posted 09-07-2003 11:58 AM            

"There's an old saying - 'The devil is the church's best friend.' If Satan wasn't around, churches would go out of business. The same goes for conservatives or Christians, or whoever they might be. They need art because art is evil; art challenges beliefs. Because I'm a vocal spokesperson for that kind of activity, I am the devil to them."

"There's a lot of great stories and a lot of great values in the Holy Bible, and I actually relate to a lot of them. The character, the idea, or the part of my personality that I describe as Antichrist Superstar, is a lot like Lucifer in the Bible. Someone who was kicked out of heaven because he wanted to be God. I try to say in my own story: 'Well if it was told from his point of view, then would he still be the bad guy?'"

"Another Thing I hate is political correctness-it's just christian morality disguised. The other day, this girl gave me a hard time about wearing this fur coat, called me an asshole for 30 minutes, then asked for tickets to the show. That,to me, illustrates how committed these people are to their
little causes"

"I blame everything I do on Christianity.
So why aren't they out there arresting
the preachers I was raised listening to,
or the sunday school teachers?."

The word 'Antichrist' ,to me, is the collective disbelief in god -- Marilyn MansonWhy should we believe in a god, that doesnt believe in us? -- Marilyn Manson

Society has traditionally always tried to find scapegoats for its problems. Well here I am -- Marilyn Manson

We live in a society of victimization, where people are much more comfortable being victimized than actually standing up for themselves.-- Marilyn Manson

Blaming me for what my fans do is like blaming Hootie and the Blowfish for making your life completely boring --Marilyn Manson

We're just helping out the Christians by bringing about the apocalypse. They can all go to heaven -- Madonna Wayne Gacy

posted 09-07-2003 12:35 PM            

Marilyn Manson can say whatever he damn well pleases, but as a musician, he's mediocre, at best. He is more likened to a Little Richard, than say, Bill Haley and the Comets, as far as ability, and using a 50's analogy. Little Richard and Marilyn Manson were/are average musicians that were better at flambouyancy, than actaully knowing the ins and outs of great music. It's not to say they were/are bad musicians, just that there were/are better at the time, but the biggest egos get the attention. Of course, Little Richard became a preacher after all his "anti-christian" shenanigans in the 50's. I was there, believe me this happened. Marilyn manson is the modern equivilant. If it weren't for christianity, he'd be in a bar band in Fargo, North Dakota.

I think he is getting so ANTI everything, that he has no positive statements to make about anything. his "I am the anti-christ" stance is so "Pro-Bible" and christian, that I don't see any difference between him and Jerry Falwell, as far as "I can say whatever I want to because I am Pro-Christ or Anti-Christ". One side keeps the other in business, meanwhile people who have good things to say, often get ignored.

Sorry, being a musician and video person for 45 years, and still making a living off of them, I can say this. Too much christianity thrown in your face is annoying, but so is too much ANTI-christianity Maybe he'd better listen to Louis Armstrong, Stravinsky, and Hank Williams to learn what really great music is about. There's an old saying, "Learn your instrument first, then speak through it".

Nothing personal KNOW-THIS. As you can see by your "What music do you listen to" thread, I have many favorites. Manson is just simply, immature to me, and I like some bands younger than him, so it's not a case of being an old fart.

posted 09-07-2003 02:01 PM            

You're such an inspiration for the ways
That I'll never ever choose to be
Oh so many ways for me to show you
How the savior has abandoned you
Fuck your God
Your Lord and your Christ
He did this
Took all you had and
Left you this way
Still you pray, you never stray
Never taste of the fruit
You never thought to question why

It's not like you killed someone
It's not like you drove a hateful spear into his side
Praise the one who left you
Broken down and paralyzed
He did it all for you
He did it all for you

Oh so many many ways for me to show you
How your dogma has abandoned you
Pray to your Christ, to your god
Never taste of the fruit
Never stray, never break
Never - choke on a lie
Even though he's the one who did this to you
You never thought to question why

posted 09-08-2003 09:03 AM            

What I am trying to say is that sometimes music and art can be so righteously bizarre, that you don't even need to be "counter" anything. The shear nature of the output does that.

I feel that Marilyn Manson is dependent on christianity to get his message across. Maybe you are too yong to see the Little Richard analogy, but it was the same situation. They (christians) were ready to hang him and Elvis to dry in the 50's. Little Richard especially, beimg black and gay. He would do the most outrageous things to upset them.

So did the following do anti-religious themes at times:

The Nice
Crazy World of Arthur Brown
Cab Calloway
Jefferson Airplane
Steppenwolf
Bob Dylan
7th Wave
Black Sabbath
DEVO

There's more, but you get the idea. It's not new. Marilyn Manson may be serving a purpose, and if you had listened to my bands CD "4th Blowing of the Great Nose", that I had listed earliar, you'd see we deal with a male sky god being forced upon us. However, we are not totally dependent upon christianity for our message. We like to deal with many subjects that are discussed on these alternative web sites.

It is important to realize that BushLaden Productions are using christianity to get votes, and nothing more, so as far as that, I'm with you.

posted 09-09-2003 03:34 AM            

Everytime lunatics knock on my door,
and want me to give up my own religious beliefs
and take up theirs instead
they call themselves "christians"

(no athiest or agnostic has EVER knocked on my door OR YOURS trying to get us to give up our own religion and impose theirs on us instead.
Only self described Christians seek to impose their beliefs on all others by all means available.)

In a good mood, I whip out one of my many Bibles and prove via scripture they are following the anti-christ, in trying to force their view of religion on unwilling people.

In a bad mood...
I remind them that in the last days:
"even the very elect" will be fooled into following the anti-christ
and his many false prophets.
(wealthy worshippers of Mammon who masquarade as christians/
eg; multimillionaires PatRobertson, BillyGraham, JerryFallwell or Billionaire Sun Yung Moon)

Our dear Dubya; the popular politician who even believes that he himself is following Christ while he serves the Anti-christ via wars against Babylon and other nations
which everyone agrees
"None can stand against him"

About time to stop bringing up the anti-christ;
because George dubya fits that role better than anyone in world history since Hitler.

Give it a rest!
willya?

posted 09-09-2003 10:32 PM            

In 1555, Nostradamus wrote:

"Come the millennium, month 12,
In the home of greatest power,
The village idiot will come forth
To be acclaimed the leader."

posted 09-10-2003 10:00 AM            

"Between 1777 and 1798, the founding fathers created inspirational national symbols—a flag, Great Seal, national motto, national bird and national anthem—untainted by religious favoritism. Aside from new national anthems, these symbols remained mostly unchanged until the Civil War and its aftermath, when they were hijacked by special interests and manipulated, along with patriotism and religion, as propaganda. From that point on, America’s national symbols were changed primarily to promote two major themes: 1) Loyalty to the ruling class at the expense of “multiculturalism,” and "religion."

This trend can best be seen in the Pledge of Allegiance, which was stripped of the word “equality,” then made more divisive with the addition of the words “under God,” and the national motto, which was changed from E pluribus unum (“one out of many”) to “In God We Trust.”

Symbols and patriotism have generally been manipulated most during wars and times of domestic discontent. The biggest changes to the symbols themselves—primarily adoption and modification—occurred during the Civil War, the years preceding the 400th anniversary of Christopher Columbus’ discovery of America (1892) and the McCarthy “witch-hunt” years (primarily 1954 and 1956). The biggest challenges to the national symbols have generally occurred during the same periods, especially during the World War I era, World War II (when Jehovah’s witnesses challenged flag salutes in both the United States and Nazi Germany), and the turbulent protest years of the 1960s and early 1970s.

It seems very likely that America’s national symbols will be changed again as the result of two great tragedies—the election of President George W. Bush in 2000 and the “Attack on America” of September 11, 2001. As of July 2002, the most notable resistance has been offered by a Californian who filed a lawsuit that resulted in the use of the Pledge of Allegiance in public schools being declared unconstitutional, because of the words “under God.” Unfortunately, the decision will probably be reversed. Thus, future historians might say that America’s national symbols were born at the end of the 18th century, slowly declined through the 19th and 20th centuries, and were finally laid to rest in the 21st century."