posted 06-24-2004 10:10 PM            

Use search for "B61-11"
(here are a couple to start out)
B61-11 Concerns and Background
" ... B61-11 Concerns and Background. Los Alamos Study Group. February 10, 1997. ... Even Before Deployment, the B61-11 Caused Collateral Damage. ... " www.brook.edu/FP/PROJECTS/NUCWCOST/lasg.htm
Bunker-Busting Bomb Prompts US Discord: Upgraded Nuclear ...
" ... The bomb, call the B61-11, is designed to strike command bunkers buried hundreds of meters below the ground and other deeply buried targets. ... " www.brook.edu/fp/projects/nucwcost/bunker.htm
New bomb, no mission
" ... So why is it deploying a new version of the B61 nuclear bomb? ... Meanwhile, the B61-11's lower yields are said to enhance its credibility as a deterrent. ... " www.thebulletin.org/issues/1997/mj97/mj97mello.html

The B61-11 is a 'dial-a-yield' nuke;
Capable of doing as little damage as the 'terrorist' bomb in Indonesia.

So-called "clean bombs" have short radioactive half lives and the property most valued as an asset to the current administration: "deniability".

posted 06-25-2004 06:08 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by snakelady:
What about a Nuclear Meltdown?...anyone notice the huge ufo in the background of the first picture?

---

posted 06-25-2004 10:48 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by David:
This is terrible to view as well but shows a very similar pattern of burns and human destruction following the bombing of Nagasaki and Hiroshima.

http://www.gensuikin.org/english/photo.html

---

I would NOT want to survive if a bomb went off anywhere in my vicinity! David, do you, or anyone else, know of a site that gives information on the after effects of the bomb in Hiroshima. What I’d like to know are stats like how many people died, how the bombing affected the birth rate, the health of that generation and future generations, are there birth defects, what is the state of the environment now, how big of an area was affected by the fallout, do any adverse effects still exist, etc. I would think that studies with this information have been compiled somewhere, but I’m not sure where to look.

posted 06-25-2004 12:07 PM            

That site is rather confusing. Is he stating that the depleted uranium slugs are to blame? Or is he claiming that some sort of low yield nuclear weapon was used? Since the scientific feasibility of pure fusion weapons has yet to be demonstrated, where are the fision products?
http://www.fas.org/nuke/intro/nuke/effects.htm

I have read where the firebombing of Dresden in WWII produced similar effects.

I think I'll file this one under "Very Highly Improbable."

posted 06-25-2004 03:15 PM            

The long term affects on the population from radiation sickness, disfigurement and disabilities are massive. The psycological trauma suffered is equally massive.
---------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------

World War 2 Atomic Bomb
On August 6 and 9, 1945, the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were destroyed by the first atomic bombs used in warfare.

The first atomic bomb ever to be used in a military operation was dropped on the city of Hiroshima, Japan On August 6, 1945 at 8:16:02 a.m. Hiroshima time. The bomb, affectionately named "Little Boy," exploded 1,900 feet above the courtyard of Shima Hospital, with a force equivalent to 12,500 tons of TNT. By the end of 1945, 140,00 people had died as a direct result of the bombing. Within the following five years, another 60,000 would die of bomb-related causes.

The bomb killed men, women, and children indiscriminately. It killed both military personnel and civilians. Although the city produced military items and housed soldiers, it was not selected as a "purely military target" as President Truman had promised. There were six civilians in Hiroshima to every soldier.

The second bomb, called "Fat Man," exploded over Nagasaki, Japan, at 11:02 a.m. on August 9, 1945. It exploded at 1,650 feet with a force of 22,000 tons of TNT. 70,000 people lost their lives in Nagasaki by the end of 1945 due to the bombing. A total of 140,00 died within the next five years.

Hiroshima
During World War II, Hiroshima was a city of considerable military importance. It contained the 2nd Army Headquarters, which commanded the defense of all of southern Japan. The city was a communications center, a storage point, and an assembly area for troops. To quote a Japanese report, "Probably more than a thousand times since the beginning of the war did the Hiroshima citizens see off with cries of 'Banzai' the troops leaving from the harbor."

The center of the city contained a number of reinforced concrete buildings as well as lighter structures. Outside the center, the area was congested by a dense collection of small wooden workshops set among Japanese houses; a few larger industrial plants lay near the outskirts of the city.

The houses were of wooden construction with tile roofs. Many of the industrial buildings also were of wood frame construction. The city as a whole was highly susceptible to fire damage.

Some of the reinforced concrete buildings were of a far stronger construction than is required by normal standards in America, because of the earthquake danger in Japan. This exceptionally strong construction undoubtedly accounted for the fact that the framework of some of the buildings which were fairly close to the center of damage in the city did not collapse.

Another is that the blast was more downward than sideways; this has much to do with the "survival" of the Prefectural Promotional Hall (pictured), which was only a few metres from the aiming point.

The population of Hiroshima had reached a peak of over 380,000 earlier in the war but prior to the atomic bombing the population had steadily decreased because of a systematic evacuation ordered by the Japanese government. At the time of the attack the population was approximately 255,000. This figure is based on the registered population, used by the Japanese in computing ration quantities, and the estimates of additional workers and troops who were brought into the city may not be highly accurate.

Hiroshima was the primary target of the first U.S. nuclear attack mission. The mission went smoothly in every respect. The weather was good, and the crew and equipment functioned perfectly. In every detail, the attack was carried out exactly as planned, and the bomb performed exactly as expected.

The bomb exploded over Hiroshima at 8:15 on the morning of August 6, 1945. About an hour previously, the Japanese early warning radar net had detected the approach of some American aircraft headed for the southern part of Japan. The alert had been given and radio broadcasting stopped in many cities, among them Hiroshima.

The planes approached the coast at a very high altitude. At nearly 8:00 A.M., the radar operator in Hiroshima determined that the number of planes coming in was very small - probably not more than three - and the air raid alert was lifted. The normal radio broadcast warning was given to the people that it might be advisable to go to shelter if B-29's were actually sighted, but no raid was expected beyond some sort of reconnaissance.

At 8:16 A.M., the B-29 Enola Gay dropped the atomic bomb called "Little Boy" over the central part of the city and the bomb exploded with a blast equivalent to 12,000 tons of TNT, killing 80,000 outright.

At the same time, Tokyo control operator of the Japanese Broadcasting Corporation noticed that the Hiroshima station had gone off the air. He tried to use another telephone line to reestablish his program, but it too had failed. About twenty minutes later the Tokyo railroad telegraph center realized that the main line telegraph had stopped working just north of Hiroshima. From some small railway stops within ten miles of the city there came unofficial and confused reports of a terrible explosion in Hiroshima. All these reports were transmitted to the Headquarters of the Japanese General Staff.

Military headquarters repeatedly tried to call the Army Control Station in Hiroshima. The complete silence from that city puzzled the men at Headquarters; they knew that no large enemy raid could have occurred, and they knew that no sizeable store of explosives was in Hiroshima at that time. A young officer of the Japanese General Staff was instructed to fly immediately to Hiroshima, to land, survey the damage, and return to Tokyo with reliable information for the staff. It was generally felt at Headquarters that nothing serious had taken place, that it was all a terrible rumor starting from a few sparks of truth.

The staff officer went to the airport and took off for the southwest. After flying for about three hours, while still nearly 100 miles from Hiroshima, he and his pilot saw a great cloud of smoke from the bomb. In the bright afternoon, the remains of Hiroshima were burning.

Their plane soon reached the city, around which they circled in disbelief. A great scar on the land, still burning, and covered by a heavy cloud of smoke, was all that was left of a great city. They landed south of the city, and the staff officer immediately began to organize relief measures, after reporting to Tokyo.

Tokyo's first knowledge of what had really caused the disaster came from the White House public announcement in Washington, sixteen hours after the nuclear attack on Hiroshima. By the end of 1945, it is estimated that 60,000 more people died due to nuclear fallout sickness. However, this total does not include longer term casualties from radiation exposure.

Starting almost immediately after the conclusion of World War II, and continuing to the present day, the dropping of atomic bombs on the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki has been questioned. Their use has been called barbarian since, besides destroying a military base and a military industrial center, tens of thousands of civilians were killed.

Some have claimed that the Japanese were already essentially defeated, and that use of the bombs was unnecessary. Some have also suggested that a demonstration of an atomic bomb in an uninhabited region should have been attempted.

In reply, defenders of the decision to use the bombs say that it is almost certain that the Japanese would not have surrendered without their use, and that hundreds of thousands - perhaps millions - would have perished in the planned U.S. invasion of Japan.

To support their argument, they point out that the Japanese agreed to surrender only after the second bomb was dropped, when it was evident that the first was not an isolated event, and future prospects were for a continuing rain of such bombs. Actually, the U.S. did not have another atomic bomb ready after the bombing of Nagasaki due the difficulty of producing fissile material. Regarding the suggestion of a demonstration, they maintain that, given the mind-set of the Japanese at the time, it is unlikely that any conceivable benign demonstration would have induced surrender.

Others contend that Japan had been trying to surrender for at least two months, but the US refused by insisting on an unconditional surrender—which they did not get even after the bombing, the bone of contention being retention of the Emperor.

Tens of thousands of people marked the 40th anniversary of the atomic bombing of the city on August 6, 1985.

Nagasaki
The city of Nagasaki had been one of the largest sea ports in southern Japan and was of great war-time importance because of its many and varied industries, including the production of ordnance, ships, military equipment, and other war materials. The narrow long strip attacked was of particular importance because of its industries.

In contrast to many modern aspects of Nagasaki, the residences almost without exception were of flimsy, typical Japanese construction, consisting of wood or wood-frame buildings, with wood walls with or without plaster, and tile roofs. Many of the smaller industries and business establishments were also housed in wooden buildings or flimsily built masonry buildings.

Nagasaki had been permitted to grow for many years without conforming to any definite city zoning plan and therefore residences were constructed adjacent to factory buildings and to each other almost as close as it was possible to build them throughout the entire industrial valley.

Nagasaki had never been subjected to large scale bombing prior to the explosion of a nuclear weapon there. On August 1st, 1945, however, a number of high explosive bombs were dropped on the city. A few of these bombs hit in the shipyards and dock areas in the southwest portion of the city. Several of the bombs hit the Mitsubishi Steel and Arms Works and six bombs landed at the Nagasaki Medical School and Hospital, with three direct hits on buildings there.

While the damage from these few bombs were relatively small, it created considerable concern in Nagasaki and a number of people, principally school children, were evacuated to rural areas for safety, thus reducing the population in the city at the time of the nuclear attack.

At 11:02 am on August 9, 1945, the American B-29 Superfortress "Bockscar," in search of the shipyards, instead spotted the Mitsubishi Arms Works through a break in the clouds. On this target, it dropped the nuclear bomb Fat Man, the second nuclear weapon to be detonated over Japan. Even though the "Fat Man" missed by over a mile and a half, it still leveled nearly half the city. 75,000 of Nagasaki's 240,000 residents were killed, followed by the death of at least as many from resulting sickness and injury.

However another report issues a different residental number, speaking of Nagasaki's population which dropped in one split-second from 422,000 to 383,000, thus 39,000 were killed, over 25,000 were injured.

If taken into account those who died from radioactive materials causing cancer, the total number of casualties is to be believed at least 100,000 killed residents. Estimates from physicists who have studied each atomic explosion state that the bomb that was used had utilized only 1/10th of 1 percent of their respective explosive capabilities.

The city was rebuilt after the war, albeit dramatically changed, as any city would be after such colossal damage. New temples were built, and new churches as well, since the Christian presence never died out and even increased dramatically in numbers after the war.

Some of the rubble was left as a memorial, like the one-legged torii gate and a stone arch near ground zero. New structures were also raised as memorials, such as the Atomic Bomb Museum. Nagasaki remains first and foremost a port city, supporting a rich shipping industry and setting a strong example of perseverance and peace.

posted 06-25-2004 04:50 PM            

Bernard Eastlund, Inventor of HAARP (High Frequency Active AURORAL Research program), from his Patent # 4,686,605 “...By altering solar absorption...weather modification is possible... for example, altering upper atmosphere wind patterns by constructing one or more plumes of atmospheric particles which will act as a lens or focusing device...A moving plume could also serve as a means for focusing a vast amount of sunlight on selected portions of the Earth...Still further, plumes in accordance with the present invention can be formed to simulate and/or perform the same functions as performed by detonation of a “Heave” type nuclear device without actually having to detonate such a device...”

Some believe saddam set the oil wells on fire during gw1 to defeat the CT tech....I am of that school...thankfully saddam is not as dumb as he loox...he knew and the satellite imagery from gw1 is very revealing....There is some excellent info in these posts thanks David, & Shatoga...and of course that blue eyed siren too....

posted 06-25-2004 06:35 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by billder:
for example, altering upper atmosphere wind patterns by constructing one or more plumes of atmospheric particles which will act as a lens or focusing device...A moving plume could also serve as a means for focusing a vast amount of sunlight on selected portions of the Earth..

---

Do you have the faintest idea how lenses work?

posted 06-25-2004 06:41 PM            

Furthermore, it what he is suggesting is true, then the entire body would be consumed, instead what you have is a number of pictures of body parts. conventional explosives do a pretty good job at dismembering people also.

posted 06-25-2004 07:50 PM            

Since we have nuke capabilities without the need for radiation materials through HAARP, why are they keeping nuclear energy around? So we can further pollute our planet, our water supply, and ourselves? I don’t get it! There are skeptics out there that will argue that hot fusion is the only way to create massive amounts of energy. That’s bullcrap!! There is nothing clean, efficient, or stable about hot fusion. These same skeptics will also argue that cold fusion does not work. Another crock of bull. Hundreds of reports prove it does! I’m not saying we could hook it up tomorrow, but with proper funding, it would certainly be a reality in the not too distant future. Watch the documentary: Cold Fusion – Fire From Water or read online at Infinite Energy Magazine or New Energy Times and prove it to yourself. Just like everything else that is efficient and environmentally safe, it’s suppressed! And this has been going on for 15 years now! Boy this subject irks me – can you tell? ha!

If anyone has been following developments in cold fusion, you’ll know of the recent MURDER (on May 14, 2004) of Eugene Mallove, top spokesperson in the field. An ironic string of events followed up to that man’s death. At Mallove’s prompting, the Department of Energy agreed in February 2004 to perform a review of the cold fusion theory and to release its findings by January 2005. UK based magazine New Scientist released the news of the DOEs review in it’s March 2004 issue. In April 2004, US based magazine Physics Today released the same news. Then in May, the man was murdered?! Isn’t THAT ironic? I just hope this field does not turn out to be like the field of microbiology!

quote:

---

Originally posted by billder:
... And what does it amount to? said Satan, with his evil chuckle. Nothing at all. You gain nothing: you always come out where you went in. For a million years the race has gone on monotonously propagating itself and monotonously re-performing this dull nonsense to what end? No wisdom can guess! Who gets a profit out of it? Nobody but a parcel of usurping little monarchs and nobilities who despise you; would feel defiled if you touched them; would shut the door in your face if you proposed to call; whom you slave for, fight for, die for, and are not ashamed of it, but proud; whose existence is a perpetual insult to you and you are afraid to resent it; who are mendicants supported by your alms, yet assume toward you the airs of benefactor toward beggar; who address you in the language of master toward slave, and are answered in the language of slave toward master; who are worshipped by you with your mouth, while in your heart if you have one you despise yourselves for it. The First man was a hypocrite and a coward, qualities which have not failed yet in his line; it is the foundation upon which all civilizations have been built.... Uncle Sam Clemens

---

posted 06-25-2004 08:04 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by JerseyBluEyz:
Wow! All those innocents killed

---

Yeah, too bad they were wearing Iraqii uniforms.

I'll bet that some of the pictures of the aftermath of some of the roadside bombs against American troops look the the same.

posted 06-25-2004 08:07 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by JerseyBluEyz:

Since we have nuke capabilities without the need for radiation materials through HAARP, why are they keeping nuclear energy around?

---

I just wanted to preserve this little tidbit.

Just how do we have "nuke capabilites" through HAARP?

How can HAARP provide electrical power?

posted 06-25-2004 08:19 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wolf_Larson:
Yeah, too bad they were wearing Iraqii uniforms.

---

posted 06-25-2004 08:21 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Wolf_Larson:
How can HAARP provide electrical power?

---

Did I say that it could? You'd better read my words again before you pat yourself on the back!

posted 06-25-2004 08:34 PM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by JerseyBluEyz:
Did I say that it could? You'd better read my words again before you pat yourself on the back!

[Edited 2 times, lastly by JerseyBluEyz on 06-25-2004]

---

quote:

---

Since we have nuke capabilities without the need for radiation materials through HAARP, why are they keeping nuclear energy around? So we can further pollute our planet, our water supply, and ourselves? I don’t get it!

---

Your implication is clear. You postulate that HAARP is an alternative to nuclear energy. How?

You link HAARP to cold fusion. How?

posted 06-25-2004 08:47 PM            

Here is the sentence as it SHOULD read:

posted 06-25-2004 11:29 PM            

Those are not shadows at all.

Whatever blew those people into pieces I cannot say exactly but the so called "shadows" are dried body fluids. I know this because I was present durning a car bombing that ripped 42+ people into shreds that were in worse shape than those guys. The pictures I have of the aftermath of the car bomb show these same "shadows".

Keep in mind that I do not deny that the military may have used experimental weapons but I think that Nukes, even low grade are out of the question. I doubt nuclear weapons could have been used without any mention of it before now.

posted 06-26-2004 12:16 AM            

quote:

---

Originally posted by Bhang:

Keep in mind that I do not deny that the military may have used experimental weapons during the invasion of Iraq but I think that Nukes, even low grade are out of the question. I mean after we took the country the troops had to live here and I know of no one getting sick from radiation poisoning, 'just' depleated uranium posioning. I doubt nuclear weapons could have been used without any mention of it before now.

---

Not to argue, but since people seem to not visit links:

Remember the photos of the "bunker buster" bombs being parachute dropped in Afghanistan?

quote:

---

Increasingly, U.S. nuclear strategists speak of holding targets at risk in "rogue states."

The B61-7, from which the B61-11 is made, has a selectable yield ranging from 0.3 to about 340 kilotons. It was first placed in service in 1985. (The original B61 entered the stockpile in 1968.)

According to Chuck Hansen, one of the nation's leading independent authorities on the U.S. nuclear stockpile, the B61-7 can be fuzed for air or surface bursts, and it has "a hardened ground-penetrator nose" with a retarded contact-burst fuzing option. It can be dropped with or without a parachute.

In recent years, some military strategists have advocated deployment and possible use of very small tactical nuclear weapons against Third World adversaries, especially in earth-penetrating roles.

The existence of such weapons--weapons whose power is effective but not abhorrent--might very well serve to deter a tyrant who believes that American emphasis on proportionality would prevent the employment of the current U.S. arsenal against him.

"We doubt that any president would authorize the use of the nuclear weapons in our present arsenal against Third World nations. It is precisely this doubt that leads us to argue for the development of subkiloton weapons."

And in July 1992, Los Alamos conducted a high-level briefing called "Potential Uses for Low-Yield Nuclear Weapons in the New World Order." One theme of the briefing was that in future showdowns with Third World states, "we need options besides defeat or use of inappropriately large [nuclear] weapons."
One option, suggested the briefing, was to develop and deploy "micronukes" with a yield of some 10 tons of high explosives; "mininukes" with a yield of 100 tons; and "tinynukes" with a yield of 1,000 tons.

An earth-penetrator with a yield of just 10 tons could, according to a Los Alamos viewgraph, "hold buried leadership and C3 at risk." And it could do that while keeping "collateral damage very localized."

---

{anyone paying attention? US policymakers planned to use subkiloton nukes LIKE THE B61
even back during the days of New World Order advocate George HW Bush)

quote:

---

The B61-11, which can be carried by a B-2, can produce explosions ranging from 300 tons of TNT to more than 300,000 tons, and therefore could be more appropriate for use against targets like Tarhunah, Libya, according to Bruce Hall of the international environmental group Greenpeace. According to U.S. officials, Tarhunah was the site of an underground Libyan chemical weapon plant under construction until late last year.

Bolstering the view that B61-11 was developed for non-nuclear targets are documents obtained from the Department of Energy under the Freedom of Information Act, Hall said Feb. 14 from his office here. These include a Dec. 18, 1995, letter from Thomas Seitz, acting deputy assistant secretary of energy for military application and stockpile support, to Harold Smith, then assistant to the defense secretary for atomic energy.

In this letter, Seitz said Energy Department officials were accelerating production of the B61-11 conversion kits to provide them "as soon as possible." Hall said the call for an accelerated schedule points to the U.S. officials considering its use against Tarhunah.

---

Nobody else remembers the hype about Saddam's underground command bunkers?

IMWIO
They have been using the B61 as planned.

A sub kiloton dial a yield nuke with low residual radiation, so they can claim it was just hundreds of tons of tnt, instead of what the pictures clearly showed:
mini-nukes.

more excerpts about bunker busters like the B61: http://www.ambiguous.org/robin/commentary/buster.html

quote:

---

This, surely, is a nuclear weapon, beyond dispute. We have it. We have plenty of nuclear weapons, of course. But this one has already been considered for use, in the late 90s, against Libya and against Iraq--in a chillingly offhand way that seems to have gone unnoticed by anyone at all except the government of Russia.

---

OK, don't take my word for it: http://southmovement.alphalink.com.au/southnews/Jan23update.htm

quote:

---

Pentagon contemplating nukes against Iraq
The Pentagon refused to rule out using nuclear weapons against Iraq. But has said that air strikes against Iraq would be massive and sustained.
Asked whether that might include the use of nuclear weapons, Pentagon's chief spokesman said Tuesday. Bacon replied: "I don't think we've ruled anything in or out in this regard.'' But NBC News reported Wednesday that,"So-called bunker-buster bombs would be used to penetrate deep underground to take out hidden weapons, supplies and possibly his (Iraqi) top military commanders."

President Clinton's new nuclear-war guidelines expand the criteria for using nuclear weapons and adding new targets. Chief among the new targets are the rogue states. The directive orders the Pentagon to plan for attacks against countries that use weapons of mass destruction. It even identifies specific nuclear contingencies involving non-nuclear countries such as Iran, Iraq, Libya and North Korea.

The Pentagon's vision is that planning for nuclear war with the Third World is necessary to deter rogue states from using chemical and biological weapons. Threatening nuclear destruction, the argument goes, is the only language regional troublemakers understand.

---

posted 06-26-2004 12:56 PM            

...for example, altering upper atmosphere wind patterns by constructing one or more plumes of atmospheric particles which will act as a lens or focusing device...A moving plume could also serve as a means for focusing a vast amount of sunlight on selected portions of the Earth...Still further, plumes in accordance with the present invention can be formed to simulate and/or perform the same functions as performed by detonation of a “Heave” type nuclear device without actually having to detonate such a device...”
Bernard Eastlund, Inventor of HAARP (High Frequency Active AURORAL Research program), from his Patent # 4,686,605