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  Tommy Franks says Martial LAW will replace Constitution after next WMD attack! (Page 1)

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Topic:   Tommy Franks says Martial LAW will replace Constitution after next WMD attack!

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-21-2003 11:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
THIS GUY IS A DISGUSTING PIECE OF TRASH!

*****

Tommy Franks: Martial Law Will Replace Constitution After Next Terror Attack.


Newsmax
Friday, Nov. 21, 2003

Gen. Tommy Franks says that if the United States is hit with a weapon of mass destruction that inflicts large casualties, the Constitution will likely be discarded in favor of a military form of government.

Franks, who successfully led the U.S. military operation to liberate Iraq, expressed his worries in an extensive interview he gave to the men's lifestyle magazine Cigar Aficionado.

In the magazine's December edition, the former commander of the military's Central Command warned that if terrorists succeeded in using a weapon of mass destruction (WMD) against the U.S. or one of our allies, it would likely have catastrophic consequences for our cherished republican form of government.

Discussing the hypothetical dangers posed to the U.S. in the wake of Sept. 11, Franks said that “the worst thing that could happen” is if terrorists acquire and then use a biological, chemical or nuclear weapon that inflicts heavy casualties.

If that happens, Franks said, “... the Western world, the free world, loses what it cherishes most, and that is freedom and liberty we've seen for a couple of hundred years in this grand experiment that we call democracy.”

Franks then offered “in a practical sense” what he thinks would happen in the aftermath of such an attack.

“It means the potential of a weapon of mass destruction and a terrorist, massive, casualty-producing event somewhere in the Western world – it may be in the United States of America – that causes our population to question our own Constitution and to begin to militarize our country in order to avoid a repeat of another mass, casualty-producing event. Which in fact, then begins to unravel the fabric of our Constitution. Two steps, very, very important.”

Franks didn't speculate about how soon such an event might take place.

Already, critics of the U.S. Patriot Act, rushed through Congress in the wake of the Sept. 11 attacks, have argued that the law aims to curtail civil liberties and sets a dangerous precedent.

But Franks' scenario goes much further. He is the first high-ranking official to openly speculate that the Constitution could be scrapped in favor of a military form of government.

The usually camera-shy Franks retired from U.S. Central Command, known in Pentagon lingo as CentCom, in August 2003, after serving nearly four decades in the Army.

Franks earned three Purple Hearts for combat wounds and three Bronze Stars for valor. Known as a “soldier's general,” Franks made his mark as a top commander during the U.S.'s successful Operation Desert Storm, which liberated Kuwait in 1991. He was in charge of CentCom when Osama bin Laden's al-Qaeda attacked the United States on Sept. 11.

Franks said that within hours of the attacks, he was given orders to prepare to root out the Taliban in Afghanistan and to capture bin Laden.

Franks offered his assessment on a number of topics to Cigar Aficionado, including:

President Bush: “As I look at President Bush, I think he will ultimately be judged as a man of extremely high character. A very thoughtful man, not having been appraised properly by those who would say he's not very smart. I find the contrary. I think he's very, very bright. And I suspect that he'll be judged as a man who led this country through a crease in history effectively. Probably we'll think of him in years to come as an American hero.”

On the motivation for the Iraq war: Contrary to claims that top Pentagon brass opposed the invasion of Iraq, Franks said he wholeheartedly agreed with the president's decision to invade Iraq and oust Saddam Hussein.

“I, for one, begin with intent. ... There is no question that Saddam Hussein had intent to do harm to the Western alliance and to the United States of America. That intent is confirmed in a great many of his speeches, his commentary, the words that have come out of the Iraqi regime over the last dozen or so years. So we have intent.

“If we know for sure ... that a regime has intent to do harm to this country, and if we have something beyond a reasonable doubt that this particular regime may have the wherewithal with which to execute the intent, what are our actions and orders as leaders in this country?”

The Pentagon's deck of cards: Asked how the Pentagon decided to put its most-wanted Iraqis on a set of playing cards, Franks explained its genesis. He recalled that when his staff identified the most notorious Iraqis the U.S. wanted to capture, “it just turned out that the number happened to be about the same as a deck of cards. And so somebody said, ‘Aha, this will be the ace of spades.'”

Capturing Saddam: Franks said he was not surprised that Saddam has not been captured or killed. But he says he will eventually be found, perhaps sooner than Osama bin laden.

“The capture or killing of Saddam Hussein will be a near term thing. And I won't say that'll be within 19 or 43 days. ... I believe it is inevitable.”

Franks ended his interview with a less-than-optimistic note. “It's not in the history of civilization for peace ever to reign. Never has in the history of man. ... I doubt that we'll ever have a time when the world will actually be at peace.”

[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 12-21-2003]

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David
Chemtrail Information Agent


1270 posts, Oct 2000

posted 11-21-2003 11:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for David     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
With that would come the final descent of America into the pits of hell.
Once that law is in effect the prick in the white house will be a permanent fixture.
What better way for a treasonist president to further his black souled agenda than to have his dancing imps use a WMD and then declare himself supreme ruler of the masses.


[Edited 1 times, lastly by David on 11-21-2003]

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-21-2003 12:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yep...they are ANNOUNCING IT.

We are headed for a DICTATORSHIP.


YOU WANTED IT BUSH VOTERS....YOU GOT IT.


Iv'e got one word for that scumbag Franks...TREASON.


MAKES ME SICK!!!!!!!




[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 11-21-2003]

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FLKook
Chemspiracy Realist


East Central Florida
705 posts, Apr 2001

posted 11-21-2003 04:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for FLKook     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
YOU WANTED IT BUSH VOTERS....YOU GOT IT.
Ummm, the illuminists plan to rule the world would be in place and marching forward which ever CFR president was installed. Not just heir bush. Most of the folks that I know that voted for Bush were trying to avoid Al Gore. Not aware that he is just another NWO stooge. (As was Clinton and well you know the history.)

It's not like you Mech to incite the left right paradigm crowd.

The UN/US good cop bad cop routine might be playing out differently but the end game remains the same.

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-21-2003 06:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Nope...my comments were aimed at those who still bow down to Lord Bush.

I don't see any Democrat or Republican candidate I'd like to vote for in 2004 because all of them are just globalist puppets who will
take over where Bush left off and sell America down the river to Globalization..a.k.a. a "New World Order".

Come up with an acceptable Constitutionalist/libertarian candidate and I'll be happy to vote for him/her.

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jetblack
New Member


NY NY
35 posts, Nov 2003

posted 11-21-2003 09:37 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jetblack     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Do you ever read what you paste? I read enough of your garbage to know you hate Bush and just about everything good in America then you post this last one which talks highly of him.

President Bush: “As I look at President Bush, I think he will ultimately be judged as a man of extremely high character. A very thoughtful man, not having been appraised properly by those who would say he's not very smart. I find the contrary. I think he's very, very bright. And I suspect that he'll be judged as a man who led this country through a crease in history effectively. Probably we'll think of him in years to come as an American hero.”

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-21-2003 11:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well...you need to get out of MY AMERICA then.

Bush is a TRAITOR and so is Franks.

"the Constitution will likely be discarded in favor of a military form of government."

Apparently YOU can't read.

Is that what you want? Dictatorship? Move to Commie China and do us a favor.

I will fight with every drop of my blood to oppose it.

So will a lot of other Military veterans just like me.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 11-21-2003]

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FLKook
Chemspiracy Realist


East Central Florida
705 posts, Apr 2001

posted 11-22-2003 07:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for FLKook     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
jetblack....nice try Last Laugh.

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-22-2003 02:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Amazing what people will try to keep the ILLUSION going.

Multiple IDS...fake identities...

Certain people will sink to any level.

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jetblack
New Member


NY NY
35 posts, Nov 2003

posted 11-22-2003 04:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jetblack     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Excuse me, look up the IP again I am not last laugh! I'd also like to add I was a marine for eight years and I don't hold the same veiws some nuts have here (not everyone). There is such a thing as being naive and going overboard with a right/leftist extreme. Get a hold of yourself before you hurt yourself or somebody else.

[Edited 1 times, lastly by jetblack on 11-22-2003]

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-22-2003 05:58 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
IF ANYONE is extreme/nuts it's Franks and all those who sail with him.

He's not going to Pi$$ on my Constitution without me raising my concern...that's for sure.

If people don't speak out about this NWO trash they will stomp all over our liberties.

"complainers and whiners" are the reason they haven't totally pulled the rug out from under us and make America thee next Soviet Union/Commie China......but then again..just about EVERYTHING in the stores nowadays IS made in Commie China.

So YOU get a grip, turn off the TV and WAKE UP!


********


Martial Law: Coming to a Neighborhood Near You?

The U.S. government has used martial law on numerous occasions, most often to quell domestic disturbances in specific locations around the country. According to the United States Constitution Online, during the War of 1812, Andrew Jackson imposed martial law in an area of New Orleans. When a judge demanded Jackson produce, through the writ of habeas corpus, a man arrested for sedition, Jackson ordered the arrest of the judge. in 1892 at Coeur d'Alene, Idaho, rebellious mine workers blew up a mill and shot at strike breaking workers. Mine owners requested that the state's governor impose martial law and, to no surprise, he did. In 1914, federal troops were ordered by Woodrow Wilson to end the Coal Field Wars in Colorado. In 1934, dockworkers in San Francisco initiated a strike and the governor declared the dockyards subject to martial law empowering the National Guard to make arrests and try detainees. The Supreme Court opined twice on matters involving martial law in Ex Parte Milligan and Duncan v. Kahanamoku. In 1866, Milligan's Supreme Court writers proclaimed that Abraham Lincoln's imposition of martial law had been unconstitutional:

"Martial lawdestroys every guarantee of the Constitution and effectually renders the military independent of an superior to the civil power--the attempt to do which by the King of Great Britain was deemed by our fathers such an offense that they assigned it to the world as one of the causes which impelled them to declare their independence. Civil liberty and this kind of martial law cannot endure together; the antagonism is irreconcilable, and, in the conflict, one or the other must perish."

In 1946, the Supreme Court ruled that the military arrest of two civilians in Hawaii during World War II and their subsequent trial by military tribunals was unconstitutional.

In 2002, with the U.S. Supreme Court nothing more than a useful machination of the Bush regime, it seems likely that if Americans become subjected to a Bush declaration of martial law, any challenge to it would fail miserably. With that thought in mind, its useful to note that the Bush crowd has had plenty of experience with martial law and states-of-emergency. In 1992, Bush the Elder issued Executive Order 12804 in response to the Los Angeles riots. Hence, the US Army 7th Infantry Division and detachments of US Marines were deployed to mop up Los Angeles. That order was only issued after the city's poor had destroyed their neighborhoods. As an aside, that event would expose the CIA's penchant for selling drugs to inner city youth to raise funds for U.S. government covert operations in Central and South America. Bush the Elder was the overseer of much of this activity when he lorded over the Iran-contra scandal while Vice President under Ronald Reagan. One of Bush's underlings at the time, Oliver North, came up with a secret plan, along with the fascist-oriented Federal Emergency Management Agency (the key-masters for the doors to the bunkers), to declare martial law in the event of a "national crisis," including "violent and widespread internal dissent or national opposition to a U.S. military invasion abroad." Florida's provincial ruler Jeb Bush signed Executive Order 01-262 on September 11, 2001 declaring a State of Emergency in Florida. That was prior to similar declarations in New York and Virginia where the action was. "Jebbie" (that's what Bill Clinton calls him) also has the power to suspend elections for 30 days in a county under a State of Emergency.

The Bush family has managed to involve the United States in two wars; two invasions in Latin America, one that resulted in the fiery deaths of thousands of poor Panamanian barrio residents and another that resulted in the Bay of Pigs fiasco; aiding and abetting through murky financial investments America's Teutonic enemy in the last world war; corrupting the U.S. presidential election process; and making the wealthiest Americans and U.S. corporations richer while at the same cutting federal health, education, and welfare budgets and offloading those tasks to the overburdened states.

As the economy sputters with real unemployment close to 8 percent and as income disparity reaches astronomical proportions, it seems that the Bush regime will begin another war. Will that war be against Iraq, as Bush's neo-conservative hawks want? Or will the Seven Days in May crowd spin the Axis of Evil roulette wheel? Will the arrow point to Cuba? North Korea? Venezuela? The Bush family's record of death and destruction prompted one elderly couple in Baltimore, Maryland (the husband being a highly decorated WW II U.S. Army veteran) to say, " The Bush family should be barred from ever holding political office. Look what they've done to this nation!"

And They Are Not Done Yet

An invasion of Iraq or any of the "Axis of Evil" or "Beyond Axis of Evil" nations is likely to result in a response that means American citizens will die here in the U.S. One incident, one aircraft hijacked, a "dirty nuke" set off in a small town, may well prompt the Bush regime, let's say during the election campaign of 2003-2004, to suspend national elections for a year while his government ensures stability. The precedent for such thinking is now enshrined in GOP politics. Another egotistical politician, Rudolph Giuliani, suggested that he should stay on as Mayor of New York a while longer past his term to make sure "New Yorkers would get through this thing". Would it be any surprise to hear Bush II say the same thing late in 2003 after insurgents would have destroyed part of a city or a chemical weapons cloud spreads over half of a small state?

Many closed-door meetings have been held on these subjects and the notices for these meetings have been closely monitored by the definitive www.cryptome.org. In the event of martial law, the Posse Comitatus Act of 1878, which has already been largely gutted by the USA Patriot Act and other Bush II actions, would cease to exist. Posse Comitatus has, for over 100 years, served as an important criminal law safeguard proscribing the use of the Army (later, the Air Force and Navy) to "execute the laws," except where expressly authorized by the Constitution or by Congress. With the abrogation of Posse Comitatus and the imposition of martial law, the military would, as it did during post-Civil War Reconstruction in the South, be able to arrest and detain civilians for any flimsy reason. Civilian detainees consigned to federal prisons would be under the control of the Bureau of Prisons while those detained by the military would be subject to the regulations imposed by military commanders. The writ of habeas corpus would be suspended and the family members and legal representatives for detainees would not have a right to see them. This situation has already occurred with those detained in the wake of September 11 without a formal imposition of martial law.

Military tribunals could, as they did in Hawaii during the war, try and convict U.S. civilians. If prisons could not hold all the detainees, the government already has plans to create or reactivate large prison camps in the South and West. Some of these were already used to detain Cuban, Vietnamese, and Haitian "boat people."

In the event of martial law, Draconian censorship laws would be implemented. Even now, the Patriot Act grants authority to obtain an order from the FISA (Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act) Court requiring any person or business to produce any books, records, documents, or items." That law would undoubtedly be extended to encompass the Internet as well. It should be of little wonder why the Pentagon has brought Iran-contra felon Admiral John Poindexter back from retirement to head the Office of Information Awareness. Coupled with the Office of Information Exploitation, Poindexter's office is seeking ways to identify, block, and determine the sources of seditious material posted on the Internet. Blocked web sites, confiscated computers and servers, and the arrest of non-conforming web site managers would become the rule of the day.

Not that it would need much in the way of pressure, but the broadcast media would similarly be required to air only that which has been approved by government censors. For example, U.S. Air Force scientists are soon to meet with CNN to figure out how to gather and disseminate information. During the war against Yugoslavia, CNN and National Public Radio hosted as interns U.S. Army psychological warfare operatives who worked on news stories concerning the war.

Similar closed-door meetings for "Continuity of Government" have taken place since September 11, 2001. Odd, it seems, that no "regular U.S. citizen" and few first responders have had any input into this process. Chalk that up to the fact that the entire process is classified and a matter of "national security" - the rubric that is used to justify the constant whittling away of the Constitution and its Bill of Rights. If the general public knew that "Continuity" actually means that the abilities of the Internal Revenue Service to continue to collect taxes, the Customs Service to continue to collect duties, and the Environmental Protection Agency to continue to collect fines actually outweigh the health and safety of American citizens, they would be outraged. Hence the secrecy surrounding the continuity plans.

James Madison had in right in 1794 when he wisely warned about "the old trick of turning every contingency into a resource for accumulating force in the government." The United States was founded by political sages like Madison, Jefferson, and Franklin. It will ultimately see its demise as a democracy through the likes of Bush II, his father, and the Trent Lotts and Dick Armeys that pervade the American body politic.

http://www.counterpunch.org/m adsen0514.html

[Edited 3 times, lastly by Mech on 11-22-2003]

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HatchetML
Trolling for Trolls


NW Florida
174 posts, Apr 2003

posted 11-23-2003 11:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for HatchetML     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
mech if Amerika is that bad why dont you leave? Whats wrong with you leaving and shutting your contridicting mouth?

Your only good for a laugh anymore mech, sorry but someone has to say it!

I could thnk of a ton of places in this world you could be and not be moaning and crying like you do!

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-23-2003 11:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Hatchet....do me a favor... YOU MOVE.

How about a moderately repressive regime in the Hunan providence in Communist China.

Bush and his creepy crew want to bring that type of rule here. NO THANKS.

****

Commentary on General Frank's statement

The Criminalization of the State
by Michel Chossudovsky

23 November 2003

In the wake of the Iraq war, 18 Iraqis and 2 Jordanians introduced a class action law suit in a Brussels Court against General Franks, Commander of the US Armed Forces in Iraq.

Based on the law of “universal jurisdiction”, characteristic of Belgian law concerning genocide and war crimes, General Franks was identified:

"for ordering war crimes and for not preventing others from committing them or for providing protection to the perpetrators."

The law suit does not solely implicate General Franks, who was obeying orders:

Under the war agenda, high ranking officials of the Bush administration, members of the military, the US congress and the Judiciary have been granted the authority not only to commit criminal acts, but also to designate those opposed to these criminal acts as "enemies of the State."

In other words, the "Criminalization of the State", is when war criminals legitimately occupy positions of authority, which enable them to decide "who are the criminals", when in fact they are criminals.

His statement no doubt reflects a consensus within the Military as to how events ought to unfold. It is clear in his mind that the "war on terrorism" provides a justification for repealing the Rule of Law, ultimately with a view to preserving civil liberties.

Frank's interview suggests that an Al Qaeda sponsored terrorist attack will be used as a "trigger mechanism" for a military coup d'état in America. Frank is alluding to a so-called "Pearl Harbor type event" which would be used as a justification for declaring a State of emergency and the establishment of a military government.

In many regards, the militarisation of civilian State institutions is already functional under the facade of a bogus democracy.

General Frank has nonetheless identified with cynical accuracy the precise scenario whereby military rule will be imposed on America.

"a terrorist, massive, casualty-producing event [will occur] somewhere in the Western world – it may be in the United States of America – that causes our population to question our own Constitution and to begin to militarize our country in order to avoid a repeat of another mass, casualty-producing event."

This statement from an individual who was actively involved in military and intelligence planning at the highest levels, suggests that the "militarization of our country" is an ongoing operational assumption. It is part of the broader "Washington consensus". It identifies the Bush administration's "roadmap" of war and Homeland Defense. Needless to say it is also an integral part of the neoliberal agenda.

The "terrorist massive casualty-producing event" is presented by General Franks as a crucial political turning point. The resulting crisis and social turmoil will facilitate a major shift in US political, social and institutional structures.

In the words of David Rockefeller:

"We are on the verge of global transformation. All we need is the right major crisis and the nations will accept the New World Order."

A similar statement was made by Zbigniew Brzezinski in the Grand Chessboard:

"As America becomes an increasingly multicultural society, it may find it more difficult to fashion a consensus on foreign policy issues, except in the circumstances of a truly massive and widely perceived direct external threat."

The NeoCons Project for the New American Century (PNAC), published in September 2000, barely two months before the presidential elections, called for:

"some catastrophic and catalyzing event, like a new Pearl Harbor." (See http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/NAC304A.html )

What is terrifying in General Frank's assertions, is that they come from a man who speaks with a profound sense of conviction, who firmly believes in the righteousness of war as a means to safeguarding democratic values.

In other words, the military actors and politicians are totally blinded by the "war on terrorism" dogma. Truth is falsehood and falsehood is truth. Realities are turned upside down. Acts of war are heralded as "humanitarian interventions" geared towards upholding democracy. Military occupation and the killing of civilians are presented as "peace-keeping operations." The repeal of democracy is portrayed by General Franks as a means to providing "domestic security" and upholding civil liberties.

Needless to say: any attempt by antiwar critics to reveal these "inconsistencies" or "unanswered questions" would under General Frank's scenario be defined as a criminal act. In other words, those who are investigating "the war on terrorism" and the military, political and economic actors behind the New World Order, with a view to establishing the truth, are categorized as "enemies of the State", and consequently as criminals:

"The 'war on terrorism' is the cover for the war on dissent."

("Homeland Defense" and the Militarisation of America by Frank Morales, http://www.globalresearch.ca/articles/MOR309A.html , September 2003)

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shatoga
Agent Provocateur


1033 posts, Nov 2002

posted 11-23-2003 01:35 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for shatoga     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
To all those now calling all who question the government and oppose bad presidential policies traitor and communist.

You must have left America after the 1992 election and just returned after the appointment of Bush in 01.

If any of you remained in this country during those eight years, questioned our President's policies or opposed our President;
I ask how could such traitors and commies as yourselves (your own warped definitions) have the gaul to speak out now?

For any not connected with anyone within the republican high command;
the WMD attack is currently being considered as an attack in the northeast on July 4, 2004.
Scheduled for maximum effect of arousing patriotic fervor and almost a guarentee of getting Bush elected and quashing all opposition to the death of constitutional government.

Another Bush "trifecta"

[Edited 1 times, lastly by shatoga on 11-23-2003]

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the professor
KNOW YOUR ROLE

heartland USA
1164 posts, Jan 2003

posted 11-23-2003 05:56 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for the professor   Visit the professor's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quoting

Bush and his creepy crew want to bring that type of rule here. NO THANKS.

You have yet to prove this, you voice what liberal democrats do constantly mech. For the life of me I can't understand why someone screams up and down that they're a constitutionalist but yet scraps the beliefs of the forefathers at the same time. To me your a phony but that is my opinion and will probaly never change. 4500 posts of bashing America and your able to piss off every vet that shows up here, oh wait thats because your more of a patriot than anyone else, you have an elitist attitude much like the one you complain about.

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Ellyn
Senior Member


1122 posts, Jul 2000

posted 11-24-2003 12:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Ellyn     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
THINGS AREN'T ALWAYS AS THEY APPEAR
___________________________________

JFK, 911 & The Real America -
Tying US History Together
By John Phelan
11-23-3

http://www.rense.com/general45/usus.htm

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HatchetML
Trolling for Trolls


NW Florida
174 posts, Apr 2003

posted 11-24-2003 11:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for HatchetML     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Mech, im not completely unhappy with my country as you claim to be, be sure its not the prettiest of pictures but it could be alot worse. IF you think that it stops with Bush your even worse off then imaginable.

Knowing what needs to happen to help, and only ranting in boards serves your agenda no purpose, so either figure out what you could do to change it or just be considered another "crazy" person crying wolf to the un-knowing public....

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JerseyBluEyz
Trust the Universe


Northeast
941 posts, Jul 2003

posted 11-24-2003 10:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for JerseyBluEyz     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Ellyn:
JFK, 911 & The Real America -
Tying US History Together
By John Phelan
http://www.rense.com/general45/usus.htm

Now that was an excellent read! Thanks much!

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shatoga
Agent Provocateur


1033 posts, Nov 2002

posted 11-26-2003 12:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for shatoga     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just my opinion:
that link was great!
Straightforward and to the point!
thanks.

Left right arguement.
Having been on both sides, I see it differently than those who have always listened to and believed only their own partisans.
Both sides lie.
both sides have greedy self serving people who will sell us all into slavery to line their own pockets.


Anyone can contrast Clinton declassifying documents and opening up the National Archives to all people, vs/ Bush making presidential documents sealed forever.

Yeah, both sides are run by the same NWO dupes.
But one side tells you to your face the lies you want to hear and then serves the police state in lockstep,
while the other side is so divided within as to never be any real threat to anyone's freedom.

(Will Rogers' reply to question:
"Do you belong to any organized political party?"
"Hell no! I'm a Democrat!"
Democrats had the White House, Senate and congress in 1993-1995, yet were unable to pass National Health Insurance/ point indisputable/ too divided to be any real threat)

There has never been a greater difference!

Just ask yourself:
Who signed the unconstitutional USAPatriot Act into "law"?
Clinton or Bush?

Who promised to never use US troops for Nation Building?
(and what is that pathalogical liar doing in Afghanistan and Iraq at our expense?
Nation building!)


Comon now!
Clinton could never have gotton away with the deliberate destruction of our nation's institutions that Bush has gleefully done.

Clinton could never have suspended the writ of habeus corpus & held over a thousand people incommunicado for almost two years, without any media protest.
(and less than half a dozen ever charged with any actual crime)


Wake up and smell the stench of what Bush's bunch are spoonfeeding you.

(a rightwing Police State)

Left and right is no longer the paradigm.
Bush, asscroft and co. have changed it into good (UScitizens) and evil (BushLaden Productions).

Tommy Franks led the fight to end the right of a soverign nation to choose their own leaders.


BTW:
How could any Service man or woman.
especially a Marine, violate their' oath of enlistment?
All services' versions of which bear the same words:
>"I, _____,... do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; <


And why do we not impeach and imprison a "pResident" who has so blantently violated his oath of office?
>U.S. Constitution
Article II
Section One, Paragraph 8
"Before he enter on the execution of his office, he shall take the following oath or affirmation:--"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States." "<

In both cases, the oath is to the US Constitution!;
Not to the temporary occupant of the White House!

Marine,
You better get your head on straight!
and begin to support that oath you were never released from.
(an oath to " support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic"
Including AGAINST MEMBERS OF YOUR OWN POLITICAL PARTY!

Here:
Actually read 'our sacred Constitution',
instead of just believing what the cult of conservatisim tells you it says- http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/constitution.table.html#articleii

Professor you should already know better.

(and should also read it for yourself)

Ain't nowhere it says 'this constitution shall mean only what Rush Limbaugh ro
George Will tells you to think it means'

Think for yourselves dammit!

This is getting to be like telling preschoolers over and again to not play in traffic.

Wake up!
You will go to the camps right after us "Constitution loving Liberals, Moderates and true Conservatives" have been eliminated.


[Edited 2 times, lastly by shatoga on 11-26-2003]

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KNOW-THIS
Senior Member



915 posts, Jul 2003

posted 11-27-2003 08:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KNOW-THIS     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Shatoga are you male or female, just curious, if you don't mind me asking. I enjoy reading your posts, I'm impressed with the way you recall information. It sounds like you've done your homework.

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shatoga
Agent Provocateur


1033 posts, Nov 2002

posted 11-28-2003 12:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for shatoga     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't recall that much information.
Just have more books than the local public library.

I've collected books since 1960, when I inherited my grandfather's library.
(OSS-WWII-Oil exec till retirement)
I spend more on books each month than most families spend on food and utilities.

Some information comes from books excised from the Library of Congress listings.

Many of my books were removed from bookstores and destroyed/ 18,000 printed- 15,000 destroyed, in one case.

eg: "A Time For Truth" by William Simon (Nixon's Sec. Treas, Ford's Energy Czar)

Some from sources never in any library, or removed from public libraries

eg: the only copy of Lt Col North's Iran Contra testimony ever autographed by Ollie North.

eg: three volumes of internal campaign memoes from the 1960, 1968, 1972 Nixon Presidential campaigns.
(I worked for the
Committee to Re-Elect the President,
as a part of a dirty tricks campaign,
and burgularized Liberals' files - with on-duty city cops in squad cars as lookouts)

Male- veteran-
Changed sides when Barry Goldwater did*.

*when they kicked him out of the (R) party


This martial law idea has been building, on the right, ever since Nixon's era.

Called for federal government takeover of all state and local agencies and all courts
"...in a National Emergency TYPE situation..."

I suggest you rent and watch
"7 Days In May"
"3 Days of the Condor"
"Manchurian Candidate"
"Wag-The-Dog"
"Moon Over Parador"

To realize many insiders have been trying to warn America before it's too late.

My former associates still 'in the belly of the beast' fear 'crystalnacht' may come as a scripted aftermath of the (tenatively scheduled) July 4 2004 Reichstag fire.
do an internet search for
"Operation Northwoods"


Here is martial law in practice:
>Here are just a few Executive Orders associated with FEMA that would suspend the Constitution and the Bill of Rights. These Executive Orders have been on record for nearly 30 years and could be enacted by the stroke of a Presidential pen:

EXECUTIVE ORDER 10990 allows the government to take over all modes of transportation and control of highways and seaports.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 10995 allows the government to seize and control the communication media.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 10997 allows the government to take over all electrical power, gas, petroleum, fuels and minerals.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 10998 allows the government to take over all food resources and farms.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11000 allows the government to mobilize civilians into work brigades under government supervision.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11001 allows the government to take over all health, education and welfare functions.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11002 designates the Postmaster General to operate a national registration of all persons.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11003 allows the government to take over all airports and aircraft, including commercial aircraft.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11004 allows the Housing and Finance Authority to relocate communities, build new housing with public funds, designate areas to be abandoned, and establish new locations for populations.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11005 allows the government to take over railroads, inland waterways and public storage facilities.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11051 specifies the responsibility of the Office of Emergency Planning and gives authorization to put all Executive Orders into effect in times of increased international tensions and economic or financial crisis.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11310 grants authority to the Department of Justice to enforce the plans set out in Executive Orders, to institute industrial support, to establish judicial and legislative liaison, to control all aliens, to operate penal and correctional institutions, and to advise and assist the President.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11049 assigns emergency preparedness function to federal departments and agencies, consolidating 21 operative Executive Orders issued over a fifteen year period.

EXECUTIVE ORDER 11921 allows the Federal Emergency Preparedness Agency to develop plans to establish control over the mechanisms of production and distribution, of energy sources, wages, salaries, credit and the flow of money in U.S. financial institution in any undefined national emergency. It also provides that when a state of emergency is declared by the President, Congress cannot review the action for six months. The Federal Emergency Management Agency has broad powers in every aspect of the nation.
< http://www.trunkerton.fsnet.co.uk/fema__executive_orders.htm



[Edited 2 times, lastly by shatoga on 11-28-2003]

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-29-2003 04:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Most Americans wouldn't know tyranny even if the men in black ski masks came to the door.

They'd most likely think.."Oh please take my rights away and save me from the big bad boogie woogie man USAma Bin Werewolf".

The founding fathers revolted against much lighter forms of tyranny than what the Bu$h admin has pushed on the American people.

But "Its for your safety".

"They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." - Benjamin Franklin



[Edited 1 times, lastly by Mech on 11-29-2003]

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HatchetML
Trolling for Trolls


NW Florida
174 posts, Apr 2003

posted 11-29-2003 06:34 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for HatchetML     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
For the country's sake lets hope the majority doesnt jump to conclusions such as yourself Mech, Paste us another one its entertaining to see how consumed you are in all of this!

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Mech
Commitees of Correspondence


The Minuteman State
6034 posts, Jun 2001

posted 11-29-2003 08:17 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mech   Visit Mech's Homepage!   Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't find it Entertaining at all.

What WOULD be "Entertaining" is too see all of Bush's cabinet walk out of the White House in Handcuffs for Treason and various violations of Constitutional Amendmendments.

That would make TV MABYE worth watching.

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HatchetML
Trolling for Trolls


NW Florida
174 posts, Apr 2003

posted 11-30-2003 11:32 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for HatchetML     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
4000 post's later and you have only become the one that cries wolf. Diluted to the point, anything of importance you might have to offer is overlooked in the cut and paste waste. Write a book ease your mind, its too easy to just assume, do something of importance if you really think you got it all figured out, im sure there's a place in your future for your to shine like a star for all this you have figured out!

IF not....just cry wolf another 4000 times im sure that will solve all our problems!

Ps...do you get kickbacks for pasteing rense material?

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