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  TOTAL TYRANNY = NWO (Page 4)

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FLKook
Chemspiracy Realist


East Central Florida
1592 posts, Apr 2001

posted 01-04-2003 08:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FLKook     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
RE: BUSH's PLAN TO MUZZLE INTERNET FREE SPEECH...
Saw that one coming a mile away, let the wrestling begin.

Please folks WAKE UP!!! This is not conspiracy theory this is conspiracy reality. For cryin' out loud....WAKE UP!!!

Great post and great web site Mech, this one was linked from the bottom of the article. Thought I'd share it here for the click lazy.

http://www.underreported.com/modules.php?op=modload&name=News&file=article&sid=609

Your papers please" comes to Nevada
Posted by: Admin on Friday, December 27, 2002 - 11:54 AM GMT

According to a Dec. 21, 2002 Las Vegas Review-Journal article:
In a 4-3 decision in which justices debated terrorism and its effect on American civil liberties, the state Supreme Court ruled Friday that a police officer can order a suspect to produce identification.
The majority decided that Humboldt County Deputy Sheriff Lee Dove rightfully asked suspect Larry Hiibel to identify himself out of concern for his personal safety.

Hiibel refused to identify himself during a May 2000 stop just outside of Winnemucca because he did not believe he did anything wrong. After Dove asked him 11 times to produce identification, Hiibel was arrested. The law requires people to identify themselves to police when ordered to do so.

In a stinging dissenting opinion, Justice Deborah Agosti said the court majority "has allowed the first layer of our civil liberties to be whittled away."

She contended that the "the right to wander freely and anonymously, if we so choose, is a fundamental right of privacy in a democratic society."

Read more...

Emphasis added:
Dove had been sent by dispatchers to a site where someone saw a man striking a girl inside a truck. When the officer arrived, he saw Hiibel standing outside a truck. He said he thought Hiibel was intoxicated and his daughter was sitting in his truck.
[...]

[Justice Cliff] Young and Justices Myron Leavitt and Nancy Becker said the "intrusion on privacy" made by police seeking identification is "outweighed by the benefits to officers and community safety."

"The most dangerous time for an officer may be during an investigative stop -- when a suspect is approached and questioned," Young wrote.

What the heck is an "investigative stop?" It certainly wasn't a traffic stop, as Hiibel was already standing outside a stopped truck.
That the police can demand identification of drivers is an exception to the rule -- pedestrians do not have to produce identification on demand (that is, until this Nevada Supreme Court ruling). But thanks to automobile-oriented development, nearly everyone is a driver now and has become accustomed to producing identification for the police at the drop of a hat, and so now even a state Supreme Court has become confused.

This is a classic slippery slope in action. First an exception is made (identification necessary only for motor vehicle operators), and then the exception becomes pervasive (everyone is forced to drive everywhere), and finally the pervasive becomes the rule.


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zoobie555
Wackadoo


Conroe, Texas, USA
141 posts, Jan 2003

posted 01-05-2003 12:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for zoobie555   Email zoobie555     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The way I see it. You have Democrats (communists) and Republicans (facists). Naturally sworn enemies that have come to work together in the most bizarre of alliances against the common man which they seek to oppress (the enemy of my enemy...). This global version of "good cop, bad cop" pits us against each other in a monumental state of universal confusion and exhaustion. When one side manages to pass a law that benifits that particular agenda despite the having to battle the opposition, that law remains in effect indefinately and likewise for the other side such that one by one our constitutional rights are nibbled away bit by bit. The wealthy and even middle class are distracted and further exhausted by the pursuit of material possesions, while the poorest of the common folk are too busy securing the basic human necessities to involve themselves with the monumental task of changing the world around them. The technological advancements that are supposed to simplify our lives have only complicated them significantly further exhausting our individual resources and taking up our time, exaserbated by the blitz of advertising that keeps us in a perpetual game of "keeping up with the Jones's". Add to the growing list: chemtrails, mysterious illnesses, threat of global terrorism, possibility of alien invasion, government cover-ups etc. The gap between the two dark forces that is our civil liberties begins to narrow more rapidly. What happens when these opposite sides have acheived their goal of removing our rights entirely, dissarming us, spying on our every move, documenting our every breath, reading our thoughts and controlling our every action? Do they then turn their focus on each other?

Amazing what a little bit of paranoia and sleep deprivation will do to a person...

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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-05-2003 12:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
PHONY AWARDS ISSUED TO FBI,SEN. CHARLES GRASSLEY OUTRAGED............


Washington Times 12/20/02: Jerry Seper

Original Link: http://www.washtimes.com/national/20021220-4292664.htm

A senior member of the Senate Judiciary Committee yesterday described as a "slap in the face" an FBI decision to give an award to a senior FBI official who refused requests by agents in Minneapolis for a warrant to search the computer of terror suspect Zacarias Moussaoui.

"This award is a slap in the face to the all the FBI agents who tried to investigate suspected terrorists but were shut down by bureaucrats at headquarters," said Sen. Charles E. Grassley, Iowa Republican. "The FBI has to end the pattern of rewarding mistakes and wrongdoing.

"Unfortunately, this award continues a bad tradition," he said. "If the FBI is ever to reform, there must be accountability."

Mr. Grassley said he intends to include in a pending FBI oversight investigation a decision by FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III to include Marion "Spike" Bowman, head of the FBI's national security law unit, among the nine recipients named for the bureau's "exceptional performance" award.

The Iowa Republican said the inquiry, to begin after Congress returns in January, also will focus on FBI mistakes before the September 11 terrorist attacks. Moussaoui has been identified as a co-conspirator in the suicide strikes that killed more than 3,000 people.

FBI agents in Minneapolis, advised that Moussaoui was seeking flight lessons, had sought a secret Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (FISA) warrant to search his computer, but FBI officials in Washington refused, saying there was insufficient probable cause.

The agents had gathered information, including intelligence from officials overseas, that Moussaoui was tied to terrorism suspects. The 33-year-old French Moroccan was detained a month before the September 11 attacks after officials at a Minneapolis-area flight school called authorities when he offered to pay cash to learn how to fly a Boeing jetliner.

A senior FBI agent in Minneapolis later complained in a letter to Mr. Mueller that bureau executives in Washington had blocked the Moussaoui investigation because they did not understand the significance of his arrest.

Agent Coleen Rowley, chief principal legal assistant, said Minneapolis agents faced a "roadblock" when they sought the Moussaoui search warrant, and that the agents became so frustrated at the lack of response they sought to bypass the chain of command and notify the CIA directly — but were reprimanded.

Mrs. Rowley said the agents, although "closest to the action and in the best position to gauge the situation locally," were not allowed to proceed, despite an earlier FBI alert about terrorists seeking flight training in Arizona.

Mr. Mueller told reporters that lawyers at FBI headquarters found insufficient probable cause and denied the request. He has since referred the matter to the Justice Department's Office of Inspector General for review.

Moussaoui was indicted in December by a federal grand jury in Alexandria on six counts of conspiracy. Four of the counts could result in the death penalty.

The award was given to Mr. Bowman during a ceremony Dec. 4 in Des Moines, Iowa, which recognized "exceptional performance" by nine senior managers. In a statement, Mr. Mueller said those honored "are strongly linked to our counterterrorism efforts," citing investigations into the bombings of the Khobar Towers in Saudi Arabia, two U.S. embassies in Africa and the USS Cole, the arrest of an Algerian in a millennium plot aimed at Los Angeles International Airport and the September 11 attacks.

The awards, first reported by the Minneapolis Star Tribune, include cash bonuses of between 20 percent or 35 percent of each recipient's base salary and a framed certificate signed by the president.

A week after the awards ceremony, a joint House and Senate intelligence committee criticized "massive failures" by federal law enforcement agencies, including the FBI, in the weeks before the September 11 attacks, saying they might have been prevented if investigative leads had been properly assembled in time.

The report said key information developed through intelligence sources might have led to the identification of the September 11 hijackers — who could have been arrested or detained before the attacks.

"No one will ever know what might have happened had more connections been drawn between these disparate pieces of information," the report said.

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FLKook
Chemspiracy Realist


East Central Florida
1592 posts, Apr 2001

posted 01-06-2003 11:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for FLKook     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just a little bump for this thread to remind everyone not to get distracted from the big picture. I am not on a one woman crusade to promote Alex Jones...just his ideas.

Our beloved constitution that police, military, and government officials are sworn to defend from enemies both foreign and domestic is in tatters. Where is the outrage! Chemtrails for me has become a secondary issue, look at the whole picture here...

Click the link for the whole article. This is no joke.


Police State Propaganda Placement
http://www.prisonplanet.com/jones_report_010603_product.html

Five years ago I would talk about a New World Order, a global government, an international criminal court, a world taxation system, a pan-American union. About half the callers to my radio show didn’t believe me and said that I was making it all up. Now we don’t get those callers and my show is conservatively a hundred times larger. Along with a massive expansion of affiliates that cover 35 states, I also have one of the biggest Internet listening audiences out there.

Now that the show has grown, you don’t hear people calling in and saying ‘the UN isn’t going to take over’ or ‘there is no international criminal court’ or ‘there is no plan to destroy America from within’. I got on the air with the documents year after year along with many other great broadcasters and writers and told people what was going to happen. Now they’ve seen it happen on the nightly news, albeit with the Globalist spin on it saying it’s all a good idea and we should just accept it. People still aren’t taking enough action against the agenda because they feel as though they don’t have any power.

Believe me, you do have power. This global plantation will not succeed unless you forget your responsibility and don’t get involved.

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FLKook
Chemspiracy Realist


East Central Florida
1592 posts, Apr 2001

posted 01-06-2003 12:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FLKook     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Last June, from the floor of the House of Representatives... http://www.house.gov/paul/congrec/congrec2002/cr062702.htm


Congressman Ron Paul
U.S. House of Representatives
June 27, 2002

Is America a Police State?

Mr. Speaker:

Most Americans believe we live in dangerous times, and I must agree. Today I want to talk about how I see those dangers and what Congress ought to do about them.

Of course, the Monday-morning quarterbacks are now explaining, with political overtones, what we should have done to prevent the 9/11 tragedy. Unfortunately, in doing so, foreign policy changes are never considered.

I have, for more than two decades, been severely critical of our post-World War II foreign policy. I have perceived it to be not in our best interest and have believed that it presented a serious danger to our security.

For the record, in January of 2000 I stated the following on this floor:

Our commercial interests and foreign policy are no longer separate...as bad as it is that average Americans are forced to subsidize such a system, we additionally are placed in greater danger because of our arrogant policy of bombing nations that do not submit to our wishes. This generates hatred directed toward America ...and exposes us to a greater threat of terrorism, since this is the only vehicle our victims can use to retaliate against a powerful military state...the cost in terms of lost liberties and unnecessary exposure to terrorism is difficult to assess, but in time, it will become apparent to all of us that foreign interventionism is of no benefit to American citizens, but instead is a threat to our liberties.

Again, let me remind you I made these statements on the House floor in January 2000. Unfortunately, my greatest fears and warnings have been borne out.

I believe my concerns are as relevant today as they were then. We should move with caution in this post-9/11 period so we do not make our problems worse overseas while further undermining our liberties at home.

So far our post-9/11 policies have challenged the rule of law here at home, and our efforts against the al Qaeda have essentially come up empty-handed. The best we can tell now, instead of being in one place, the members of the al Qaeda are scattered around the world, with more of them in allied Pakistan than in Afghanistan. Our efforts to find our enemies have put the CIA in 80 different countries. The question that we must answer some day is whether we can catch enemies faster than we make new ones. So far it appears we are losing.

As evidence mounts that we have achieved little in reducing the terrorist threat, more diversionary tactics will be used. The big one will be to blame Saddam Hussein for everything and initiate a major war against Iraq, which will only generate even more hatred toward America from the Muslim world.

But, Mr. Speaker, my subject today is whether America is a police state. I'm sure the large majority of Americans would answer this in the negative. Most would associate military patrols, martial law and summary executions with a police state, something obviously not present in our everyday activities. However, those with knowledge of Ruby Ridge, Mount Carmel and other such incidents may have a different opinion.

The principal tool for sustaining a police state, even the most militant, is always economic control and punishment by denying disobedient citizens such things as jobs or places to live, and by levying fines and imprisonment. The military is more often used in the transition phase to a totalitarian state. Maintenance for long periods is usually accomplished through economic controls on commercial transactions, the use of all property, and political dissent. Peaceful control through these efforts can be achieved without storm troopers on our street corners.

Terror and fear are used to achieve complacency and obedience, especially when citizens are deluded into believing they are still a free people. The changes, they are assured, will be minimal, short-lived, and necessary, such as those that occur in times of a declared war. Under these conditions, most citizens believe that once the war is won, the restrictions on their liberties will be reversed. For the most part, however, after a declared war is over, the return to normalcy is never complete. In an undeclared war, without a precise enemy and therefore no precise ending, returning to normalcy can prove illusory.

We have just concluded a century of wars, declared and undeclared, while at the same time responding to public outcries for more economic equity. The question, as a result of these policies, is: "Are we already living in a police state?" If we are, what are we going to do about it? If we are not, we need to know if there's any danger that we're moving in that direction.

Most police states, surprisingly, come about through the democratic process with majority support. During a crisis, the rights of individuals and the minority are more easily trampled, which is more likely to condition a nation to become a police state than a military coup. Promised benefits initially seem to exceed the cost in dollars or lost freedom. When people face terrorism or great fear- from whatever source- the tendency to demand economic and physical security over liberty and self-reliance proves irresistible. The masses are easily led to believe that security and liberty are mutually exclusive, and demand for security far exceeds that for liberty.

Once it's discovered that the desire for both economic and physical security that prompted the sacrifice of liberty inevitably led to the loss of prosperity and no real safety, it's too late. Reversing the trend from authoritarian rule toward a freer society becomes very difficult, takes a long time, and entails much suffering. Although dissolution of the Soviet empire was relatively non-violent at the end, millions suffered from police suppression and economic deprivation in the decades prior to 1989.

But what about here in the United States? With respect to a police state, where are we and where are we going?

Let me make a few observations:

Our government already keeps close tabs on just about everything we do and requires official permission for nearly all of our activities.

One might take a look at our Capitol for any evidence of a police state. We see: barricades, metal detectors, police, military soldiers at times, dogs, ID badges required for every move, vehicles checked at airports and throughout the Capitol. The people are totally disarmed, except for the police and the criminals. But worse yet, surveillance cameras in Washington are everywhere to ensure our safety.

The terrorist attacks only provided the cover for the do-gooders who have been planning for a long time before last September to monitor us "for our own good." Cameras are used to spy on our drug habits, on our kids at school, on subway travelers, and on visitors to every government building or park. There's not much evidence of an open society in Washington, DC, yet most folks do not complain- anything goes if it's for government-provided safety and security.

If this huge amount of information and technology is placed in the hands of the government to catch the bad guys, one naturally asks, What's the big deal? But it should be a big deal, because it eliminates the enjoyment of privacy that a free society holds dear. The personal information of law-abiding citizens can be used for reasons other than safety- including political reasons. Like gun control, people control hurts law-abiding citizens much more than the law-breakers.

Social Security numbers are used to monitor our daily activities. The numbers are given at birth, and then are needed when we die and for everything in between. This allows government record keeping of monstrous proportions, and accommodates the thugs who would steal others' identities for criminal purposes. This invasion of privacy has been compounded by the technology now available to those in government who enjoy monitoring and directing the activities of others. Loss of personal privacy was a major problem long before 9/11.

Centralized control and regulations are required in a police state. Community and individual state regulations are not as threatening as the monolith of rules and regulations written by Congress and the federal bureaucracy. Law and order has been federalized in many ways and we are moving inexorably in that direction.

Almost all of our economic activities depend upon receiving the proper permits from the federal government. Transactions involving guns, food, medicine, smoking, drinking, hiring, firing, wages, politically correct speech, land use, fishing, hunting, buying a house, business mergers and acquisitions, selling stocks and bonds, and farming all require approval and strict regulation from our federal government. If this is not done properly and in a timely fashion, economic penalties and even imprisonment are likely consequences.

Because government pays for much of our health care, it's conveniently argued that any habits or risk-taking that could harm one's health are the prerogative of the federal government, and are to be regulated by explicit rules to keep medical-care costs down. This same argument is used to require helmets for riding motorcycles and bikes.

Not only do we need a license to drive, but we also need special belts, bags, buzzers, seats and environmentally dictated speed limits- or a policemen will be pulling us over to levy a fine, and he will be toting a gun for sure.

The states do exactly as they're told by the federal government, because they are threatened with the loss of tax dollars being returned to their state- dollars that should have never been sent to DC in the first place, let alone used to extort obedience to a powerful federal government.

Over 80,000 federal bureaucrats now carry guns to make us toe the line and to enforce the thousands of laws and tens of thousands of regulations that no one can possibly understand. We don't see the guns, but we all know they're there, and we all know we can't fight "City Hall," especially if it's "Uncle Sam."

All 18-year-old males must register to be ready for the next undeclared war. If they don't, men with guns will appear and enforce this congressional mandate. "Involuntary servitude" was banned by the 13th Amendment, but courts don't apply this prohibition to the servitude of draftees or those citizens required to follow the dictates of the IRS- especially the employers of the country, who serve as the federal government's chief tax collectors and information gatherers. Fear is the tool used to intimidate most Americans to comply to the tax code by making examples of celebrities. Leona Helmsley and Willie Nelson know how this process works.

Economic threats against business establishments are notorious. Rules and regulations from the EPA, the ADA, the SEC, the LRB, OSHA, etc. terrorize business owners into submission, and those charged accept their own guilt until they can prove themselves innocent. Of course, it turns out it's much more practical to admit guilt and pay the fine. This serves the interest of the authoritarians because it firmly establishes just who is in charge.

Information leaked from a government agency like the FDA can make or break a company within minutes. If information is leaked, even inadvertently, a company can be destroyed, and individuals involved in revealing government-monopolized information can be sent to prison. Even though economic crimes are serious offenses in the United States, violent crimes sometimes evoke more sympathy and fewer penalties. Just look at the O.J. Simpson case as an example.

Efforts to convict Bill Gates and others like him of an economic crime are astounding, considering his contribution to economic progress, while sources used to screen out terrorist elements from our midst are tragically useless. If business people are found guilty of even the suggestion of collusion in the marketplace, huge fines and even imprisonment are likely consequences.

Price fixing is impossible to achieve in a free market. Under today's laws, talking to, or consulting with, competitors can be easily construed as "price fixing" and involve a serious crime, even with proof that the so-called collusion never generated monopoly-controlled prices or was detrimental to consumers.

Lawfully circumventing taxes, even sales taxes, can lead to serious problems if a high-profile person can be made an example.

One of the most onerous controls placed on American citizens is the control of speech through politically correct legislation. Derogatory remarks or off-color jokes are justification for firings, demotions, and the destruction of political careers. The movement toward designating penalties based on the category to which victims belong, rather the nature of the crime itself, has the thought police patrolling the airways and byways. Establishing relative rights and special penalties for subjective motivation is a dangerous trend.

All our financial activities are subject to "legal" searches without warrants and without probable cause. Tax collection, drug usage, and possible terrorist activities "justify" the endless accumulation of information on all Americans.

Government control of medicine has prompted the establishment of the National Medical Data Bank. For efficiency reasons, it is said, the government keeps our medical records for our benefit. This, of course, is done with vague and useless promises that this information will always remain confidential- just like all the FBI information in the past!

Personal privacy, the sine qua non of liberty, no longer exists in the United States. Ruthless and abusive use of all this information accumulated by the government is yet to come. The Patriot Act has given unbelievable power to listen, read, and monitor all our transactions without a search warrant being issued after affirmation of probably cause. "Sneak and peak" and blanket searches are now becoming more frequent every day. What have we allowed to happen to the 4th amendment?

It may be true that the average American does not feel intimidated by the encroachment of the police state. I'm sure our citizens are more tolerant of what they see as mere nuisances because they have been deluded into believing all this government supervision is necessary and helpful- and besides they are living quite comfortably, material wise. However the reaction will be different once all this new legislation we're passing comes into full force, and the material comforts that soften our concerns for government regulations are decreased. This attitude then will change dramatically, but the trend toward the authoritarian state will be difficult to reverse.

What government gives with one hand- as it attempts to provide safety and security- it must, at the same time, take away with two others. When the majority recognizes that the monetary cost and the results of our war against terrorism and personal freedoms are a lot less than promised, it may be too late.

I'm sure all my concerns are unconvincing to the vast majority of Americans, who not only are seeking but also are demanding they be made safe from any possible attack from anybody, ever. I grant you this is a reasonable request.

The point is, however, there may be a much better way of doing it. We must remember, we don't sit around and worry that some Canadian citizen is about to walk into New York City and set off a nuclear weapon. We must come to understand the real reason is that there's a difference between the Canadians and all our many friends and the Islamic radicals. And believe me, we're not the target because we're "free and prosperous".

The argument made for more government controls here at home and expansionism overseas to combat terrorism is simple and goes like this: "If we're not made safe from potential terrorists, property and freedom have no meaning." It is argued that first we must have life and physical and economic security, with continued abundance, then we'll talk about freedom.

It reminds me of the time I was soliciting political support from a voter and was boldly put down: "Ron," she said, "I wish you would lay off this freedom stuff; it's all nonsense. We're looking for a Representative who will know how to bring home the bacon and help our area, and you're not that person." Believe me, I understand that argument; it's just that I don't agree that is what should be motivating us here in the Congress.

That's not the way it works. Freedom does not preclude security. Making security the highest priority can deny prosperity and still fail to provide the safety we all want.

The Congress would never agree that we are a police state. Most members, I'm sure, would argue otherwise. But we are all obligated to decide in which direction we are going. If we're moving toward a system that enhances individual liberty and justice for all, my concerns about a police state should be reduced or totally ignored. Yet, if, by chance, we're moving toward more authoritarian control than is good for us, and moving toward a major war of which we should have no part, we should not ignore the dangers. If current policies are permitting a serious challenge to our institutions that allow for our great abundance, we ignore them at great risk for future generations.

That's why the post-9/11 analysis and subsequent legislation are crucial to the survival of those institutions that made America great. We now are considering a major legislative proposal dealing with this dilemma- the new Department of Homeland Security- and we must decide if it truly serves the interests of America.

Since the new department is now a forgone conclusion, why should anyone bother to record a dissent? Because it's the responsibility of all of us to speak the truth to our best ability, and if there are reservations about what we're doing, we should sound an alarm and warn the people of what is to come.

In times of crisis, nearly unanimous support for government programs is usual and the effects are instantaneous. Discovering the error of our ways and waiting to see the unintended consequences evolve takes time and careful analysis. Reversing the bad effects is slow and tedious and fraught with danger. People would much prefer to hear platitudes than the pessimism of a flawed policy.

Understanding the real reason why we were attacked is crucial to crafting a proper response. I know of no one who does not condemn the attacks of 9/11. Disagreement as to the cause and the proper course of action should be legitimate in a free society such as ours. If not, we're not a free society.

Not only do I condemn the vicious acts of 9/11, but also, out of deep philosophic and moral commitment, I have pledged never to use any form of aggression to bring about social or economic changes.

But I am deeply concerned about what has been done and what we are yet to do in the name of security against the threat of terrorism.

Political propagandizing is used to get all of us to toe the line and be good "patriots," supporting every measure suggested by the administration. We are told that preemptive strikes, torture, military tribunals, suspension of habeas corpus, executive orders to wage war, and sacrificing privacy with a weakened 4th Amendment are the minimum required to save our country from the threat of terrorism.

Who's winning this war anyway?

To get popular support for these serious violations of our traditional rule of law requires that people be kept in a state of fear. The episode of spreading undue concern about the possibility of a dirty bomb being exploded in Washington without any substantiation of an actual threat is a good example of excessive fear being generated by government officials.

To add insult to injury, when he made this outlandish announcement, our Attorney General was in Moscow. Maybe if our FBI spent more time at home, we would get more for the money we pump into this now- discredited organization. Our FBI should be gathering information here at home, and the thousands of agents overseas should return. We don't need these agents competing overseas and confusing the intelligence apparatus of the CIA or the military.

I'm concerned that the excess fear, created by the several hundred al Qaeda functionaries willing to sacrifice their lives for their demented goals, is driving us to do to ourselves what the al Qaeda themselves could never do to us by force.

So far the direction is clear: we are legislating bigger and more intrusive government here at home and are allowing our President to pursue much more military adventurism abroad. These pursuits are overwhelmingly supported by Members of Congress, the media, and the so-called intellectual community, and questioned only by a small number of civil libertarians and anti-imperial, anti-war advocates.

The main reason why so many usually levelheaded critics of bad policy accept this massive increase in government power is clear. They, for various reasons, believe the official explanation of "Why us?" The several hundred al Qaeda members, we were told, hate us because: "We're rich, we're free, we enjoy materialism, and the purveyors of terror are jealous and envious, creating the hatred that drives their cause. They despise our Christian-Judaic values and this, is the sole reason why they are willing to die for their cause." For this to be believed, one must also be convinced that the perpetrators lied to the world about why they attacked us.

The al Qaeda leaders say they hate us because:

-We support Western puppet regimes in Arab countries for commercial reasons and against the wishes of the populace of these countries.

-This partnership allows a military occupation, the most confrontational being in Saudi Arabia, that offends their sense of pride and violates their religious convictions by having a foreign military power on their holy land. We refuse to consider how we might feel if China's navy occupied the Gulf of Mexico for the purpose of protecting "their oil" and had air bases on U.S. territory.

-We show extreme bias in support of one side in the fifty-plus-year war going on in the Middle East.

What if the al Qaeda is telling the truth and we ignore it? If we believe only the official line from the administration and proceed to change our whole system and undermine our constitutional rights, we may one day wake up to find that the attacks have increased, the numbers of those willing to commit suicide for their cause have grown, our freedoms are diminished, and all this has contributed to making our economic problems worse. The dollar cost of this "war" could turn out to be exorbitant, and the efficiency of our markets can be undermined by the compromises placed on our liberties.

Sometimes it almost seems that our policies inadvertently are actually based on a desire to make ourselves "less free and less prosperous"- those conditions that are supposed to have prompted the attacks. I'm convinced we must pay more attention to the real cause of the attacks of last year and challenge the explanations given us.

The question that one day must be answered is this:

What if we had never placed our troops in Saudi Arabia and had involved ourselves in the Middle East war in an even-handed fashion. Would it have been worth it if this would have prevented the events of 9/11?

If we avoid the truth, we will be far less well off than if we recognize that just maybe there is some truth in the statements made by the leaders of those who perpetrated the atrocities. If they speak the truth about the real cause, changing our foreign policy from foreign military interventionism around the globe supporting an American empire would make a lot of sense. It could reduce tensions, save money, preserve liberty and preserve our economic system.

This, for me, is not a reactive position coming out of 9/11, but rather is an argument I've made for decades, claiming that meddling in the affairs of others is dangerous to our security and actually reduces our ability to defend ourselves.

This in no way precludes pursuing those directly responsible for the attacks and dealing with them accordingly- something that we seem to have not yet done. We hear more talk of starting a war in Iraq than in achieving victory against the international outlaws that instigated the attacks on 9/11. Rather than pursuing war against countries that were not directly responsible for the attacks, we should consider the judicious use of Marque and Reprisal.

I'm sure that a more enlightened approach to our foreign policy will prove elusive. Financial interests of our international corporations, oil companies, and banks, along with the military-industrial complex, are sure to remain a deciding influence on our policies.

Besides, even if my assessments prove to be true, any shift away from foreign militarism- like bringing our troops home- would now be construed as yielding to the terrorists. It just won't happen. This is a powerful point and the concern that we might appear to be capitulating is legitimate.

Yet how long should we deny the truth, especially if this denial only makes us more vulnerable? Shouldn't we demand the courage and wisdom of our leaders to do the right thing, in spite of the political shortcomings?

President Kennedy faced an even greater threat in October 1962, and from a much more powerful force. The Soviet/Cuban terrorist threat with nuclear missiles only 90 miles off our shores was wisely defused by Kennedy's capitulating and removing missiles from Turkey on the Soviet border. Kennedy deserved the praise he received for the way he handled the nuclear standoff with the Soviets. This concession most likely prevented a nuclear exchange and proved that taking a step back from a failed policy is beneficial, yet how one does so is crucial. The answer is to do it diplomatically- that's what diplomats are supposed to do.

Maybe there is no real desire to remove the excuse for our worldwide imperialism, especially our current new expansion into central Asia or the domestic violations of our civil liberties. Today's conditions may well be exactly what our world commercial interests want. It's now easy for us to go into the Philippines, Columbia, Pakistan, Afghanistan, or wherever in pursuit of terrorists. No questions are asked by the media or the politicians- only cheers. Put in these terms, who can object? We all despise the tactics of the terrorists, so the nature of the response is not to be questioned!

A growing number of Americans are concluding that the threat we now face comes more as a consequence of our foreign policy than because the bad guys envy our freedoms and prosperity. How many terrorist attacks have been directed toward Switzerland, Australia, Canada, or Sweden? They too are rich and free, and would be easy targets, but the Islamic fundamentalists see no purpose in doing so.

There's no purpose in targeting us unless there's a political agenda, which there surely is. To deny that this political agenda exists jeopardizes the security of this country. Pretending something to be true that is not is dangerous.

It's a definite benefit for so many to recognize that our $40 billion annual investment in intelligence gathering prior to 9/11 was a failure. Now a sincere desire exists to rectify these mistakes. That's good, unless, instead of changing the role for the CIA and the FBI, all the past mistakes are made worse by spending more money and enlarging the bureaucracies to do the very same thing without improving their efficiency or changing their goals. Unfortunately that is what is likely to happen.

One of the major shortcomings that led to the 9/11 tragedies was that the responsibility for protecting commercial airlines was left to the government, the FAA, the FBI, the CIA, and the INS. And they failed. A greater sense of responsibility for the owners to provide security is what was needed. Guns in the cockpit would have most likely prevented most of the deaths that occurred on that fateful day.

But what does our government do? It firmly denies airline pilots the right to defend their planes, and we federalize the security screeners and rely on F16s to shoot down airliners if they are hijacked.

Security screeners, many barely able to speak English, spend endless hours harassing pilots, confiscating dangerous mustache scissors, mauling grandmothers and children, and pestering Al Gore, while doing nothing about the influx of aliens from Middle-Eastern countries who are on designated watch lists.

We pump up the military in India and Pakistan, ignore all the warnings about Saudi Arabia, and plan a secret war against Iraq to make sure no one starts asking where Osama bin Laden is. We think we know where Saddam Hussein lives, so let's go get him instead.

Since our government bureaucracy failed, why not get rid of it instead of adding to it? If we had proper respect and understood how private property owners effectively defend themselves, we could apply those rules to the airlines and achieve something worthwhile.

If our immigration policies have failed us, when will we defy the politically correct fanatics and curtail the immigration of those individuals on the highly suspect lists? Instead of these changes, all we hear is that the major solution will come by establishing a huge new federal department- the Department of Homeland Security.

According to all the pundits, we are expected to champion this big-government approach, and if we don't jolly well like it, we will be tagged "unpatriotic." The fear that permeates our country cries out for something to be done in response to almost daily warnings of the next attack. If it's not a real attack, then it's a theoretical one; one where the bomb could well be only in the mind of a potential terrorist.

Where is all this leading us? Are we moving toward a safer and more secure society? I think not. All the discussions of these proposed plans since 9/11 have been designed to condition the American people to accept major changes in our political system. Some of the changes being made are unnecessary, and others are outright dangerous to our way of life.

There is no need for us to be forced to choose between security and freedom. Giving up freedom does not provide greater security. Preserving and better understanding freedom can. Sadly today, many are anxious to give up freedom in response to real and generated fears..

The plans for a first strike supposedly against a potential foreign government should alarm all Americans. If we do not resist this power the President is assuming, our President, through executive order, can start a war anyplace, anytime, against anyone he chooses, for any reason, without congressional approval. This is a tragic usurpation of the war power by the executive branch from the legislative branch, with Congress being all too accommodating.

Removing the power of the executive branch to wage war, as was done through our revolution and the writing of the Constitution, is now being casually sacrificed on the altar of security. In a free society, and certainly in the constitutional republic we have been given, it should never be assumed that the President alone can take it upon himself to wage war whenever he pleases.

The publicly announced plan to murder Saddam Hussein in the name of our national security draws nary a whimper from Congress. Support is overwhelming, without a thought as to its legality, morality, constitutionality, or its practicality. Murdering Saddam Hussein will surely generate many more fanatics ready to commit their lives to suicide terrorist attacks against us.

Our CIA attempt to assassinate Castro backfired with the subsequent assassination of our president. Killing Saddam Hussein, just for the sake of killing him, obviously will increase the threat against us, not diminish it. It makes no sense. But our warriors argue that someday he may build a bomb, someday he might use it, maybe against us or some yet-unknown target. This policy further radicalizes the Islamic fundamentalists against us, because from their viewpoint, our policy is driven by Israeli, not U.S. security interests.

Planned assassination, a preemptive strike policy without proof of any threat, and a vague definition of terrorism may work for us as long as we're king of the hill, but one must assume every other nation will naturally use our definition of policy as justification for dealing with their neighbors. India can justify a first strike against Pakistan, China against India or Taiwan, as well as many other such examples. This new policy, if carried through, will make the world much less safe.

This new doctrine is based on proving a negative, which is impossible to do, especially when we're dealing with a subjective interpretation of plans buried in someone's head. To those who suggest a more restrained approach on Iraq and killing Saddam Hussein, the war hawks retort, saying: "Prove to me that Saddam Hussein might not do something someday directly harmful to the United States." Since no one can prove this, the warmongers shout: "Let's march on Baghdad."

We all can agree that aggression should be met with force and that providing national security is an ominous responsibility that falls on Congress' shoulders. But avoiding useless and unjustifiable wars that threaten our whole system of government and security seems to be the more prudent thing to do.

Since September 11th, Congress has responded with a massive barrage of legislation not seen since Roosevelt took over in 1933. Where Roosevelt dealt with trying to provide economic security, today's legislation deals with personal security from any and all imaginable threats, at any cost- dollar or freedom-wise. These efforts include:

-The Patriot Act, which undermines the 4th Amendment with the establishment of an overly broad and dangerous definition of terrorism.

- The Financial Anti-Terrorism Act, which expands the government's surveillance of the financial transactions of all American citizens through increased power to FinCen and puts back on track the plans to impose "Know Your Customer" rules on all Americans, which had been sought after for years.

-The airline bailout bill gave $15 billion, rushed through shortly after 9/11.

- The federalization of all airline security employees.

-Military tribunals set up by executive order-undermining the rights of those accused- rights established as far back in history as 1215.

- Unlimited retention of suspects without charges being made, even when a crime has not been committed- a serious precedent that one day may well be abused.

- Relaxation of FBI surveillance guidelines of all political activity.

- Essentially monopolizing vaccines and treatment for infectious diseases, permitting massive quarantines and mandates for vaccinations.

Almost all significant legislation since 9/11 has been rushed through in a tone of urgency with reference to the tragedy, including the $190 billion farm bill as well as fast track.

Guarantees to all insurance companies now are moving quickly through the Congress.
Increasing the billions already flowing into foreign aid is now being planned as our interventions overseas continue to grow and expand.

There's no reason to believe that the massive increase in spending, both domestic and foreign, along with the massive expansion of the size of the federal government, will slow any time soon. The deficit is exploding as the economy weakens. When the government sector drains the resources needed for capital expansion, it contributes to the loss of confidence needed for growth.

Even without evidence that any good has come from this massive expansion of government power, Congress is in the process of establishing a huge new bureaucracy, the Department of Homeland Security, hoping miraculously through centralization to make all these efforts productive and worthwhile.

There is no evidence, however, that government bureaucracy and huge funding can solve our nation's problems. The likelihood is that the unintended consequences of this new proposal will diminish our freedoms and do nothing to enhance our security.

Opposing currently proposed and recently passed legislation does not mean one is complacent about terrorism or homeland security. The truth is that there are alternative solutions to these problems we face, without resorting to expanding the size and scope of government at the expense of liberty.

As tempting as it may seem, a government is incapable of preventing crimes. On occasion, with luck it might succeed. But the failure to tip us off about 9/11, after spending $40 billion annually on intelligence gathering, should have surprised no one. Governments, by nature, are very inefficient institutions. We must accept this as fact.

I'm sure that our intelligence agencies had the information available to head off 9/11, but bureaucratic blundering and turf wars prevented the information from being useful. But, the basic principle is wrong. City policeman can't and should not be expected to try to preempt crimes. That would invite massive intrusions into the everyday activities of every law-abiding citizen.

But that's exactly what our recent legislation is doing. It's a wrong-headed goal, no matter how wonderful it may sound. The policemen in the inner cities patrol their beats, but crime is still rampant. In the rural areas of America, literally millions of our citizens are safe and secure in their homes, though miles from any police protection. They are safe because even the advantage of isolation doesn't entice the burglar to rob a house when he knows a shotgun sits inside the door waiting to be used. But this is a right denied many of our citizens living in the inner cities.

The whole idea of government preventing crime is dangerous. To prevent crimes in our homes or businesses, government would need cameras to spy on our every move; to check for illegal drug use, wife beating, child abuse, or tax evasion. They would need cameras, not only on our streets and in our homes, but our phones, internet, and travels would need to be constantly monitored- just to make sure we are not a terrorist, drug dealer, or tax evader.

This is the assumption now used at our airports, rather than allowing privately owned airlines to profile their passengers to assure the safety for which the airline owners ought to assume responsibility. But, of course, this would mean guns in the cockpit. I am certain that this approach to safety and security would be far superior to the rules that existed prior to 9/11 and now have been made much worse in the past nine months.

This method of providing security emphasizes private-property ownership and responsibility of the owners to protect that property. But the right to bear arms must also be included. The fact that the administration is opposed to guns in the cockpit and the fact that the airline owners are more interested in bailouts and insurance protection mean that we're just digging a bigger hole for ourselves- ignoring liberty and expecting the government to provide something it's not capable of doing.

Because of this, in combination with a foreign policy that generates more hatred toward us and multiplies the number of terrorists that seek vengeance, I am deeply concerned that Washington's efforts so far sadly have only made us more vulnerable. I'm convinced that the newly proposed Department of Homeland Security will do nothing to make us more secure, but it will make us all a lot poorer and less free. If the trend continues, the Department of Homeland Security may well be the vehicle used for a much more ruthless control of the people by some future administration than any of us dreams. Let's pray that this concern will never materialize.

America is not now a ruthless authoritarian police state. But our concerns ought to be whether we have laid the foundation of a more docile police state. The love of liberty has been so diminished that we tolerate intrusions into our privacies today that would have been abhorred just a few years ago. Tolerance of inconvenience to our liberties is not uncommon when both personal and economic fear persists. The sacrifices being made to our liberties will surely usher in a system of government that will please only those who enjoy being in charge of running other people's lives.

Mr. Speaker, what, then, is the answer to the question: "Is America a Police State?" My answer is: "Maybe not yet, but it is fast approaching." The seeds have been sown and many of our basic protections against tyranny have been and are constantly being undermined. The post-9/11 atmosphere here in Congress has provided ample excuse to concentrate on safety at the expense of liberty, failing to recognize that we cannot have one without the other.

When the government keeps detailed records on every move we make and we either need advance permission for everything we do or are penalized for not knowing what the rules are, America will be declared a police state. Personal privacy for law-abiding citizens will be a thing of the past. Enforcement of laws against economic and political crimes will exceed that of violent crimes (just look at what's coming under the new FEC law). War will be the prerogative of the administration. Civil liberties will be suspended for suspects, and their prosecution will not be carried out by an independent judiciary. In a police state, this becomes common practice rather than a rare incident.

Some argue that we already live in a police state, and Congress doesn't have the foggiest notion of what they're dealing with. So forget it and use your energy for your own survival. Some advise that the momentum towards the monolithic state cannot be reversed. Possibly that's true, but I'm optimistic that if we do the right thing and do not capitulate to popular fancy and the incessant war propaganda, the onslaught of statism can be reversed.

To do so, we as a people will once again have to dedicate ourselves to establishing the proper role a government plays in a free society. That does not involve the redistribution of wealth through force. It does not mean that government dictates the moral and religious standards of the people. It does not allow us to police the world by involving ourselves in every conflict as if it's our responsibility to manage a world American empire.

But it does mean government has a proper role in guaranteeing free markets, protecting voluntary and religious choices and guaranteeing private property ownership, while punishing those who violate these rules- whether foreign or domestic.

In a free society, the government's job is simply to protect liberty- the people do the rest. Let's not give up on a grand experiment that has provided so much for so many. Let's reject the police state.


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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-07-2003 09:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
HIGH SCHOOL STUDENTS AND TEACHERS TARGETED BY POLICE FOR FREE SPEECH....

DENVER POST


Cop says citizens' worries unfounded
By Amy Herdy
Denver Post Staff Writer

Monday, January 06, 2003 - A high school teacher by trade, Mark Sass decided to express his beliefs by acting in a play about police accountability.

His efforts afforded him a page in a Denver Police Department intelligence file.

"The following license plate numbers of individuals that appeared to be in charge of props and other equipment for the event were recorded," wrote intelligence detectives of the Oct. 22, 1998, demonstration. "The event was peaceful, no disturbances or arrests."

Realizing that police ran the tag to his car because he exercised his right to free speech unsettles Sass and tempts him to impart his real-life lessons to his American Government students.

He refrains, he said, because he does not want to add to his students' cynicism, nor does he want to be accused of pushing his political views on them.

"I can talk about the 'Red Scare' and McCarthyism, and they just shrug their shoulders and say, 'That was back in the day,"' said Sass, 44, who teaches at Legacy High School in Broomfield.

What he wants to say: "But it's going on now."

Others share his frustration and indignation. Sass is one of at least 3,200 individuals and 208 groups listed in the Denver police "spy files," a compilation of intelligence files that date to the unit's inception in the 1950s.

Many of those who discovered they have a spy file, such as Sass, do not consider themselves to be high-profile protesters, nor do they have a criminal history. Instead, they say, they are simply people following their social conscience.

"I'm not sure I even consider myself to be an activist," said Glenn Helkenn, 32, a case manager for a homeless-assistance coalition whose name and address are listed in a spy file from the time he was a volunteer at a Catholic community house.

"It's kind of strange," Helkenn said, "because I thought police were not supposed to keep files on a person unless they're under investigation for a crime."

There are those at the Police Department who believe the entire situation has been blown out of proportion.

"I believe it's much ado about nothing," said Detective Dave Neil, a 28-year veteran and head of the Police Protective Association.

"I understand that people hate being labeled, but it's nothing more than intelligence," Neil said. "It couldn't be used against anyone, couldn't be used at trial. You could probably get more information at the Department of Motor Vehicles than what's in our files."

The existence of the files was revealed in March when the American Civil Liberties Union received two pages of paperwork that Denver shared with Golden police about possible suspects in a criminal case there.

The ACLU then filed suit on behalf of six plaintiffs, challenging Denver's custom of spying on peaceful protesters, maintaining the files and sharing the files with other law enforcement agencies.

So far, the criteria the officers used in gathering their intelligence information remains in question. Depositions taken in the lawsuit and recently viewed by The Denver Post show a sloppily run intelligence unit where officers received no training and did not follow any type of protocol.

A panel hired by the city could find no criminal connection to any information in the computer files it viewed and recommended they be destroyed.

Then an additional stockpile of hard-copy files was found at the Police Department, and public outcry ensued. Instead of destroying them, the city began to distribute copies of the files to those named in them.

Denver resident Leona Cohen discovered she was one of those people.

Cohen, 38, is a project coordinator for a downtown business and a newlywed who is expecting her first child at the end of the month.

"I squeeze in activism whenever I can," Cohen said.

Her file, which consists of more than a dozen pages, mostly refers to her time with the Direct Action Network in Denver, a now-defunct Denver social justice group.

"I went to a handful of meetings and events," she said. "I don't even remember them."

That she is listed in a spy file angers her.

"They create this culture of fear and intimidation," Cohen said of the Denver police. "It really makes me mad they are perpetuating it. I don't want to live my life in fear. ... They act so sneaky and take information on people who are peacefully demonstrating - that's not a democracy."

Neil said the intelligence unit's presence at events serves an important purpose.

"They want us to monitor these demonstration groups," he said of city officials. "Obviously, there are people on both sides, and they both deserve protection. This way we know, hopefully going in, which people may disrupt the event."

The events of Sept. 11, 2001, show that "intelligence is not a bad thing," Neil said. "Lack of intelligence is. My recommendation is to worry more about your credit history than what is in any 'spy files' you may have."

All the negative publicity has unfairly hurt the credibility of the department, he said.

"At this time, I can't imagine any outside agency willing to share information with us," he said. "They don't need the heat."

That reasoning is contrary to the beliefs of Jim Schwartzkopff, the subject of a spy file and a member of CopWatch, a police accountability group.

"The powers that be are using the opportunity to scare people about terrorism to take over their rights," said Schwartzkopff, 53, a Denver freelance consultant.

"When the police are not accountable to the people they work for, you're living in an occupied city."

His one-page file consists of a mention that he attended an Amnesty International rally at Civic Center.

"It doesn't reflect my best work," said Schwartzkopff, who figures he has attended about a dozen events concerning police accountability over the years.

"Either they aren't keeping track or they aren't releasing everything they know," he said.

As far as his reaction to having a file, he said: "I think I'm slightly afraid. The police intimidate people."

Sass, who is married and the father of two preschool-age children, shares that fear.

"Is it worth it for me to come under that scrutiny?" he said of his activism.

He worries, he said, that police will pull over his wife while she is driving his car, question and harass her, perhaps with their children present.

"I worry how it will it affect my family," Sass said of his work to promote social change. "Yet I'm doing it for my kids."

[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 01-07-2003]

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FLKook
Chemspiracy Realist


East Central Florida
1592 posts, Apr 2001

posted 01-07-2003 01:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FLKook     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I AM SO SICK OF IT!!!
That did it...I intervened (rip from a combo of U2 and Henry Rollins).

Anyone here at CT Central that would like a free copy of Alex Jones' Road to Tryanny or Masters of Terror . Contact me at FLKook@aol.com. I will send it to you. Yeah, I'm going to put my money where my keyboard is.

It will be sent to you FOR FREE with your word that after investigating the information if you agree with the material presented that you will make copies and pass it on.

Hey now, some of you debunkers, pilots or any other military or civil servants step up to the plate. There are officers and sheriffs that have gone before you, don't be intimidated in to silence.

You can laugh at our belief in chemtrails because there is no insider (military or government) whistleblowers or documentation as of yet. But let's see you debunk this!

Why is it we don't see much of you folks on the other trails forum? Get the big picture will you?

Look, I know most of you are good people and love this country. I love this country! Many of you know, I'm ex-mil and come from a mil family. Take your heads out of the sand and face up to what our federal government is involved in. As a conservative that fought liberal propaganda and ideas for years I now understand it isn't about that! They are different sides of the same globalist coin. Dump the labels and uphold the constitution.

Loving this country and the principles it was founded on and blindly following the feds are two different things! There are generals, admirals and colonels that are speaking out and standing up for truth, justice and our constitution as they swore to do in spite of their careers and consequences they'll suffer...some to their death! What about honoring them? Remember The Maine, The Liberty, The Cole, Gulf of Tonkin and all those that served in those bogus attacks. What about honoring them? Get the book Body of Secrets: Anatomy of the Ultra-Secret National Security Agency http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0385499086/qid=1041967038/sr=2-1/ ref=sr_2_1/103-6470807-5514205

What about looking for yourselves into declassified documents and local media not spoon fed through the nationally controlled machine.

Please. If you can prove that any of the information in these videos is false I'd love to here it! I'd love to be wrong about the globalist elite and the loss of sovereignty of our nation. The simple fact is it just isn't so and we all have a responsibility to live up to that, especially those of us that took an oath to defend the constitution. When you retire or your tour ends do you no longer believe that oath?...I didn't think so.

Personally, my belief is that there are more good American's out there than those that would usurp our country and our way of life. Most like I was are just uninformed.

Email me, or get the facts from http://www.infowars.com

edited for crappy typing


[Edited 3 times, lastly by FLKook on 01-07-2003]

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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-07-2003 02:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
WHITE HOUSE GLOBALIST NWO STOOGES SCAPEGOAT FBI FOR STAGED "TERROR ALERTS".


Sources Say Informant Made Up Story of Men Who Slipped Into U.S.

ABC News 01/07/03

Original Link: http://abcnews.go.com/sections/us/DailyNews/alert_hoax030106.html

The FBI has concluded the information that led to a nationwide hunt for five men suspected of infiltrating the United States on Christmas Eve was fabricated by the informant, sources told ABCNEWS.

The informant, identified as Michael Hamdani, who was arrested in Canada in late October 2002, created the story about 19 men who were seeking false passports in an attempt to get himself off the hook on criminal charges he was facing in the United States, sources said.

Based on Hamdani's information, the FBI issued an alert that launched an all-out effort by law enforcement officials, who feared terrorists might be seeking to attack Americans during New Year's celebrations.

The FBI posted pictures of five of the men on its Web site, prompting calls and sightings of the men from around the country. One of the men later turned up in Pakistan, and said he had no idea how the FBI got his picture.

According to the story investigators originally got, the men entered the United States from Canada using phony British passports forged by a Pakistani smuggling ring.

The FBI discovered that the information about the infiltrators was a hoax during an interrogation of one of the members of the document ring in Pakistan, sources said.

Alert Sparked Lockdown

The alert was part of information that led officials to shut down New York's harbor to all ships except emergency vessels from New Year's Eve through New Year's Day, and to ban vehicles from roads alongside the harbor.

Investigators also raided six locations in Brooklyn and Queens on Dec. 30 as part of an ongoing investigation into the ring. The FBI had released pictures of five men, and President Bush authorized an all-points bulletin to find them.

"We need to know why they have been smuggled into the country and what they're doing in the country," Bush told reporters at the time.

The FBI had warned that the names and ages of the men could be fictitious. They were identified as Abid Noraiz Ali, 25; Mustafa Khan Owasi, 33; Iftikhar Khozmai Ali, 21; Adil Pervez, 19 and Akbar Jamal, 28.

The man pictured as Owasi later came forward in Pakistan and said he had once tried to get a fake passport, but had been caught and remained in his country. His real name was Mohammed Asghar.

The informant, Hamdani, 44, was already facing fraud charges in Canada, after an October raid near Toronto uncovered hundreds of fake passports, immigration documents, and counterfeit traveler's checks for hundreds of thousands of dollars.

There are outstanding fraud warrants for Hamdani from the FBI in New York and the Royal Canadian Mounted Police. It was unclear whether he would face any additional charges.


CAUGHT LYING RED-HANDED!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Edited 2 times, lastly by Mech on 01-07-2003]

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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-08-2003 12:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
AMERICA IS THE NEW SOVIET UNION.....

MAY I SEE YOUR PAPERS PLEASE!

POLICE STATE IN PROGRESS
BUT WE WILL GET USED IT IT, RIGHT?
http://etherzone.com/2003/sees010703.shtml

By: Dorothy Anne Seese

What happened to the James Smoak family of North Carolina, as they were driving home from a vacation in Tennessee, is only one of many horror stories of encounters by American citizens with police. Our police and highway patrol officers now act as if they had been trained at the School of the Americas or by a leftover unit of Gestapo officers.

Although no crime had been committed, the Smoak family has returned home traumatized, one of their pet dogs was shot dead by a Tennessee Highway Patrolman, and the Smoaks have now been introduced to the new America, where "nothing has changed" except increased security against terrorists. And police terrorism against American citizens.

Mary Jo Denton, a staff writer for the Cookeville, Tennessee Herald-Citizen, reported the details of the police stop and ensuing episodes, including the shooting of the dog in front of the Smoaks and their two sons. It also included the handcuffing of James Smoak at gunpoint, the horror of being stopped unexpectedly by three Tennessee Highway Patrol cars, removed from the car at gunpoint, and handcuffed. This included James Smoak, his wife Pamela, and their 17-year old son, Brandon.

The Smoaks were released in due time. However, the entire affair apparently started when Mr. Smoak’s wallet, inadvertently left on the hood of the car at a gas stop, flew off the hood and onto the highway. Some passerby reported the incident, which hardly constituted grounds for suspected terrorism or even a "normal" robbery. However, the Tennessee Highway Patrol apparently didn’t even check the Smoaks’ North Carolina license plates to determine the owner of the vehicle or any records pertaining to the vehicle or its owners. Guns drawn, the Smoaks were ordered to their knees, face down, and handcuffed.

Whether they were read their Miranda rights is not reported, it probably isn’t known at this point.

Or maybe there just aren’t any more Miranda rights.

Or any other civil rights. Or any Bill of Rights.

The problem with American citizens is, they think they still live in a country where they are innocent until proven guilty, or that they have rights as citizens to be approached by the law officers and asked for their driver’s license or other form of identification prior to being arrested, handcuffed and shoved into a patrol car - all without a crime having been committed.

We used to read about things like this happening in Nazi Germany, and in Soviet Russia, in Communist China, or some banana republics.

We hear this is how Saddam Hussein treats his Iraqi subjects. And we’re about to go to war to depose this "evil dictator" because our leaders want his land to be as free as America. Apparently, it already is.

If this sounds bitter, it’s because I remember a very different America, I’ve been stopped twice in my lifetime by the police for minor traffic infractions, and not once have I encountered anything like this. However, I will do my best never to again do something to warrant a police stop.

Come to think of it, James Smoak didn’t DO anything to warrant a police stop. In my America, the police would have stopped him and returned his wallet, identification and all, wished him a good day and drive carefully.

That was when this nation was a free country.

When are Americans going to wake up to the fact that all this so-called airport security is a sham, that they have traded their freedom for the illusion of security, and police are now a growing group of "jack boots" who make a terrorist case out of a lost wallet? What else will attract attention? Well, don’t leave your children for one minute in the car (regardless of the cause or the weather) or they might wind up in the hands of the state. Don’t argue too loudly, family fights like we had in the days of a free country now attract the police and everyone could wind up in jail for calling someone else a dotcom.it no good rotten swineface.

You must argue quietly, never strike your children or discipline them in public for any reason, speak only that which is politically correct or wind up charged with a hate crime, and defend every administration and authority or be deemed an enemy of the state.

If your religion is Christianity, be forewarned that it is more and more politically incorrect, while speaking of Allah is very politically correct. It is even taught in schools where Bibles are not allowed, cigarettes are banned, condoms are handed out freely and homosexual practices are taught to children too young to even think about sex.

As many readers know, I live in the Phoenix, Arizona megaplex, a complex of about twenty cities and towns around the state’s capital city. A couple of months ago, a woman was shot to death in her car at a drive-through Walgreen's pharmacy for trying to get Soma by a forged prescription. The officer who shot the woman - who had a 14-month old baby with her in the car - claimed self-defense because the woman was trying to run over him. However, the medical examiner found she had been shot from an angle to the left and rear of her position in the driver’s seat. Self defense? The officer is under investigation for second-degree murder and has been fired from the Chandler police department. However, a child is motherless, a man has been deprived of his wife and companion, the mother of his child, because his wife tried to get a drug with a phony prescription. Florida Governor Jeb Bush’s daughter did the same thing and got a slap on the wrist.

It seems the law now considers everyone guilty until proven innocent, with people in high places excepted.

The number of horror stories increases daily in Amerika.

You don’t have to do anything except lose your wallet or look like a suspect, as long as you are not the proper hyphenation. It seems our nation goes out of the way to intimidate citizens of European descent, and cater to those of Middle Eastern or Hispanic descent.

And we thought we were all equal.

Think again. Just not out loud.



[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 01-08-2003]

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FLKook
Chemspiracy Realist


East Central Florida
1592 posts, Apr 2001

posted 01-09-2003 02:50 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for FLKook     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This is but a tiny excerpt. An excellent presentation of the facts... http://www.freedom-force.org/granddeception.htm

Ladies and Gentlemen, the title of my presentation today is The Grand Deception - A Second Look at the War on Terrorism.

I was flattered to hear in my introduction that I have a reputation for taking complex subjects and making them easy to understand. I hope I can live up to that expectation, but I couldn’t help wondering if I can really do that with this topic: The War on Terrorism. How can you make that easy to understand? It’s such a huge and confusing topic. I feel like the proverbial mosquito in a nudist camp. I know what I have to do. I just don’t know where to begin.

There is a formula I often follow when I don’t know where to begin, and that is to start with history. If you discover the history, you should be able to figure it out as you go along. It was Will Durant who said, "Those who know nothing about history are doomed forever to repeat it."

Are we doomed to repeat the mistakes of history in the war on terrorism? If we continue to follow the path we are now taking, I’m afraid that we are. But to find out whether we are repeating the mistakes of history, we need to go back in time. So, I invite you to join me in my time machine. We are going to splash around in history for a while and look at some great events and huge mistakes to see if there are parallels, any lessons to be learned for today. I must warn you that it will seem we are lost in time. We are going to go here and there, and then jump back further, and then forward in time, and we will be examining issues that may make you wonder "What on earth has this to do with today." But I can assure you, when we reach the end of our journey, you will see that everything we cover has a direct relevance to today and, in particular, to the war on terrorism.


[Edited 2 times, lastly by FLKook on 01-09-2003]

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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-09-2003 09:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
HACKING AWAY THE CONSTITUTION....THE SEIGE CONTINUES......


Report: Anti-terror efforts pinch privacy

By Declan McCullagh
Staff Writer, CNET News.com
September 3, 2002, 6:28 AM PT
http://news.com.com/2100-1023-956286.html


In the year that has elapsed since the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks, the world's governments have moved to restrict privacy, boost surveillance and increase linking of databases, according to a survey released by a pair of advocacy groups on Tuesday.

The 393-page report, which reviews current and proposed laws in 50 nations, is the first comprehensive survey of how privacy rights have been globally affected after last September's catastrophes. It was released by human rights group Privacy International and the Electronic Privacy Information Center.

Four trends have become apparent, according to the report: the swift erosion of pro-privacy laws; greater data sharing among corporations, police and spy agencies; greater eavesdropping; and sharply increased interest in people-tracking technologies, such as face-recognition systems and national ID cards.

"It's actually pretty shocking if you look at the timeline that's involved here," said Sarah Andrews, research director of the EPIC and the author of the report. "Getting legislation through a government is not an easy thing to do, and most of this happened before the end of 2001."

EPIC is a nonprofit group located in Washington, D.C., that advocates for limits on government surveillance while supporting a far-reaching regulatory regime that would control the data collection practices of private corporations. Its voice is one of many in the intense debate over finding a balance between security and liberty.

The government activities reached well beyond the United States, where the attacks took place, according to the report. "The policy changes were not limited to the United States, as a large number of countries responded to the threat of terrorism."

In response, the European Commission is considering a requirement that would make cyberattacks punishable as a terrorist office, Australia and Canada are drafting laws to permit spy agencies to conduct domestic surveillance of citizens, and a U.K. law now authorizes Internet providers to retain data for police purposes. Canada has proposed opening airline passenger databases to police, and German officials have suggested creating a database of "known troublemakers."

GET THE PRIVACY REPORT HERE...............
http://www.privacyinternational.org/survey/phr2002/
http://www.epic.org



[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 01-09-2003]

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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-09-2003 09:11 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
POINDEXTER AND FEMA'S AMAZING INTERNET DATA DISAPPEARING ACT...................

http://www.politechbot.com/p-04281.html

WHAT ALL SEEING EYE?

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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-09-2003 09:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
YOUR FINGERPRINT OR NO CASH FOR YOU CITIZEN
http://www.eetimes.com/sys/news/OEG20030102S0011


Hunno to deploy fingerprint ID technology in ATMs

Semiconductor Business News
January 3, 2003 (9:33 a.m. EST)

SAN FRANCISCO--Hunno Technologies Inc. and Hyosung Corp. today announced a deal under which Hunno's fingerprint identification technology will be incorporate into ATM teller machines manufactured by Hyosung.

The companies will incorporate Hunno's MS2600 Fingerprint ID Scanner into ATM machines manufactured by Hyosung of South Korea. The MS2600 is a biometrics-based identification system that helps prevent fraudulent banking incidents by denying account access when attempted by unauthorized individuals with non-matching fingerprints.

Hunno, a Delaware corporation, develops proprietary fingerprint identification technology through its subsidiary, Hunno Technologies Inc., based in South Korea. Organized in 1997, Hunno Korea produced the world's first CMOS-based fingerprint identification module in 1998 and an opt

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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-09-2003 11:27 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
YOU ARE THE TERRORIST.........


HERE IS THE PROOF.............


WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT IT????

U.S. Can Hold Citizens As Combatants

Associated Press 01/09/03: Curt Anderson

Original Link: http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20030108/ap_on_go_ot/
afghan_american_prisoners_5

WASHINGTON - A federal appeals court ruled Wednesday that the government can hold U.S. citizens as enemy combatants during wartime without the constitutional protections afforded Americans in criminal prosecutions.

In overturning a lower court ruling, the 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals in Richmond, Va., said the status of 22-year-old Yaser Esam Hamdi as a citizen did not change the fact he was captured in Afghanistan while fighting alongside Taliban and al-Qaida fighters.

"Judicial review does not disappear during wartime, but the review of battlefield captures in overseas conflicts is a highly deferential one" to the government, the three-judge panel wrote.

Hamdi, the court added, is not charged with a crime in the United States but is being held under "well-established laws and customs of war ... the fact that he is a citizen does not affect the legality of his detention as an enemy combatant."

Attorney General John Ashcroft hailed the decision, calling it "an important victory for the president's ability to protect the American people in times of war."

"Detention of enemy combatants prevents them from rejoining the enemy and continuing to fight against America and its allies, and has long been upheld by our nation's courts, regardless of the citizenship of the enemy combatant," Ashcroft said in a statement.

Hamdi was captured in Afghanistan in November 2001 after a prison uprising by suspected Taliban and al-Qaida members. He was at the Mazar-e-Sharif prison uprising — where fellow U.S. citizen John Walker Lindh was captured — and later was transported along with hundreds of other alleged enemy soldiers to a prison at the U.S. Navy base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba.

It later was discovered Hamdi had been born in Louisiana to Saudi parents. Hamdi and his family returned to Saudi Arabia while he still was a toddler, but he never renounced his U.S. citizenship.

Hamdi has been held in a naval brig in Norfolk, Va., since April.

His case is seen by some as a major legal test case to determine the government's ability to hold citizens without access to a lawyer or the courts. If Hamdi can be imprisoned in a military jail with few of the constitutional protections afforded Americans facing criminal prosecution, critics say, then other U.S. citizens could be similarly held.

A federal judge in Norfolk, Va., agreed, ruling in August that Hamdi should at least have a right to a lawyer and a chance to see the government's evidence against him.

The circuit court in Richmond, Va., agreed that the case raises serious questions about the rights of citizens but concluded that, in wartime, the government's authority is supreme in deciding who may be held indefinitely.

Hamdi, the judges said, was "squarely within the zone of active combat" when captured and is being lawfully detained. The courts, they added, have only limited authority to intervene in such national security matters.

"Any effort to ascertain the facts concerning the petitioner's conduct while amongst the nation's enemies would entail an unacceptable risk of obstructing war efforts authorized by Congress and undertaken by the executive branch," the 54-page opinion said.

The court declined, however, to address the rights of U.S. citizens who might be held as enemy combatants if captured on U.S. soil. Their opinion is confined to a citizen who takes up arms against the United States in a foreign country.

The three circuit judges deciding the case were James Harvie Wilkinson III and William W. Wilkins, both appointed by President Reagan, and William B. Traxler, who was appointed by President Clinton. Their decision was unanimous.

THIS IS ANOTHER OUTRIGHT VIOLATION OF CONSTITUTIONAL LAW.


SEIG.......HAIL

SEIG--------HAIL......

J. AS$CRACK"----
Attorney General John Ashcroft hailed the decision, calling it "an important victory for the president's ability to protect the American people in times of war."


MEIN FHURER!



[Edited 2 times, lastly by Mech on 01-09-2003]

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SoManyLies
New Member


Ontario, Canada
34 posts, Dec 2002

posted 01-09-2003 01:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SoManyLies   Email SoManyLies     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
http://www.takebackthemedia.com/bushnonazi.html

This is a cool Flash Movie comparing Bush and Hitler.

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theseeker
One moon circles

Damnit...I'm a doctor jim
3403 posts, Jul 2000

posted 01-09-2003 03:34 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for theseeker   Visit theseeker's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
hmmm, you take up arms against the country you lived in and they can detain you....what's wrong with that ?

I believe the strict interpretation of constitutional law says that if you take up arms against your country you forfeit your citizenship, and that you are committing treason, and therefore you can be excecuted by firing squad....

jihad johnny should have been excecuted...

to add I'm fairly sure not a damn one of you knows much about hitler...you guys just have a goofy need to shoot your mouth off....about shit you know nothing about...

------------------
T/S

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Mech
Liberate your mind


Northeast USA
4969 posts, Sep 2002

posted 01-09-2003 04:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message