trying to reach in those cases.

IMO, when any visitors, (government employees or not) can see all of these 'branch conspiracies', they'll come to the same conlusion I have; The 'root' problem is a 'power elite' or TPTB that is responsible for most if not all of these branches. The trick is naming those powers directly. Many of the government agencies I've referred to already have the names, I'm just trying to give them some help, tell them that some of us out here already know what's going on and we support them!

I'm really not aware of all of your posts, because I don't always read them. No offense, but you have your way and I have mine. Maybe I should start reading them.

If you think I'm being rude, that's your opinion. Personally, I think it's rude/discourteous of you to try to label me as a debunker, but I guess you have that right in an open forum.

I've had conflicts with 'debunkers', when they've made direct attacks against me, (which you seem to have done here in this WTC thread), so if you think the number of posts I make about conspiracies makes me a 'debunker', that's your option. I don't think most people would agree with you though. For anyone who does agree with KnewEyes about all this, I hope I've made things clear for you?

For the record, again, I'm not trying to bury anyones posts or topics. I am running into a cold or dry period though, but if I get hot again, don't be surprised if I make several comments on one or several threads at the same time. It doesn't mean I'm trying to close your topic, (as if I could anyway!?)... unless you are one of those 'debunkers' that have tried to shut down one of the threads I've started, like this one, WTC Attack;unanswered questions!

posted 04-06-2002 03:54 AM            

It matters little to a housewife in Kansas if Mike Vreeland has a very confusing criminal arrest record—some of it very contradictory and apparently fabricated—for a variety of petty criminal offenses including fraud. But it may be a matter of the gravest importance for the same housewife if this man knew accurate information about the attacks, tried to warn both the U.S. and Canadian governments about them, and was ignored. If a crazy man runs up to you on the street and says that a house is on fire with children trapped inside, and you smell smoke, who is the crazy one if you decide not to investigate?

The U.S. Navy says that Vreeland, arrested in Canada on Dec. 4, 2000 and currently fighting a U.S. extradition warrant, was discharged for unsatisfactory performance after only four months of service in 1986. But a growing pile of evidence, much of it filed in court records and undisputed by Canadian or U.S. authorities, establishes clearly that Vreeland was exactly what he says he was—a spy.

In three previous stories, FTW has described how his military records, acknowledged to be in excess of 1,200 pages, have been tampered with. We have described how, in open court on a speakerphone, his lawyers obtained direct confirmation from the Pentagon that he was a Navy officer. We have also reported that, as of March 14, all Canadian charges against Vreeland were dismissed. He was released on bail and also granted temporary refugee status by the Canadian government until his battle to beat the U.S. extradition request is settled.

Something that Canadian authorities have never disputed is that Vreeland wrote his ominous and hastily scribbled warning a full month before the attacks, and that the warning was sealed away by his keepers, beyond his reach, until Sept. 14, three days after the attacks.

If he loses his extradition fight, both Vreeland and his attorneys believe that his assassination will occur within days of his return to U.S. soil.

Mike Vreeland is not a saint. Covert operatives are not made from such material, and governments do not recruit or screen candidates for saintly qualities. By his own admission in Canadian court documents and in several conversations with FTW, Vreeland says he has done bad things. He has been on probation for petty offenses, and he has behaved the way covert operatives behave in the real world—not in Hollywood.

I have been studying, interacting with, and talking to covert operatives for more than 25 years. It is for that reason that I avoid some of the questions being raised by dilettantes and neophyte journalists who take all of the threads of Vreeland's stories and run with them into a wilderness from which no professional journalist could credibly emerge. Yes, I have listened to him talk about so-called "red mercury," baseball-sized atom bombs, and Star Wars weapons systems. Yes, I have heard him talk about a great many things, and I believe that what he told me was truthful according to his knowledge of events and the documents he brought back from Moscow in December 2000.

Even by his own statements, Vreeland, now 35, was a relatively low ranking officer and an intelligence field operative. Never in the history of covert operations has any government entrusted field operatives with total strategic knowledge because the knowledge held by those who make the plans is compartmentalized and locked away. Perhaps 80 percent of all intelligence work is disinformation, and governments know that their field operatives risk capture, interrogation and torture. Quite often field operatives are themselves fed disinformation so that if they talk, they will still spread lies that serve a larger strategic purpose. Quite often they carry documents that are deliberately inaccurate and their capture is engineered to give those documents credibility.

To the U.S. government, Vreeland is totally expendable. And those who run with every piece of information he has disclosed will themselves be proven fools in a fool's game.

But one question remains. And it is a question that now stands vindicated by time and events. He knew something chillingly accurate about the 9-11 attacks before they happened. And if he knew something, based upon documents given to him by Russian officials indicating U.S. knowledge, and if the U.S. government went to great lengths to discredit him, rather than bring him in from the cold—then there is real meat on the plate for journalists, the American government, and all of mankind.

I have asked him 35 questions, and now you can read Mike Vreeland's answers as he speaks for himself. The first 32 questions were jointly submitted to both Vreeland and his attorney, Paul Slansky, for review. The remaining three questions were asked after the most recent hacking of FTW's website, which we believe was perpetrated by the CIA. This made the publication of this story an emergency and also made a statement about the survival of a free press in America:

posted 04-06-2002 04:06 AM            

quote:

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September 12, 2001

New York City

Louie Cacchioli, 51, is a firefighter assigned to Engine 47 in Harlem.

We were the first ones in the second tower after the plane struck. I was taking firefighters up in the elevator to the 24th floor to get in position to evacuate workers. On the last trip up a bomb went off. We think there was bombs set in the building. I had just asked another firefighter to stay with me, which was a good thing because we were trapped inside the elevator and he had the tools to get out.

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posted 04-06-2002 07:30 AM            

Concerning the events of 9-11, from the morning when I saw the second airliner hit the second WTC tower, I had a sinking-stinking gut feeling that america was in for a wild 'magic show'.

From the second tower collapseing AHEAD of the first one hit, to the imploding of both buildings AS IF they were taken down by a professional E.O.D. crew who demolishes buildings, there were initially FAR too many anomalies, items that simply made no logical sense, changed 'reports' and 'convenient' evidence found to make the 'official reports' ring true for me.

Since that morning, many pieces of the puzzle have emerged, going back years...but this is still a huge wilderness of mirrors..

False trails laid down over false trails, with dead ends and 'suspects' strewn over so much time that it becomes un-ravelable for the average person..
This is typical of agencies such as the KGB., MOSSAD,SAS, CIA..

While I am aware of and have read about every article I could find,( including those written in other countries), I also think it's important to NOT get wrapped up in any one of the anomalies to make it the pivot point of the quest for truth..

I suspect that those who have laid down the 'false trails' have more than a few of these 'straw men' laying about, and IF there were an investigation of any real import, those will be the first to be scrutinized..
Of course, despite the appearance of an anomalie, these items will be proven to 'make sense' and 'fit' the official line because they were 'planted'.

Like Kneweyes and others, while we make notes of all the reports, letters, articles, anomalies, history etc, I tend to look ahead and back to determine WHO was behind the events ..

As with all such things, the 'crime' will have some hallmarks of the perpetrators..

One of the key issues is WHO is benefitting and WHO will benefit from the disasters?

BIG benefits..Big money, BIG power..

One of the most sobering thoughts is this:
IF I had the absolute complete file and history, pictures etc from the perpetrators in my hands...Exactly to WHOM would I take it? Who has the power to take the evidence and prosecute?
Who would listen, Who could be trusted, Who cannot be bought or made to disappear?

With such monumental wickedness and evil in high places, I can think of only One who could make this right and bring the guilty to justice.
I have committed this, and other events similar in their contrived evil from the last 15 years in this country,to Him who can and will judge righteously.

Meanwhile, I learn, look, investigate, and watch..Encourageing any who will listen to do likewise so at the very least, we can step aside when the steamroller heads our way..

BTW, WWW.WHATREALLYHAPPENED.COM among many others, has some excellent and insightful articles..

As best you are able, PROVE ALL THINGS, holding fast to that which is good(true, right)

As with any such site, be attuned for those illusional bits and pieces that will inevitably be thrown in with the valid evidence on such sites by those seeking to obscure the truth..
Godspeed and good hunting..jim

posted 04-06-2002 08:12 AM            

The question was NOT intended to have anyone quail in their search for truth, answers or accountabilities concerning WTC,Chemtrails,Waco, OK City,the 'war against terror', the Mideast crisis..even tho it becomes clear that against such monstrous power and evil mankind has little innate power to bring justice or halt such evil.

IF those who see and know, who have the 'spiritual eyes & ears' to discern evil and falsehoods do nothing else, we LEARN.

We learn that the warfare we are engaged in to preserve love, life, truth, hope, right is one in which we cannot engage successfully without the armor of the Almighty..Elohim-Adonai, Yahweh and his only begotten son, Yahshua..with the Holy Spirit residing and guiding us from within.

We MUST learn and be prepared to face and stay free of a far more diabolical deception which is brewing for all of mankind.

This deception and associated crimes will not be just about death, loss of freedoms,the ecology,human rights,oil, power, drugs, corruption in political arens or the subjugation of people in human terms only.

The greatest deception being staged for mankind has our very souls, spirits and eternal welfare at stake.

The evil men and powers presently at work are not the true root cause, but are willing and sometimes unwitting 'tools' of the master deceiver and enemy of life and of the Creator..He is the hater or God and the destroyer of hope and men's souls.

Only by prayer, vigilance and clothing our hearts, minds and being with the protections offered us by the Creator can we elude the huge net being cast, escape the snares to come.

For those who have yet to know the Creator and His savior, listen up with your whole hearts..for you are being called.

For those who DO, trust implicitly and abide under His care and protection, guarding your hearts and minds.
Even tho we must still 'live in this world', we mus stay free so we do not become 'of this world'...a part of the evil systems.

Call upon Him and He will answer you and give strength and hope far beyond your own to overcome every evil that comes your way.

...lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil..

Even IF we 'see' the truth in every issue in current events, IF we fall victims to the final and ultimate deceit because we have no foundation of faith and knowlege of the Creator and His Savior, all will be for nought...

May His love, peace, hope, faith and power be upon you and emanate from you every moment of every day..Selah.jim

posted 04-06-2002 08:55 AM            

Canada Court Case Reveals UN
Naval Officer Had Advance
Knowledge Of 911 Attacks

A White Knight Talking Backwards

By Michael C. Ruppert
1-25-2